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Thread started 10/21/20 2:52am

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

does anyone else prefer bootlegs to official releases?

i realise this might be weird

and i love hearing all my dreams in perfect sound

might also just be that i am use to these songs in bootleg form

eg - the ball was always faster on my bootlegs, same for witness (version 2), and i preferred it like that tbh

but the prob with official releases is that i expect more, and if it doesnt meet that, then its dissapointing. with bootlegs i am more forgiving.

i cant lie, there is also something more fun and mysterious about bootlegs than having something officially released.

maybe its just that it gives it a different context, youre listening to something you werent meant to, that someone didnt want you to hear.

now, with official releases, its just out there. and you have to evaluate it more fairly as a result. its a different context.

im glad these songs are out there now, but it does take the 'hunting' aspect out of it!

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Reply #1 posted 10/21/20 3:35am

Revolution81

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-

Whats the difference? Dubious sources, tinkered with tracks, weird track selections, dodgy artwork, wrong speeds/tempo..."frankenstein"...

Warners is just a glorified eye records

Michael Howe is just a glorified Lovesigne. They both even have an unneccesary "E" at the end of their name

What's the use in half a story, half a dream
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Reply #2 posted 10/21/20 5:06am

OperatingTheta
n

I've definitely prefered some of the production and mixes on certain bootlegs because it sounds authentically Prince, as opposed to the mixing values of Bolas, who tends to drench Prince's vocals in unnecessary reverb. This is most noticeable on 'Originals'.

Also, I would prefer to hear the development and various mixes of songs as recorded, not butchered composites of various takes that Prince never assembled. The circulating bootlegs of '100MPH' for example, are superior to the Estate's release.
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Reply #3 posted 10/21/20 6:46am

Se7en

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OperatingThetan said:

I've definitely prefered some of the production and mixes on certain bootlegs because it sounds authentically Prince, as opposed to the mixing values of Bolas, who tends to drench Prince's vocals in unnecessary reverb. This is most noticeable on 'Originals'. Also, I would prefer to hear the development and various mixes of songs as recorded, not butchered composites of various takes that Prince never assembled. The circulating bootlegs of '100MPH' for example, are superior to the Estate's release.


Does adding reverb help to conceal source audio problems?

In the case of bootlegs vs. official releases . . . one example stands out to me from last year and that is If It'll Make U Happy. The bootleg version is waaayyy better than the version on 1999:SDE. Too much reverb on the official version! Maybe if I had never heard the bootleg, the official one wouldn't bother me so much.

On a recent bootleg, last year or so, I heard different versions of Sister in various stages of development. THAT kind of stuff is great to hear!

While I don't want to scrape the bottom of the barrel like The Beatles did with their Anthology, I wouldn't mind hearing a few of these early drafts come to light.

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Reply #4 posted 10/21/20 7:04am

RJOrion

i never heard or had a "bootleg" Prince record/tape ..isnt that stealing from Prince?

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Reply #5 posted 10/21/20 7:51am

ufoclub

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Se7en said:


While I don't want to scrape the bottom of the barrel like The Beatles did with their Anthology, I wouldn't mind hearing a few of these early drafts come to light.

Bottom of the barrel on Anthology? Whut?

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Reply #6 posted 10/21/20 10:08am

luv4u

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Both

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Reply #7 posted 10/21/20 10:13am

RJOrion

theives in the temple for REAL

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Reply #8 posted 10/21/20 10:52am

KoolEaze

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No, not really but there are some bootlegs that I listen to much more often than official releases, for instance the Noon Rendezvous/Neon Rendezvous bootleg, and some bootlegs may not sound crystal clear but have a deeper bass than the released versions. I´m sure that if one day we get a legit release of Can´t Stop/We Can Funk/Girl of my Dreams it will probably sound much thinner than the bootleg I´ve gotten used to.

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"
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Reply #9 posted 10/21/20 2:01pm

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

RJOrion said:

i never heard or had a "bootleg" Prince record/tape ..isnt that stealing from Prince?



Goody goody. :p
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Reply #10 posted 10/21/20 2:16pm

SantanaMaitrey
a

The "hallway speech" version of Computer Blue sounded better on my old Sabotage bootleg than it did on PR Deluxe. I haven't really compared the songs on SOTT Deluxe to the bootleg CDs, but I have a feeling that the old boots would still sound pretty good.
O tempora! O mores!
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Reply #11 posted 10/21/20 2:42pm

udo

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Revolution81 said:

-

Whats the difference? Dubious sources, tinkered with tracks, weird track selections, dodgy artwork, wrong speeds/tempo..."frankenstein"...

Warners is just a glorified eye records

Michael Howe is just a glorified Lovesigne. They both even have an unneccesary "E" at the end of their name

.

lol

But yes, there's some truth here.

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #12 posted 10/21/20 11:38pm

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

Revolution81 said:

-


Whats the difference? Dubious sources, tinkered with tracks, weird track selections, dodgy artwork, wrong speeds/tempo..."frankenstein"...


Warners is just a glorified eye records


Michael Howe is just a glorified Lovesigne. They both even have an unneccesary "E" at the end of their name



biggrin

I wonder if the fact it's on warners after everything that happened might mean just a little less care is taken
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Reply #13 posted 10/22/20 10:17am

lust

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The moment a previously bootlegged track gets an offical release, two things happen.

1) We (generally) get the far superior sound that we’ve always wanted.

2) The legacy and magic of the underground catalog is chipped away at. At some point we’ll no longer be able to bore people with tales of having more unreleased studio songs that most artists have ever released and then telling them that some of it is actually his best work. Instead, they can stream it for free on Spotify.


I’m so pleased that we now have Wally (even though it is not THE version) but was the mystique of never having heard it and knowing that we likely never would of even more value to the Prince Canon?

Would I change it and not have them release it? No. But we are losing something.
[Edited 10/22/20 10:21am]
If the milk turns out to be sour, I aint the kinda pussy to drink it!
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Reply #14 posted 10/22/20 10:39am

Mindbells9

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Sometimes. For example, I prefer my Sabotage audience recording of "One Nite Alone In Chicago" from March 3rd, 2002 than any of the official ONA Live releases.
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Reply #15 posted 10/22/20 11:11am

KoolEaze

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lust said:

The moment a previously bootlegged track gets an offical release, two things happen. 1) We (generally) get the far superior sound that we’ve always wanted. 2) The legacy and magic of the underground catalog is chipped away at. At some point we’ll no longer be able to bore people with tales of having more unreleased studio songs that most artists have ever released and then telling them that some of it is actually his best work. Instead, they can stream it for free on Spotify. I’m so pleased that we now have Wally (even though it is not THE version) but was the mystique of never having heard it and knowing that we likely never would of even more value to the Prince Canon? Would I change it and not have them release it? No. But we are losing something. [Edited 10/22/20 10:21am]

Makes sense but in this day and age of streaming and downloads, especially illegal downloads, official releases mean very little anyway. I know many die-hard Prince fans who used to buy every official release and even they stopped caring and stopped buying legit releases so I don´t really care about having exclusive or almost mystic unreleased stuff.....just let the estate release as much as they can and let´s buy it and listen to it while we´re still here on earth, because frankly, I´m not so sure how long we´ll be able to be here and buy music and listen to it.

And I must admit that even though I still buy almost any new release, I doubt that I will really care that much about some obscure releases such as an unreleased Vanity 6 or The Family song ten years from now, so I for one am glad that they´re releasing lots of music in comparatively short time.

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"
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Reply #16 posted 10/22/20 11:19am

RJOrion

i'd prefer not stealing from another Black Man

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Reply #17 posted 10/22/20 11:42am

lust

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RJOrion said:

i'd prefer not stealing from another Black Man




These super deluxe releases are such a head buster even when you’ve heard a good portion of the vault tracks already. It must be even more mind blowing hearing all of it for the first time. Gotta tell ya. I’m a little jealous.
If the milk turns out to be sour, I aint the kinda pussy to drink it!
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Reply #18 posted 10/22/20 1:52pm

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

RJOrion said:

i'd prefer not stealing from another Black Man



You think prince never watched/heard/bought any Hendrix or James brown bootlegs?

Please.
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Reply #19 posted 10/22/20 2:28pm

RJOrion

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

RJOrion said:

i'd prefer not stealing from another Black Man



You think prince never watched/heard/bought any Hendrix or James brown bootlegs?

Please.



so what...if Prince jumped off of Grafitti Bridge, does that mean i have to?...stealing is stealing... i dont steal from my people
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Reply #20 posted 10/22/20 2:45pm

lust

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RJOrion said:

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:



You think prince never watched/heard/bought any Hendrix or James brown bootlegs?

Please.



so what...if Prince jumped off of Grafitti Bridge, does that mean i have to?...stealing is stealing... i dont steal from my people


For clarity, do you steal from people that you don’t consider to be “my people”?
If the milk turns out to be sour, I aint the kinda pussy to drink it!
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Reply #21 posted 10/22/20 3:00pm

RJOrion

lust said:

RJOrion said:




so what...if Prince jumped off of Grafitti Bridge, does that mean i have to?...stealing is stealing... i dont steal from my people


For clarity, do you steal from people that you don’t consider to be “my people”?


i dont steal... and if i did endeavor to partake in larcenous activities, i damn sure wouldnt be trying to steal from Prince Nelson. Or anybody else i consider "my people".
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Reply #22 posted 10/22/20 3:15pm

lust

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RJOrion said:

lust said:



For clarity, do you steal from people that you don’t consider to be “my people”?


i dont steal... and if i did endeavor to partake in larcenous activities, i damn sure wouldnt be trying to steal from Prince Nelson. Or anybody else i consider "my people".


Good to hear. So to my earlier comment. Is it a major head buster hearing all these previously circulating tacks for the first time? You’re getting twice as much fun as the rest of us.
If the milk turns out to be sour, I aint the kinda pussy to drink it!
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Reply #23 posted 10/22/20 3:31pm

RJOrion

lust said:

RJOrion said:



i dont steal... and if i did endeavor to partake in larcenous activities, i damn sure wouldnt be trying to steal from Prince Nelson. Or anybody else i consider "my people".


Good to hear. So to my earlier comment. Is it a major head buster hearing all these previously circulating tacks for the first time? You’re getting twice as much fun as the rest of us.



yes, excuse my pulpit persona please..."Blanche", "Witness 4 The Prosecution", "Four", "Walking In Glory", "And That Says What", the reggae joint, "Theres Something I Like About Being Your Fool", "7MinutesMoQuake", etc...all that stuff is mind blowing to me... this is by far the best Prince album release experience ive ever had over his entire career...AND i went on a Paisley Park Tour a couple weeks ago, and i got to pull up to the gate blasting Blanche, like a giddy groupie. Good Times. Best. Album. Ever...Better than 1987
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Reply #24 posted 10/22/20 3:36pm

lust

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RJOrion said:

lust said:



Good to hear. So to my earlier comment. Is it a major head buster hearing all these previously circulating tacks for the first time? You’re getting twice as much fun as the rest of us.



yes, excuse my pulpit persona please..."Blanche", "Witness 4 The Prosecution", "Four", "Walking In Glory", "And That Says What", the reggae joint, "Theres Something I Like About Being Your Fool", "7MinutesMoQuake", etc...all that stuff is mind blowing to me... this is by far the best Prince album release experience ive ever had over his entire career...AND i went on a Paisley Park Tour a couple weeks ago, and i got to pull up to the gate blasting Blanche, like a giddy groupie. Good Times. Best. Album. Ever...Better than 1987


heart
If the milk turns out to be sour, I aint the kinda pussy to drink it!
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Reply #25 posted 10/22/20 3:53pm

ForceofNature

Official releases all the way for me when applicable. I just consider bootlegs in some cases the only way to hear certain songs, but the audiophile in me sometimes has difficulty enjoying cassette rips of a copy of a copy with noise reduction applied and treble boosting up the ying-yang.
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Reply #26 posted 10/22/20 5:42pm

KoolEaze

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RJOrion said:

lust said:
For clarity, do you steal from people that you don’t consider to be “my people”?
i dont steal... and if i did endeavor to partake in larcenous activities, i damn sure wouldnt be trying to steal from Prince Nelson. Or anybody else i consider "my people".

Legally speaking , bootleg material will probably always be stolen material but these days I see it as a part of presering his legacy and body of work, plus it´s good for posterity. I see the bootleg and "elite trader" scene as a positive factor, a second archive so to speak, and those guys are like archivists, in a way protecting the songs.

I´m happy with the Super Deluxe Editions the estate and Mr.Howe put together but imagine if that was all we knew of Prince´s music. Would it really suffice?

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"
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Reply #27 posted 10/22/20 7:47pm

udo

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b00tlegs occur more often, offer different material, offer material sooner.

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #28 posted 10/22/20 10:22pm

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

RJOrion said:

lust said:



For clarity, do you steal from people that you don’t consider to be “my people”?


i dont steal... and if i did endeavor to partake in larcenous activities, i damn sure wouldnt be trying to steal from Prince Nelson. Or anybody else i consider "my people".


Depends what you mean by steal.
Bootlegs nourished and fed the myth of prince as prolific genius.
Releasing an album a year wasnt unique to prince.
Having a vault of so many unreleased songs was.
But without bootleggers who would believe it?
So they might have made a bit of money but arguably they did him a huge service in publicity and myth making. The kind of stuff you cant really put a price on. Or couldn't, until now, when those songs are being officially released.
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Reply #29 posted 10/22/20 11:10pm

ForceofNature

Boots will always be an essential part of getting into Prince's musical world because not everything will be offiicially released. However I do perfer any official souce of audio whenever it is out

[Edited 10/22/20 23:13pm]

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