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Reply #150 posted 10/23/20 1:49pm

RJOrion

lrn36 said:

jaawwnn said:

Two negatives make a positive right? Rap can be art, just like pop can be art. Cool, cool. Good thread.

Rap goes all the way back.

https://www.youtube.com/w...gvCCWcR5dM

https://www.youtube.com/w...UAzLpG8sf8

https://www.youtube.com/w...RS62nccwmw

https://www.youtube.com/w...jlhzf_84JM

word...and it goes back even further than that...WAY further...to Africa and the Middle East.

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Reply #151 posted 10/23/20 3:23pm

JudasLChrist

avatar

thebanishedone said:

During the whole decade of the 80's Prince was redefining musical landscapes

without any fear he was pushing the enveloupe.

But starting with the 1991 Diamonds And Pearls Prince incorporated rap into his sound

and overall dumbed his sound to make it safe.I think we can agree

that Diamonds And Pearls is Prince at his safest ,a far cry from the 1980-1988 daring artist.

Why Prince start with compromises when it comes to his music?

Was it being disillusion with his own vision?

Getting scared from the new sounds coming from the streets that he couldn't relate to?

Financial loss from commercial flops of his projects or something else?


Prince didn't make money from the Lovesexy Tour. Batman gave him the cash infusion he probably was expecting from Lovesexy, and then Graffitti Bridge was a flop while Paisley Park was bleeding cash. I don't know why Prince did the things he did, but I think one can surmise that he felt he needed money, and needed to get on the mains stream charts to keep his relevance.

Honestly. I think he would have avoided the mainstream slump in America if he had just toured Sigh of the Times in the U.S.

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Reply #152 posted 10/23/20 3:53pm

Margot

BanishedBrian said:

Margot said:

Oh, my.

.

Which part is inaccurate?

I agree with you..."Oh, my" was directed @ Prince's actions

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Reply #153 posted 10/23/20 4:10pm

Margot

I think gradual conservatism comes naturally with age, life events, increased assets and 'overhead'.

He had PP, musicians, engineers, additional homes, Larry, JW's, wives, death of a child, other costly projects, etc...each will take a bite from your creativity.

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Reply #154 posted 10/23/20 5:45pm

Polo1026

Vannormal said:

Polo1026 said:

Incorporating Rap means you've compromised your art?

Is Rap NOT art?

-

No no no.

remeber the interview with Susan Rogers ?

There she said it exactly the way it was. Rap was 'it'. The new thing.

And Prince knew somhow he was going to be overtaken by this other new movement that was not his own.

In a way it manifested itself through the new youngsters with a new street attitude and a new street sound, while Prince changed his street credibity for stardom.

Th)t kinda rap he incorporated was indeed a compromise,and yes it remains art.

But not the kind of art that came from his guts, from his deapest soul and rudeness he knew before.

He started to 'copy' a style. The guy basically was uptil then a innovator.

-

Rap IS art. I have loads of damn good rap albums, Prince would never ever be able to make.

Like Bob Dylan never would be able to make a funk album like 1999.

-

GREAT Rap is ART!

So would an ARTIST be compromising his ART to try expressing it through another artistic expression?

NO!

There would be nothing wrong with Dylan trying a funk album should he feel it was a vehicle to express something he wanted to convey to an audience.

Whether or not Prince was good at rap is irrelevant. An artist has license to try and express themselves through any ART available to them.

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Reply #155 posted 10/23/20 5:50pm

heartpeaceshea
rt

You peeps really should check out "The Art of Rap" documentary that featured Ice T.

Polo1026 said:



Vannormal said:




Polo1026 said:




Incorporating Rap means you've compromised your art?



Is Rap NOT art?



-


No no no.


remeber the interview with Susan Rogers ?


There she said it exactly the way it was. Rap was 'it'. The new thing.


And Prince knew somhow he was going to be overtaken by this other new movement that was not his own.


In a way it manifested itself through the new youngsters with a new street attitude and a new street sound, while Prince changed his street credibity for stardom.


Th)t kinda rap he incorporated was indeed a compromise,and yes it remains art.


But not the kind of art that came from his guts, from his deapest soul and rudeness he knew before.


He started to 'copy' a style. The guy basically was uptil then a innovator.


-


Rap IS art. I have loads of damn good rap albums, Prince would never ever be able to make.


Like Bob Dylan never would be able to make a funk album like 1999.


-




GREAT Rap is ART!



So would an ARTIST be compromising his ART to try expressing it through another artistic expression?


NO!



There would be nothing wrong with Dylan trying a funk album should he feel it was a vehicle to express something he wanted to convey to an audience.



Whether or not Prince was good at rap is irrelevant. An artist has license to try and express themselves through any ART available to them.


[Edited 10/23/20 17:53pm]
[Edited 10/23/20 19:38pm]
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Reply #156 posted 10/23/20 6:30pm

heartpeaceshea
rt

rednblue said:



heartpeacesheart said:


I am not sure anyone is paying attention to how many questions are within the topics below but it could be that I haven't approached responding to that topic in that way either. thebanishedone said:

During the whole decade of the 80's Prince was redefining musical landscapes


without any fear he was pushing the enveloupe.


But starting with the 1991 Diamonds And Pearls Prince incorporated rap into his sound


and overall dumbed his sound to make it safe.I think we can agree


that Diamonds And Pearls is Prince at his safest ,a far cry from the 1980-1988 daring artist.


Why Prince start with compromises when it comes to his music?


Was it being disillusion with his own vision?


Getting scared from the new sounds coming from the streets that he couldn't relate to?


Financial loss from commercial flops of his projects or something else?





Thanks, heartpeacesheart.

Don't know how often Prince may have been disillusioned.

Can say that he seemed very restless...that is to say he had so many amazing ideas, and wanted to keep moving and get those ideas out. biggrin



You're welcome I guess. I think overall as an artist Prince was viewed through so many lenses throughout his career that the crazy little bits about him that made him so great in my opinion are what become lost. For example, speaking of the Diamonds and Pearls "era". Prince always managed to push the envelope, yes, (remember the butt out pants performance?) To me I'd describe it as him simply "showing his ass" performance wise. That's about as fearless as one could get! Then came the "backlash", hence a reason to write slave on his face. Commercially he was always his own commercial. So called fear from pushing the envelope just meant he probably knew what talents he possessed that he may have rather wished to win awards for. A holographic show with him is starting to sound really good right about now.
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Reply #157 posted 10/23/20 7:35pm

heartpeaceshea
rt

Alright, I stand behind my previous responses but I have to say my answer to the question "What made Prince compromise his art?" had to have been the inability to canvas.

falloff
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Reply #158 posted 10/23/20 11:31pm

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

Margot said:

I think gradual conservatism comes naturally with age, life events, increased assets and 'overhead'.


He had PP, musicians, engineers, additional homes, Larry, JW's, wives, death of a child, other costly projects, etc...each will take a bite from your creativity.





Yep
Also some ppl think getting married and having kids etc would make someone lose their drive but clearly even having lots of new girlfriends didnt necessarily fire up his creativity either.
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Reply #159 posted 10/23/20 11:51pm

JudasLChrist

avatar

Margot said:

I think gradual conservatism comes naturally with age, life events, increased assets and 'overhead'.

He had PP, musicians, engineers, additional homes, Larry, JW's, wives, death of a child, other costly projects, etc...each will take a bite from your creativity.


I'm more radical than I have ever been.

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Reply #160 posted 10/24/20 12:56am

Vannormal

avatar

heartpeacesheart said:

You peeps really should check out "The Art of Rap" documentary that featured Ice T.
Polo1026 said:

GREAT Rap is ART!

So would an ARTIST be compromising his ART to try expressing it through another artistic expression?

NO!

There would be nothing wrong with Dylan trying a funk album should he feel it was a vehicle to express something he wanted to convey to an audience.

Whether or not Prince was good at rap is irrelevant. An artist has license to try and express themselves through any ART available to them.

-

@heartpeacesheart :

Exactly.

-

@Polo1026:

Sure Bob can do whatever he wants. I'll be the first to listen to it.

Sure every artist can try whatever style.

Sure that Prince's rap being good or bad is irrelevant.

I'd like to be the judge of when it feels compromising or not (to me).

It's a personal humble opinion, just like all my opinions.

Peace though. smile

-

"...no matter what, all will be fine, always."
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Reply #161 posted 10/24/20 2:36am

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

JudasLChrist said:



Margot said:


I think gradual conservatism comes naturally with age, life events, increased assets and 'overhead'.


He had PP, musicians, engineers, additional homes, Larry, JW's, wives, death of a child, other costly projects, etc...each will take a bite from your creativity.






I'm more radical than I have ever been.



Politically he got more radical but musically,nope.
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Reply #162 posted 10/24/20 10:29am

JudasLChrist

avatar

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

JudasLChrist said:


I'm more radical than I have ever been.

Politically he got more radical but musically,nope.



Prince became a full on social conservative for a minute. And he used to give large amounts of money to Minnesota's Republican Senator back in the 90s.

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Reply #163 posted 10/24/20 11:45am

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

Also became more traditionally afro centric and a patriarch.
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Reply #164 posted 10/24/20 12:22pm

heartpeaceshea
rt

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

Also became more traditionally afro centric and a patriarch.


No that doesn't happen until 2013
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Reply #165 posted 10/24/20 12:22pm

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

heartpeacesheart said:

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

Also became more traditionally afro centric and a patriarch.


No that doesn't happen until 2013


2001 u mean
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Reply #166 posted 10/24/20 12:23pm

heartpeaceshea
rt

JudasLChrist said:



funkbabyandthebabysitters said:


JudasLChrist said:



I'm more radical than I have ever been.



Politically he got more radical but musically,nope.



Prince became a full on social conservative for a minute. And he used to give large amounts of money to Minnesota's Republican Senator back in the 90s.



I don't think that ever happened 😂
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Reply #167 posted 10/24/20 12:42pm

heartpeaceshea
rt

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

heartpeacesheart said:



No that doesn't happen until 2013


2001 u mean


Why are you saying that I'm mean
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Reply #168 posted 10/24/20 1:06pm

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

Yes

Gotta broken heart again

sad
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Reply #169 posted 10/24/20 1:09pm

skywalker

avatar

JudasLChrist said:



funkbabyandthebabysitters said:


JudasLChrist said:



I'm more radical than I have ever been.



Politically he got more radical but musically,nope.



Prince became a full on social conservative for a minute. And he used to give large amounts of money to Minnesota's Republican Senator back in the 90s.



I’ve lived in Minnesota my entire life. This is categorically UNTRUE. Unless you have some previously unknown evidence to back up this wild claim?
[Edited 10/24/20 13:09pm]
"New Power slide...."
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Reply #170 posted 10/24/20 1:09pm

heartpeaceshea
rt

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

Yes

Gotta broken heart again

sad


Well try using yes instead
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Reply #171 posted 10/24/20 3:08pm

steakfinger

Prince was always about making money. Always. He didn't compromise, he followed a formula and his music changed with the times. He wasn't always as good at it as others, but everything he did was exactly what he always did, just with varying degrees of success.

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Reply #172 posted 10/28/20 3:12pm

JudasLChrist

avatar

heartpeacesheart said:

JudasLChrist said:



Prince became a full on social conservative for a minute. And he used to give large amounts of money to Minnesota's Republican Senator back in the 90s.

I don't think that ever happened 😂



All I can find is on Google right now is $3000 and $2000, and then in another post I say "$24,000". But I remember he gave a big amount of money to Rudy Boschwitz back in the day. It was a topic of discussion. I remember people my age in the music scen dismissing Prince because he had become a Republican.



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Reply #173 posted 10/28/20 4:14pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

JudasLChrist said:

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

JudasLChrist said: Politically he got more radical but musically,nope.



Prince became a full on social conservative for a minute. And he used to give large amounts of money to Minnesota's Republican Senator back in the 90s.

It's hard for people to reconcile by Prince's father was very conservative and Prince was very much like him. in the last 15yrs of his life he was very much so.

The interview about him liking Muslim societies because the way of things is plain for everyone and some other things showed a lot of his conservative side.

#ALBUMSSTILLMATTER
https://prince.org/msg/7/464433 9.24.2020
if you ever try the lotus position
Try it while you're being strangled
Do U understand what I'm saying?
#IDEFINEME
It’s unloving and selfish to be easily offended
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Reply #174 posted 10/28/20 4:20pm

Margot

Many high-net worth people are Republican; they want to conserve their wealth and pay less tax.

Add JW to the mix and he may have had some conservative times.

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Reply #175 posted 10/28/20 4:35pm

JudasLChrist

avatar

OldFriends4Sale said:

JudasLChrist said:



Prince became a full on social conservative for a minute. And he used to give large amounts of money to Minnesota's Republican Senator back in the 90s.

It's hard for people to reconcile by Prince's father was very conservative and Prince was very much like him. in the last 15yrs of his life he was very much so.

The interview about him liking Muslim societies because the way of things is plain for everyone and some other things showed a lot of his conservative side.


His worst era. Most definitely.

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Reply #176 posted 10/28/20 4:44pm

TurnItUp

thebanishedone said:

During the whole decade of the 80's Prince was redefining musical landscapes

without any fear he was pushing the enveloupe.

But starting with the 1991 Diamonds And Pearls Prince incorporated rap into his sound

and overall dumbed his sound to make it safe.I think we can agree

that Diamonds And Pearls is Prince at his safest ,a far cry from the 1980-1988 daring artist.

Why Prince start with compromises when it comes to his music?

Was it being disillusion with his own vision?

Getting scared from the new sounds coming from the streets that he couldn't relate to?

Financial loss from commercial flops of his projects or something else?

I never saw nothin wrong with Prince including rap in his music. I was glad cuz he was finally gettin with the times and at the same time still his own artist. He probably didn't like it at first and then it started growing on him and he started liking it later on.

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Reply #177 posted 10/28/20 5:17pm

heartpeaceshea
rt

I can't get over this thread because it's becoming rhetorical and I have a lot of work to do but maybe the true answer for everything and everyone is ya gotta start somewhere.
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Reply #178 posted 10/29/20 5:53am

RJOrion

JudasLChrist said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

It's hard for people to reconcile by Prince's father was very conservative and Prince was very much like him. in the last 15yrs of his life he was very much so.

The interview about him liking Muslim societies because the way of things is plain for everyone and some other things showed a lot of his conservative side.


His worst era. Most definitely.

the hate is real

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Reply #179 posted 10/29/20 6:09am

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

JudasLChrist said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

It's hard for people to reconcile by Prince's father was very conservative and Prince was very much like him. in the last 15yrs of his life he was very much so.

The interview about him liking Muslim societies because the way of things is plain for everyone and some other things showed a lot of his conservative side.


His worst era. Most definitely.

This was the 20Ten album period ?

#ALBUMSSTILLMATTER
https://prince.org/msg/7/464433 9.24.2020
if you ever try the lotus position
Try it while you're being strangled
Do U understand what I'm saying?
#IDEFINEME
It’s unloving and selfish to be easily offended
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