URL: https://new.prince.org/msg/7/457835

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Forums > Prince: Music and More > Prince's Death Investigation: Part 13
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Thread started 01/04/19 1:37pm

June7

Moderator

moderator

Prince's Death Investigation: Part 13

Discuss the controversies, insights, new information and respectful opinions about the death of Prince here. Don't troll or bring hateful discussion here. Be cool - or be gone. - June7

—-

Now, here’s what I’d like to do. It’s going to take some help from those who are properly commenting and engaging in discussion, to help out. I’d like those who enjoy this thread to NOT ENGAGE in those who come here and post the negativity. What I’d like instead, is for you to just report that post to me. Do not engage. I repeat, DO NOT ENGAGE ON THE POST! Just refer the post to me, and I’ll take care of the issue promptly. Do not talk about the post to others, just report it to me and then pretend you never saw them it.

Some of you are equally wrong for participating in the derailing of previous versions of this thread. If you don’t add fuel, there’s less fire. So, to those of you who choose to not listen to this idea - and engage - IN ANY WAY OTHER THAN WHAT I LISTED - then I’ll be talking to you as well, and trust me - it will not be a nice conversation.

This thread has been much nicer than the past ones already - if you enjoy having the place to discuss this topic, I hope I can count on you to follow my instructions.

Now, the anniversary of Alex’s passing is very soon, and I cannot guarantee I will be much help these next few days, but you never know. So, please help me out here.

— Thanks - June7
[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #1 posted 01/04/19 1:55pm

Bodhitheblackdog

June7 said:

Discuss the controversies, insights, new information and respectful opinions about the death of Prince here. Don't troll or bring hateful discussion here. Be cool - or be gone. - June7

well, well, well...hope everyone is going to have a peaceful, loving, insightful, compassionate 2019...sure do miss that man...

Reply #2 posted 01/04/19 3:30pm

Strawberrylova123

What else to discuss regarding this topic? Let him R.I.P
Thats all I'm going to say..peace
Reply #3 posted 01/04/19 3:45pm

MoBettaBliss

Strawberrylova123 said:

What else to discuss regarding this topic? Let him R.I.P Thats all I'm going to say..peace



yep

enough is enough

it'll be 3 years this april ... come on

Reply #4 posted 01/04/19 5:01pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

Bodhitheblackdog said:

June7 said:

Discuss the controversies, insights, new information and respectful opinions about the death of Prince here. Don't troll or bring hateful discussion here. Be cool - or be gone. - June7

well, well, well...hope everyone is going to have a peaceful, loving, insightful, compassionate 2019...sure do miss that man...



Well, well, well.

Someone who reappears as soon as this thread is started.


Reply #5 posted 01/04/19 5:05pm

SchlomoThaHomo

Strange how you think you're pretty much over it, and then something out of the blue chokes you up. Today it was the "are you sleeping" part of the Pop Life remix. No idea why.

"That's when stars collide. When there's space for what u want, and ur heart is open wide."
Reply #6 posted 01/04/19 5:54pm

nelcp777

Wonder why the glass in the studio was not tested or gathered as evidence?

Reply #7 posted 01/04/19 6:41pm

rogifan

Strawberrylova123 said:

What else to discuss regarding this topic? Let him R.I.P
Thats all I'm going to say..peace

Seriously. Let the man Rest In Peace for gods sake.
Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜
Reply #8 posted 01/04/19 6:43pm

poppys

UGH, happy new year

Reply #9 posted 01/05/19 8:18am

sonshine

I was surprised to see this topic back up again too. I can't imagine what is left to discuss. There hasn't been any new information to discuss/share, but maybe I missed something.
In any case the only thing I have to say after all this time is that it's still a shame he's gone, and if nothing else his death has played a part in finally giving the opioid crisis in this country the attention it deserves. Better late than never I guess. At least from a public health standpoint an effort is being made.
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
Reply #10 posted 01/05/19 8:34am

rednblue

sonshine said:

I was surprised to see this topic back up again too. I can't imagine what is left to discuss. There hasn't been any new information to discuss/share, but maybe I missed something. In any case the only thing I have to say after all this time is that it's still a shame he's gone, and if nothing else his death has played a part in finally giving the opioid crisis in this country the attention it deserves. Better late than never I guess. At least from a public health standpoint an effort is being made.


heart to you, to June7, to all who keep memories alive and hold loved ones in their hearts

Reply #11 posted 01/05/19 8:39am

peggyon

My thanks to you, June 7, as well.
Reply #12 posted 01/05/19 3:36pm

June7

Moderator

moderator

sonshine said:

I was surprised to see this topic back up again too. I can't imagine what is left to discuss. There hasn't been any new information to discuss/share, but maybe I missed something.
In any case the only thing I have to say after all this time is that it's still a shame he's gone, and if nothing else his death has played a part in finally giving the opioid crisis in this country the attention it deserves. Better late than never I guess. At least from a public health standpoint an effort is being made.


That’s sadly the case. I wish he knew how much we would have supported his efforts to get off this drug - if only. But, as a person who has used, the last thing you want anyone to know is this weakness.
[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #13 posted 01/05/19 3:46pm

Bodhitheblackdog

June7 said:

sonshine said:
I was surprised to see this topic back up again too. I can't imagine what is left to discuss. There hasn't been any new information to discuss/share, but maybe I missed something. In any case the only thing I have to say after all this time is that it's still a shame he's gone, and if nothing else his death has played a part in finally giving the opioid crisis in this country the attention it deserves. Better late than never I guess. At least from a public health standpoint an effort is being made.
That’s sadly the case. I wish he knew how much we would have supported his efforts to get off this drug - if only. But, as a person who has used, the last thing you want anyone to know is this weakness.

Yes, YES and YESSSSS!!! Great point. IMO, it's frequently the secrecy and shame that's the biggest roadblock on the path to sobriety...it can be emotionally crippling beyond the physical and brain-rewiring aspects of addiction.

It's a comfort to believe that there wouldn't have been anyone in his Purple Army who wouldn't have wanted to help.

Reply #14 posted 01/05/19 7:16pm

rednblue

Bodhitheblackdog said:

June7 said:

sonshine said: That’s sadly the case. I wish he knew how much we would have supported his efforts to get off this drug - if only. But, as a person who has used, the last thing you want anyone to know is this weakness.

Yes, YES and YESSSSS!!! Great point. IMO, it's frequently the secrecy and shame that's the biggest roadblock on the path to sobriety...it can be emotionally crippling beyond the physical and brain-rewiring aspects of addiction.

It's a comfort to believe that there wouldn't have been anyone in his Purple Army who wouldn't have wanted to help.

[Edited 1/5/19 19:19pm]

Reply #15 posted 01/05/19 7:21pm

rednblue

Bodhitheblackdog said:

June7 said:

sonshine said: That’s sadly the case. I wish he knew how much we would have supported his efforts to get off this drug - if only. But, as a person who has used, the last thing you want anyone to know is this weakness.

Yes, YES and YESSSSS!!! Great point. IMO, it's frequently the secrecy and shame that's the biggest roadblock on the path to sobriety...it can be emotionally crippling beyond the physical and brain-rewiring aspects of addiction.

It's a comfort to believe that there wouldn't have been anyone in his Purple Army who wouldn't have wanted to help.



Yes...the discrepancy in how things are judged is amazing. People constantly do suboptimal stuff regarding their own (and sometimes other people's) health all the time. I know I do, even now, in what should be my older and wiser days. And people doing really suboptimal, and outright reckless stuff, happens all the time.

There is SO much condemnation for struggling with a substance, vs. almost anything else. It's over-the-top irrational.

No doubt the following is an odd-sounding comparison, but looking at things side by side sometimes brings things out for me. So...just like there are people who struggle not to use a substance, there are people who struggle to be faithful to a partner. There are those who want to "cheat," and even those in open relationships, but I'm talking about the large number of people who want to be faithful yet can't control themselves and fall off the wagon.

It floors me that people falling off the faithfulness wagon sometimes get props and admiring "you're the player" type feedback. Yet what happens to people struggling with control over cigarettes, alcohol, crack, meth, opiates, etc.? These people get one of the ultimate stigmas directed their way. For a medical condition!

Add to that how plenty of people with addiction are hard working and contributing much, and plenty are attempting to self medicate other serious conditions, some of which are also stigmatized. It's just incredible.

Reply #16 posted 01/05/19 8:03pm

peggyon

rednblue said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Yes, YES and YESSSSS!!! Great point. IMO, it's frequently the secrecy and shame that's the biggest roadblock on the path to sobriety...it can be emotionally crippling beyond the physical and brain-rewiring aspects of addiction.

It's a comfort to believe that there wouldn't have been anyone in his Purple Army who wouldn't have wanted to help.



Yes...the discrepancy in how things are judged is amazing. People constantly do suboptimal stuff regarding their own (and sometimes other people's) health all the time. I know I do, even now, in what should be my older and wiser days. And people doing really suboptimal, and outright reckless stuff, happens all the time.

There is SO much condemnation for struggling with a substance, vs. almost anything else. It's over-the-top irrational.

No doubt the following is an odd-sounding comparison, but looking at things side by side sometimes brings things out for me. So...just like there are people who struggle not to use a substance, there are people who struggle to be faithful to a partner. There are those who want to "cheat," and even those in open relationships, but I'm talking about the large number of people who want to be faithful yet can't control themselves and fall off the wagon.

It floors me that people falling off the faithfulness wagon sometimes get props and admiring "you're the player" type feedback. Yet what happens to people struggling with control over cigarettes, alcohol, crack, meth, opiates, etc.? These people get one of the ultimate stigmas directed their way. For a medical condition!

Add to that how plenty of people with addiction are hard working and contributing much, and plenty are attempting to self medicate other serious conditions, some of which are also stigmatized. It's just incredible.

I agree.

Reply #17 posted 01/05/19 11:48pm

AnnaStesia10

Thank u June7 for opening up this topic again for anyone on this forum still interested in talking about or reading about it. I for one am interested because for me, I am still not over his death and am in a way haunted by it. It is not a haunt that keeps me up at night or contributes to an unhealthy obsession. A haunt in a sense that I feel, still after the death investigation is over, we all are still not getting the full story.

You will have the people here go on and on about leave this alone he deserves his privacy. Let the man rest. But I say since Prince was a beloved public figure who touched the souls of so many and died by the the hands of a major pain med and I am sorry in such an odd way and found in an elevator in his musical oasis, that I do feel his fans and supporters do deserve to know the truth. The truth could bring full closure from any grief and also help people struggling with pain management and possible addiction to get the help they need. This all still does not make any fuckin' sense to me.

Add to that even after the officials released all the death investigation results and no one is to be charged, no one in is inner circle is talking about this and are protecting his image and legacy. It is like they all still feel they have a gag order and still have to adhere to those confidentiality agreements they all had to sign in order to work with Prince. Or they dont want any part of this.

The amount of closed mouths and shame attached to this pain pill issue, even in death, is a tragic shame in that I firmly believe the main reason Prince is dead right now is due to the closed mouths and Prince's own damn pride in not wanting to talk about this or reach out for help.

Prince was not perfect I feel we all know what the F he was probably going thru. But for no one in his circle of friends and peers to at least talk about this with honesty is very strange to me. And I feel it perpetuates the stigma attached to addiction and pain pills.

Right now I am reading the Death Investigation book by Jay Corn. Nothing new in it I just wanted to read because as I've admitted, I am still not over his death and sadly have more questions than before.
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #18 posted 01/06/19 3:13am

muchtoofast

broken
Reply #19 posted 01/06/19 6:03am

cantstop

AnnaStesia10 said:

Thank u June7 for opening up this topic again for anyone on this forum still interested in talking about or reading about it. I for one am interested because for me, I am still not over his death and am in a way haunted by it. It is not a haunt that keeps me up at night or contributes to an unhealthy obsession. A haunt in a sense that I feel, still after the death investigation is over, we all are still not getting the full story.

You will have the people here go on and on about leave this alone he deserves his privacy. Let the man rest. But I say since Prince was a beloved public figure who touched the souls of so many and died by the the hands of a major pain med and I am sorry in such an odd way and found in an elevator in his musical oasis, that I do feel his fans and supporters do deserve to know the truth. The truth could bring full closure from any grief and also help people struggling with pain management and possible addiction to get the help they need. This all still does not make any fuckin' sense to me.
Agree 100%
Add to that even after the officials released all the death investigation results and no one is to be charged, no one in is inner circle is talking about this and are protecting his image and legacy. It is like they all still feel they have a gag order and still have to adhere to those confidentiality agreements they all had to sign in order to work with Prince. Or they dont want any part of this.

The amount of closed mouths and shame attached to this pain pill issue, even in death, is a tragic shame in that I firmly believe the main reason Prince is dead right now is due to the closed mouths and Prince's own damn pride in not wanting to talk about this or reach out for help.

Prince was not perfect I feel we all know what the F he was probably going thru. But for no one in his circle of friends and peers to at least talk about this with honesty is very strange to me. And I feel it perpetuates the stigma attached to addiction and pain pills.

Right now I am reading the Death Investigation book by Jay Corn. Nothing new in it I just wanted to read because as I've admitted, I am still not over his death and sadly have more questions than before.
Reply #20 posted 01/06/19 6:05am

cantstop

Agree 100%
Reply #21 posted 01/06/19 1:03pm

sonshine

rednblue said:

 



Bodhitheblackdog said:


 



June7 said:


sonshine said: That’s sadly the case. I wish he knew how much we would have supported his efforts to get off this drug - if only. But, as a person who has used, the last thing you want anyone to know is this weakness.

Yes, YES and YESSSSS!!! Great point. IMO, it's frequently the secrecy and shame that's the biggest roadblock on the path to sobriety...it can be emotionally crippling beyond the physical and brain-rewiring aspects of addiction.


 


It's a comfort to believe that there wouldn't have been anyone in his Purple Army who wouldn't have wanted to help.





Yes...the discrepancy in how things are judged is amazing.  People constantly do suboptimal stuff regarding their own (and sometimes other people's) health all the time.  I know I do, even now, in what should be my older and wiser days.  And people doing really suboptimal, and outright reckless stuff, happens all the time.

There is SO much condemnation for struggling with a substance, vs. almost anything else.  It's over-the-top irrational.

No doubt the following is an odd-sounding comparison, but looking at things side by side sometimes brings things out for me.  So...just like there are people who struggle not to use a substance, there are people who struggle to be faithful to a partner.  There are those who want to "cheat," and even those in open relationships, but I'm talking about the large number of people who want to be faithful yet can't control themselves and fall off the wagon.

It floors me that people falling off the faithfulness wagon sometimes get props and admiring "you're the player" type feedback.  Yet what happens to people struggling with control over cigarettes, alcohol, crack, meth, opiates, etc.?  These people get one of the ultimate stigmas directed their way.  For a medical condition!

Add to that how plenty of people with addiction are hard working and contributing much, and plenty are attempting to self medicate other serious conditions, some of which are also stigmatized.  It's just incredible.


clapping Sad, but true. Thank you for saying this better than I could. I only wish more people were capable of such understanding and compassion. I've had people in my life that I have loved deeply, who were very worthy of the love they received. But the stigma is real and in actuality is probably even worse than you would imagine. It drives the secrecy, and the feelings of unworthiness that makes recovery so difficult.
[Edited 1/6/19 13:05pm]
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
Reply #22 posted 01/06/19 4:38pm

peggyon

I too feel there are many unaswered questions. Likely the family and inner circle are in 'legacy- management' as they may feel millions of dollars are at stake.

Reply #23 posted 01/06/19 5:05pm

SpamelaAnusorn

I don't trust everybody around Prince I feel like he had too many enemas and people that can get some thing from him.

I like it when u DANCE 4 MEN!! Hallerlujah
Reply #24 posted 01/06/19 5:11pm

peggyon

SpamelaAnusorn said:

I don't trust everybody around Prince I feel like he had too many enemas and people that can get some thing from him.

The enemas were for constipation from opiate use.

Reply #25 posted 01/06/19 5:16pm

SpamelaAnusorn

peggyon said:

SpamelaAnusorn said:

I don't trust everybody around Prince I feel like he had too many enemas and people that can get some thing from him.

The enemas were for constipation from opiate use.

Keep u friends close and u enemies even closer nod

I like it when u DANCE 4 MEN!! Hallerlujah
Reply #26 posted 01/06/19 11:21pm

June7

Moderator

moderator

AnnaStesia10 said:

Thank u June7 for opening up this topic again for anyone on this forum still interested in talking about or reading about it. I for one am interested because for me, I am still not over his death and am in a way haunted by it. It is not a haunt that keeps me up at night or contributes to an unhealthy obsession. A haunt in a sense that I feel, still after the death investigation is over, we all are still not getting the full story. You will have the people here go on and on about leave this alone he deserves his privacy. Let the man rest. But I say since Prince was a beloved public figure who touched the souls of so many and died by the the hands of a major pain med and I am sorry in such an odd way and found in an elevator in his musical oasis, that I do feel his fans and supporters do deserve to know the truth. The truth could bring full closure from any grief and also help people struggling with pain management and possible addiction to get the help they need. This all still does not make any fuckin' sense to me.

Excellent post.

Nobody can, or has the right to, tell anyone for how long they should grieve. I'm coming up to a year in my own son's death (on the 12th), and I'm still beside myself. Talking ... talking ... about his death, him, remembrences, etc., does help.

What people don't understand, or don't think about, is the condition or public understanding of how death affects those immediately surrounding you, or how it actually is felt, or how you're perceived from everytone around you when you lose a loved one, it's expected - we live, we die - it's in the bible. It's life. It's death. Most of us are, and have accepted the fact that this is so. But, when the death is your son, your child, it brings on a whole new sideline of empathy, sympathy and stigma. Yes ... I said stigma.

People are strange.

I have actually lost friends due to his death. Not in a way that they think you suck and have publicly stated that they never want to speak to you again, or anything like that - it's subtle. It's just a disappearance. And, normally I wouldn't have even noticed it if it were someone I was just an aquaintance of. But, this one person is/was a very dear friend, who, when this happened, just ... stopped ... talking ... to ... me.

This one I noticed - and, I called him on it. I called him at home about after a month after Alex died. His wife answered and she seamed slightly surprised I called and was cordial and offered her condolences and stammered out some sympathetic wishes, but seamed kinda nervous. We chatted a bit and I asked to speak to her husband - my 'brother'. That's how close I thought we were.

He got on the phone and my first words to him were, "Are you okay? I mean, are we okay?! Because ... I haven't heard from you in awhile, and I wasn't sure if you heard about Alex (I knew he did, I just threw that in there to offer him an out) and, you know, I don't understand why you didn't reach out?"

He answered, "Oh ... yeah ... I heard about that - and, I am so sorry for your loss ... understand, that it's just too close to my sister's death, I honestly couldn't offer you anything comfort wise, it's all too difficult for me right now".

And, right there, I suddenly wasn't upset with him anymore - just a little hurt that he couldn't have disclosed that to me instead of letting me think we were not as close as I thought we were. This goes back to my first paragraph - and, I don't have the right to tell him how long, or how to grieve.

He apologized, and I know he felt bad, but, so did I for not knowing why he didn't contact me. But, again, I wasn't expected to know.

I wrote a song about Alex and our family (his two siblings and his mother - my ex and myself) called "Easy". After the song talks about our family growing up together, splitting up, etc., it goes into what happened 'in present day' and how I'm dealing/not dealing with this. The last verse, which I believe needs to be brought out more, talked about more, made aware of more is this:

---

"So, please don't stop being my friend

You can stop me on the street again

Say, "How nice it is to see you, man"

Take me for a beer, and then

That might make it easier

Instead of trying to avoid these things - that's not okay

That's not the way

And if you do, that makes it easy

Well, a little bit easy"

---

My point was not to shame him (or those who didn't, or couldn't, talk to me). But, to remind people that being silent hurts even more. The parents who lost a child are shunned. Nobody wants to be reminded in this life that this happens. It's too tragic. So, they instead, subconciously take care of it by not dealing with it at all. And they just stop talking to you. I understand ... I do. But, that's not the way.

This is one of the reasons I believe that his death, Prince's, should not be held silent just to appease those who can't deal with it, or think it's too long after, or etc., etc., etc. Yadda, yadda, yadda. Nobody should put their own beliefs, or restrictions, upon somebody else. Nobody should bitch at another person because their discomfort in dealing with something should be the same yours. You should be able to grieve for as long as you need to, publicly or privately. The choice in posting this thread is that simple for me. And anyone who has discomfort with this discussion should not click on the thread - the topic or subject matter, is clearly listed in the title. If it is not for you, simply skip this thread. No one will miss you or your reason for doing so.

Thank you. And thanks to all of you who have offered your condolences. I can't state how much those little words, or that moment of sympathy means to me.

Tomás - Easy

[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #27 posted 01/06/19 11:35pm

June7

Moderator

moderator

SpamelaAnusorn said:

I don't trust everybody around Prince I feel like he had too many enemas and people that can get some thing from him.

One can never have too many enemas. Keeps shit real. eek

[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #28 posted 01/07/19 7:08am

Bodhitheblackdog

June7 said:

AnnaStesia10 said:

Thank u June7 for opening up this topic again for anyone on this forum still interested in talking about or reading about it. I for one am interested because for me, I am still not over his death and am in a way haunted by it. It is not a haunt that keeps me up at night or contributes to an unhealthy obsession. A haunt in a sense that I feel, still after the death investigation is over, we all are still not getting the full story. You will have the people here go on and on about leave this alone he deserves his privacy. Let the man rest. But I say since Prince was a beloved public figure who touched the souls of so many and died by the the hands of a major pain med and I am sorry in such an odd way and found in an elevator in his musical oasis, that I do feel his fans and supporters do deserve to know the truth. The truth could bring full closure from any grief and also help people struggling with pain management and possible addiction to get the help they need. This all still does not make any fuckin' sense to me.

Excellent post.

Nobody can, or has the right to, tell anyone for how long they should grieve. I'm coming up to a year in my own son's death (on the 12th), and I'm still beside myself. Talking ... talking ... about his death, him, remembrences, etc., does help.

What people don't understand, or don't think about, is the condition or public understanding of how death affects those immediately surrounding you, or how it actually is felt, or how you're perceived from everytone around you when you lose a loved one, it's expected - we live, we die - it's in the bible. It's life. It's death. Most of us are, and have accepted the fact that this is so. But, when the death is your son, your child, it brings on a whole new sideline of empathy, sympathy and stigma. Yes ... I said stigma.

People are strange.

I have actually lost friends due to his death. Not in a way that they think you suck and have publicly stated that they never want to speak to you again, or anything like that - it's subtle. It's just a disappearance. And, normally I wouldn't have even noticed it if it were someone I was just an aquaintance of. But, this one person is/was a very dear friend, who, when this happened, just ... stopped ... talking ... to ... me.

This one I noticed - and, I called him on it. I called him at home about after a month after Alex died. His wife answered and she seamed slightly surprised I called and was cordial and offered her condolences and stammered out some sympathetic wishes, but seamed kinda nervous. We chatted a bit and I asked to speak to her husband - my 'brother'. That's how close I thought we were.

He got on the phone and my first words to him were, "Are you okay? I mean, are we okay?! Because ... I haven't heard from you in awhile, and I wasn't sure if you heard about Alex (I knew he did, I just threw that in there to offer him an out) and, you know, I don't understand why you didn't reach out?"

He answered, "Oh ... yeah ... I heard about that - and, I am so sorry for your loss ... understand, that it's just too close to my sister's death, I honestly couldn't offer you anything comfort wise, it's all too difficult for me right now".

And, right there, I suddenly wasn't upset with him anymore - just a little hurt that he couldn't have disclosed that to me instead of letting me think we were not as close as I thought we were. This goes back to my first paragraph - and, I don't have the right to tell him how long, or how to grieve.

He apologized, and I know he felt bad, but, so did I for not knowing why he didn't contact me. But, again, I wasn't expected to know.

I wrote a song about Alex and our family (his two siblings and his mother - my ex and myself) called "Easy". After the song talks about our family growing up together, splitting up, etc., it goes into what happened 'in present day' and how I'm dealing/not dealing with this. The last verse, which I believe needs to be brought out more, talked about more, made aware of more is this:

---

"So, please don't stop being my friend

You can stop me on the street again

Say, "How nice it is to see you, man"

Take me for a beer, and then

That might make it easier

Instead of trying to avoid these things - that's not okay

That's not the way

And if you do, that makes it easy

Well, a little bit easy"

---

My point was not to shame him (or those who didn't, or couldn't, talk to me). But, to remind people that being silent hurts even more. The parents who lost a child are shunned. Nobody wants to be reminded in this life that this happens. It's too tragic. So, they instead, subconciously take care of it by not dealing with it at all. And they just stop talking to you. I understand ... I do. But, that's not the way.

This is one of the reasons I believe that his death, Prince's, should not be held silent just to appease those who can't deal with it, or think it's too long after, or etc., etc., etc. Yadda, yadda, yadda. Nobody should put their own beliefs, or restrictions, upon somebody else. Nobody should bitch at another person because their discomfort in dealing with something should be the same yours. You should be able to grieve for as long as you need to, publicly or privately. The choice in posting this thread is that simple for me. And anyone who has discomfort with this discussion should not click on the thread - the topic or subject matter, is clearly listed in the title. If it is not for you, simply skip this thread. No one will miss you or your reason for doing so.

Thank you. And thanks to all of you who have offered your condolences. I can't state how much those little words, or that moment of sympathy means to me.

Tomás - Easy

June 7, thanks for this...people love, suffer, grieve in their own way...I think we all saw this truth in Prince's music. It's what makes him unique and irreplacable. It was the core of his genius. RIP.

Reply #29 posted 01/07/19 7:12am

PennyPurple

June7 said:

Excellent post.

Nobody can, or has the right to, tell anyone for how long they should grieve. I'm coming up to a year in my own son's death (on the 12th), and I'm still beside myself. Talking ... talking ... about his death, him, remembrences, etc., does help.

What people don't understand, or don't think about, is the condition or public understanding of how death affects those immediately surrounding you, or how it actually is felt, or how you're perceived from everytone around you when you lose a loved one, it's expected - we live, we die - it's in the bible. It's life. It's death. Most of us are, and have accepted the fact that this is so. But, when the death is your son, your child, it brings on a whole new sideline of empathy, sympathy and stigma. Yes ... I said stigma.

People are strange.

I have actually lost friends due to his death. Not in a way that they think you suck and have publicly stated that they never want to speak to you again, or anything like that - it's subtle. It's just a disappearance. And, normally I wouldn't have even noticed it if it were someone I was just an aquaintance of. But, this one person is/was a very dear friend, who, when this happened, just ... stopped ... talking ... to ... me.

This one I noticed - and, I called him on it. I called him at home about after a month after Alex died. His wife answered and she seamed slightly surprised I called and was cordial and offered her condolences and stammered out some sympathetic wishes, but seamed kinda nervous. We chatted a bit and I asked to speak to her husband - my 'brother'. That's how close I thought we were.

He got on the phone and my first words to him were, "Are you okay? I mean, are we okay?! Because ... I haven't heard from you in awhile, and I wasn't sure if you heard about Alex (I knew he did, I just threw that in there to offer him an out) and, you know, I don't understand why you didn't reach out?"

He answered, "Oh ... yeah ... I heard about that - and, I am so sorry for your loss ... understand, that it's just too close to my sister's death, I honestly couldn't offer you anything comfort wise, it's all too difficult for me right now".

And, right there, I suddenly wasn't upset with him anymore - just a little hurt that he couldn't have disclosed that to me instead of letting me think we were not as close as I thought we were. This goes back to my first paragraph - and, I don't have the right to tell him how long, or how to grieve.

He apologized, and I know he felt bad, but, so did I for not knowing why he didn't contact me. But, again, I wasn't expected to know.

I wrote a song about Alex and our family (his two siblings and his mother - my ex and myself) called "Easy". After the song talks about our family growing up together, splitting up, etc., it goes into what happened 'in present day' and how I'm dealing/not dealing with this. The last verse, which I believe needs to be brought out more, talked about more, made aware of more is this:

---

"So, please don't stop being my friend

You can stop me on the street again

Say, "How nice it is to see you, man"

Take me for a beer, and then

That might make it easier

Instead of trying to avoid these things - that's not okay

That's not the way

And if you do, that makes it easy

Well, a little bit easy"

---

My point was not to shame him (or those who didn't, or couldn't, talk to me). But, to remind people that being silent hurts even more. The parents who lost a child are shunned. Nobody wants to be reminded in this life that this happens. It's too tragic. So, they instead, subconciously take care of it by not dealing with it at all. And they just stop talking to you. I understand ... I do. But, that's not the way.

This is one of the reasons I believe that his death, Prince's, should not be held silent just to appease those who can't deal with it, or think it's too long after, or etc., etc., etc. Yadda, yadda, yadda. Nobody should put their own beliefs, or restrictions, upon somebody else. Nobody should bitch at another person because their discomfort in dealing with something should be the same yours. You should be able to grieve for as long as you need to, publicly or privately. The choice in posting this thread is that simple for me. And anyone who has discomfort with this discussion should not click on the thread - the topic or subject matter, is clearly listed in the title. If it is not for you, simply skip this thread. No one will miss you or your reason for doing so.

Thank you. And thanks to all of you who have offered your condolences. I can't state how much those little words, or that moment of sympathy means to me.

Tomás - Easy

Wonderful words June.

It is odd how friends just walk away in times of need. My parents had best friends that they would go on vacation with and do everything together, when my Step Dad passed, my Mom never heard from them again. eek

I'm sorry you are going thru such a heartbreaking time. (hugs)

Reply #30 posted 01/07/19 7:59am

Bodhitheblackdog

PennyPurple said:

June7 said:

Excellent post.

Nobody can, or has the right to, tell anyone for how long they should grieve. I'm coming up to a year in my own son's death (on the 12th), and I'm still beside myself. Talking ... talking ... about his death, him, remembrences, etc., does help.

What people don't understand, or don't think about, is the condition or public understanding of how death affects those immediately surrounding you, or how it actually is felt, or how you're perceived from everytone around you when you lose a loved one, it's expected - we live, we die - it's in the bible. It's life. It's death. Most of us are, and have accepted the fact that this is so. But, when the death is your son, your child, it brings on a whole new sideline of empathy, sympathy and stigma. Yes ... I said stigma.

People are strange.

I have actually lost friends due to his death. Not in a way that they think you suck and have publicly stated that they never want to speak to you again, or anything like that - it's subtle. It's just a disappearance. And, normally I wouldn't have even noticed it if it were someone I was just an aquaintance of. But, this one person is/was a very dear friend, who, when this happened, just ... stopped ... talking ... to ... me.

This one I noticed - and, I called him on it. I called him at home about after a month after Alex died. His wife answered and she seamed slightly surprised I called and was cordial and offered her condolences and stammered out some sympathetic wishes, but seamed kinda nervous. We chatted a bit and I asked to speak to her husband - my 'brother'. That's how close I thought we were.

He got on the phone and my first words to him were, "Are you okay? I mean, are we okay?! Because ... I haven't heard from you in awhile, and I wasn't sure if you heard about Alex (I knew he did, I just threw that in there to offer him an out) and, you know, I don't understand why you didn't reach out?"

He answered, "Oh ... yeah ... I heard about that - and, I am so sorry for your loss ... understand, that it's just too close to my sister's death, I honestly couldn't offer you anything comfort wise, it's all too difficult for me right now".

And, right there, I suddenly wasn't upset with him anymore - just a little hurt that he couldn't have disclosed that to me instead of letting me think we were not as close as I thought we were. This goes back to my first paragraph - and, I don't have the right to tell him how long, or how to grieve.

He apologized, and I know he felt bad, but, so did I for not knowing why he didn't contact me. But, again, I wasn't expected to know.

I wrote a song about Alex and our family (his two siblings and his mother - my ex and myself) called "Easy". After the song talks about our family growing up together, splitting up, etc., it goes into what happened 'in present day' and how I'm dealing/not dealing with this. The last verse, which I believe needs to be brought out more, talked about more, made aware of more is this:

---

"So, please don't stop being my friend

You can stop me on the street again

Say, "How nice it is to see you, man"

Take me for a beer, and then

That might make it easier

Instead of trying to avoid these things - that's not okay

That's not the way

And if you do, that makes it easy

Well, a little bit easy"

---

My point was not to shame him (or those who didn't, or couldn't, talk to me). But, to remind people that being silent hurts even more. The parents who lost a child are shunned. Nobody wants to be reminded in this life that this happens. It's too tragic. So, they instead, subconciously take care of it by not dealing with it at all. And they just stop talking to you. I understand ... I do. But, that's not the way.

This is one of the reasons I believe that his death, Prince's, should not be held silent just to appease those who can't deal with it, or think it's too long after, or etc., etc., etc. Yadda, yadda, yadda. Nobody should put their own beliefs, or restrictions, upon somebody else. Nobody should bitch at another person because their discomfort in dealing with something should be the same yours. You should be able to grieve for as long as you need to, publicly or privately. The choice in posting this thread is that simple for me. And anyone who has discomfort with this discussion should not click on the thread - the topic or subject matter, is clearly listed in the title. If it is not for you, simply skip this thread. No one will miss you or your reason for doing so.

Thank you. And thanks to all of you who have offered your condolences. I can't state how much those little words, or that moment of sympathy means to me.

Tomás - Easy

Wonderful words June.

It is odd how friends just walk away in times of need. My parents had best friends that they would go on vacation with and do everything together, when my Step Dad passed, my Mom never heard from them again. eek

I'm sorry you are going thru such a heartbreaking time. (hugs)

PENNY!!! yes

Reply #31 posted 01/07/19 8:09am

onlyforaminute

With all due respect to a parent that's grieving. Though this is not the same thing. I know while you want to talk about your son and express your love for him. You don't want to listen to everybody's opinion about what they think lead to your son's accident and what kind of person they thought he was or how they didn't like how he lead his life with no filter or no care on how you might be feeling either. You would expect some courtesy. So while people dont have to come here, some of that "speculation" spills out other places. And the same thing can be said for every single thread where people use no filter and express every single thought that pops in their head.
Year of Return 2019
Reply #32 posted 01/07/19 8:31am

Bodhitheblackdog

onlyforaminute said:

With all due respect to a parent that's grieving. Though this is not the same thing. I know while you want to talk about your son and express your love for him. You don't want to listen to everybody's opinion about what they think lead to your son's accident and what kind of person they thought he was or how they didn't like how he lead his life with no filter or no care on how you might be feeling either. You would expect some courtesy. So while people dont have to come here, some of that "speculation" spills out other places. And the same thing can be said for every single thread where people use no filter and express every single thought that pops in their head.

That is the beauty, horror, reality of cyber communication throughout the wired-up world, not just on Prince.Org.

People can be, express, feel whatever they are compelled to share with anyone and everyone (sometimes at their own peril) but, nevertheless, such participation can be liberating, authentic and creative.

To paraphrase June7's comments...those who feel unease about this rampant 'sharing'...should perhaps avoid fan sites, chat rooms, comments sections on news stories, social media, etc.

It's a personal choice to 'go there.'

Reply #33 posted 01/07/19 9:13am

onlyforaminute

Bodhitheblackdog said:

 



onlyforaminute said:


With all due respect to a parent that's grieving. Though this is not the same thing. I know while you want to talk about your son and express your love for him. You don't want to listen to everybody's opinion about what they think lead to your son's accident and what kind of person they thought he was or how they didn't like how he lead his life with no filter or no care on how you might be feeling either. You would expect some courtesy. So while people dont have to come here, some of that "speculation" spills out other places. And the same thing can be said for every single thread where people use no filter and express every single thought that pops in their head.

That is the beauty, horror, reality of cyber communication throughout the wired-up world, not just on Prince.Org.


 


People can be, express, feel whatever they are compelled to share with anyone and everyone (sometimes at their own peril) but, nevertheless, such participation can be liberating, authentic and creative.


 


To paraphrase June7's comments...those who feel unease about this rampant 'sharing'...should perhaps avoid fan sites, chat rooms, comments sections on news stories, social media, etc.


 


It's a personal choice to 'go there.'



But that exact same reasoning can be applied to everything. Yet tha rules on this board is there is no rights to free speech here. Everything has limits. Truth. Not everyone knew or adored his son. I doubt he'd want those people all up in his house expressing all their feelings and then telling members of his family they can go to another room where they don't have to hear it.
[Edited 1/7/19 9:27am]
Year of Return 2019
Reply #34 posted 01/07/19 9:32am

Bodhitheblackdog

onlyforaminute said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

That is the beauty, horror, reality of cyber communication throughout the wired-up world, not just on Prince.Org.

People can be, express, feel whatever they are compelled to share with anyone and everyone (sometimes at their own peril) but, nevertheless, such participation can be liberating, authentic and creative.

To paraphrase June7's comments...those who feel unease about this rampant 'sharing'...should perhaps avoid fan sites, chat rooms, comments sections on news stories, social media, etc.

It's a personal choice to 'go there.'

But that exact same reasoning can be applied to everything. Yet tha rules on this board is there is no rights to free speech here. Everything has limits. Truth. Not everyone knew or adored his son. I doubt he'd want those people all up in his house expressing all their feelings and then telling members of his family they can go to another room where they don't have to hear it. [Edited 1/7/19 9:27am]

Excellent points but the Org. 'rules' have about as much ultimate control over how Prince is/was perceived or remembered as did Prince himself who courted attention, speculation and gossip from the inception of his career with his clothing, promiscuity and carefully cultivated 'mysteriousness.'

It's hard to put that genie back in the bottle once your wishes for fame, success and adoration have been granted.

Reply #35 posted 01/07/19 9:42am

minnesoundlvr

June7 said:

SpamelaAnusorn said:

I don't trust everybody around Prince I feel like he had too many enemas and people that can get some thing from him.

One can never have too many enemas. Keeps shit real. eek

confused

Reply #36 posted 01/07/19 9:51am

onlyforaminute

The same exact stuff over and over again. If that's the energy desired around here, then that's the kind of energy desired around here. But let's not dress it up like something caring and empathetic. Its salacious gossip.
Year of Return 2019
Reply #37 posted 01/07/19 10:21am

rednblue

sonshine said:

rednblue said:



Yes...the discrepancy in how things are judged is amazing. People constantly do suboptimal stuff regarding their own (and sometimes other people's) health all the time. I know I do, even now, in what should be my older and wiser days. And people doing really suboptimal, and outright reckless stuff, happens all the time.

There is SO much condemnation for struggling with a substance, vs. almost anything else. It's over-the-top irrational.

No doubt the following is an odd-sounding comparison, but looking at things side by side sometimes brings things out for me. So...just like there are people who struggle not to use a substance, there are people who struggle to be faithful to a partner. There are those who want to "cheat," and even those in open relationships, but I'm talking about the large number of people who want to be faithful yet can't control themselves and fall off the wagon.

It floors me that people falling off the faithfulness wagon sometimes get props and admiring "you're the player" type feedback. Yet what happens to people struggling with control over cigarettes, alcohol, crack, meth, opiates, etc.? These people get one of the ultimate stigmas directed their way. For a medical condition!

Add to that how plenty of people with addiction are hard working and contributing much, and plenty are attempting to self medicate other serious conditions, some of which are also stigmatized. It's just incredible.

clapping Sad, but true. Thank you for saying this better than I could. I only wish more people were capable of such understanding and compassion. I've had people in my life that I have loved deeply, who were very worthy of the love they received. But the stigma is real and in actuality is probably even worse than you would imagine. It drives the secrecy, and the feelings of unworthiness that makes recovery so difficult. [Edited 1/6/19 13:05pm]


Thank you for your kind words! The inability to fully know what it's like in someone else's shoes (though it's hugely important/helpful to try to imagine) gives pause. The enduring strength of some of these forces, and the destruction that their power drives, is part of why I think there's such a long way to go.


I hope that here, and also (as our younger family members would say) "IRL," some things have come your way...that is words/gestures/actions that manage to ease, just a tiny bit, the pain of your recent losses, or that make that pain just a tiny bit easier to bear.

[Edited 1/7/19 18:17pm]

Reply #38 posted 01/07/19 10:39am

rednblue

onlyforaminute said:

The same exact stuff over and over again. If that's the energy desired around here, then that's the kind of energy desired around here. But let's not dress it up like something caring and empathetic. Its salacious gossip.


I may be completely off base re: what is on your mind, but perhaps romantic interests of famous people also find themselves the targets of a completely irrational level of condemnation.

I'm not saying that lovers/muses/girlfriends/etc. weren't ever naive, or that Prince himself wasn't naive, about how some of these relationships might play out. But the level of careless talk/claims/condemnation, especially vs. appreciation of what these people brought to one another and to the music, is over the top.

Reply #39 posted 01/07/19 11:02am

rednblue

delete

[Edited 1/7/19 11:03am]

Reply #40 posted 01/07/19 11:06am

onlyforaminute

rednblue said:

 



onlyforaminute said:


The same exact stuff over and over again. If that's the energy desired around here, then that's the kind of energy desired around here. But let's not dress it up like something caring and empathetic. Its salacious gossip.


I may be completely off base re: what is on your mind, but perhaps romantic interests of famous people also find themselves the targets of a completely irrational level of condemnation.

I'm not saying that lovers/muses/girlfriends/etc. weren't ever naive, or that Prince himself wasn't naive, about how some of these relationships might play out.  But the level of careless talk/claims/condemnation, especially vs. appreciation of what these people brought to one another and to the music, is over the top.




No I don't like being snowed. I've been on this planet long enough to know what I'm looking at. We've been through several of these threads we know exactly what gets said in them. There hasn't been a drop of new information to explore so it doesn't take a genius to know that the exact same things that were said in the previous threadz are the exact same things that will be said in this one and any others. SSDD. Many folks on the org ARE still grieving but not everybody is here for compassionate reasons regardless of what's said, Actions trump words. Just stop with the bs, is all I'm saying. You wanna gossip and tell fan fiction.
Year of Return 2019
Reply #41 posted 01/07/19 11:10am

rednblue

June7 said:

AnnaStesia10 said:

Thank u June7 for opening up this topic again for anyone on this forum still interested in talking about or reading about it. I for one am interested because for me, I am still not over his death and am in a way haunted by it. It is not a haunt that keeps me up at night or contributes to an unhealthy obsession. A haunt in a sense that I feel, still after the death investigation is over, we all are still not getting the full story. You will have the people here go on and on about leave this alone he deserves his privacy. Let the man rest. But I say since Prince was a beloved public figure who touched the souls of so many and died by the the hands of a major pain med and I am sorry in such an odd way and found in an elevator in his musical oasis, that I do feel his fans and supporters do deserve to know the truth. The truth could bring full closure from any grief and also help people struggling with pain management and possible addiction to get the help they need. This all still does not make any fuckin' sense to me.

Excellent post.

Nobody can, or has the right to, tell anyone for how long they should grieve. I'm coming up to a year in my own son's death (on the 12th), and I'm still beside myself. Talking ... talking ... about his death, him, remembrences, etc., does help.

What people don't understand, or don't think about, is the condition or public understanding of how death affects those immediately surrounding you, or how it actually is felt, or how you're perceived from everytone around you when you lose a loved one, it's expected - we live, we die - it's in the bible. It's life. It's death. Most of us are, and have accepted the fact that this is so. But, when the death is your son, your child, it brings on a whole new sideline of empathy, sympathy and stigma. Yes ... I said stigma.

People are strange.

I have actually lost friends due to his death. Not in a way that they think you suck and have publicly stated that they never want to speak to you again, or anything like that - it's subtle. It's just a disappearance. And, normally I wouldn't have even noticed it if it were someone I was just an aquaintance of. But, this one person is/was a very dear friend, who, when this happened, just ... stopped ... talking ... to ... me.

This one I noticed - and, I called him on it. I called him at home about after a month after Alex died. His wife answered and she seamed slightly surprised I called and was cordial and offered her condolences and stammered out some sympathetic wishes, but seamed kinda nervous. We chatted a bit and I asked to speak to her husband - my 'brother'. That's how close I thought we were.

He got on the phone and my first words to him were, "Are you okay? I mean, are we okay?! Because ... I haven't heard from you in awhile, and I wasn't sure if you heard about Alex (I knew he did, I just threw that in there to offer him an out) and, you know, I don't understand why you didn't reach out?"

He answered, "Oh ... yeah ... I heard about that - and, I am so sorry for your loss ... understand, that it's just too close to my sister's death, I honestly couldn't offer you anything comfort wise, it's all too difficult for me right now".

And, right there, I suddenly wasn't upset with him anymore - just a little hurt that he couldn't have disclosed that to me instead of letting me think we were not as close as I thought we were. This goes back to my first paragraph - and, I don't have the right to tell him how long, or how to grieve.

He apologized, and I know he felt bad, but, so did I for not knowing why he didn't contact me. But, again, I wasn't expected to know.

I wrote a song about Alex and our family (his two siblings and his mother - my ex and myself) called "Easy". After the song talks about our family growing up together, splitting up, etc., it goes into what happened 'in present day' and how I'm dealing/not dealing with this. The last verse, which I believe needs to be brought out more, talked about more, made aware of more is this:

---

"So, please don't stop being my friend

You can stop me on the street again

Say, "How nice it is to see you, man"

Take me for a beer, and then

That might make it easier

Instead of trying to avoid these things - that's not okay

That's not the way

And if you do, that makes it easy

Well, a little bit easy"

---

My point was not to shame him (or those who didn't, or couldn't, talk to me). But, to remind people that being silent hurts even more. The parents who lost a child are shunned. Nobody wants to be reminded in this life that this happens. It's too tragic. So, they instead, subconciously take care of it by not dealing with it at all. And they just stop talking to you. I understand ... I do. But, that's not the way.

This is one of the reasons I believe that his death, Prince's, should not be held silent just to appease those who can't deal with it, or think it's too long after, or etc., etc., etc. Yadda, yadda, yadda. Nobody should put their own beliefs, or restrictions, upon somebody else. Nobody should bitch at another person because their discomfort in dealing with something should be the same yours. You should be able to grieve for as long as you need to, publicly or privately. The choice in posting this thread is that simple for me. And anyone who has discomfort with this discussion should not click on the thread - the topic or subject matter, is clearly listed in the title. If it is not for you, simply skip this thread. No one will miss you or your reason for doing so.

Thank you. And thanks to all of you who have offered your condolences. I can't state how much those little words, or that moment of sympathy means to me.

Tomás - Easy


I second the "excellent post" review!

And thanks to both of you for the touching, disturbing, and thought-provoking observations.

Reply #42 posted 01/07/19 11:32am

rednblue

June7 said:

SpamelaAnusorn said:

I don't trust everybody around Prince I feel like he had too many enemas and people that can get some thing from him.

One can never have too many enemas. Keeps shit real. eek


June7, you bestowed the "excellent post" award. Now I will bestow the "excellent comeback" award.

SpamelaAnusorn, you've met your match.

Reply #43 posted 01/07/19 11:54am

rednblue

PennyPurple said:

June7 said:

Excellent post.

Nobody can, or has the right to, tell anyone for how long they should grieve. I'm coming up to a year in my own son's death (on the 12th), and I'm still beside myself. Talking ... talking ... about his death, him, remembrences, etc., does help.

What people don't understand, or don't think about, is the condition or public understanding of how death affects those immediately surrounding you, or how it actually is felt, or how you're perceived from everytone around you when you lose a loved one, it's expected - we live, we die - it's in the bible. It's life. It's death. Most of us are, and have accepted the fact that this is so. But, when the death is your son, your child, it brings on a whole new sideline of empathy, sympathy and stigma. Yes ... I said stigma.

People are strange.

I have actually lost friends due to his death. Not in a way that they think you suck and have publicly stated that they never want to speak to you again, or anything like that - it's subtle. It's just a disappearance. And, normally I wouldn't have even noticed it if it were someone I was just an aquaintance of. But, this one person is/was a very dear friend, who, when this happened, just ... stopped ... talking ... to ... me.

This one I noticed - and, I called him on it. I called him at home about after a month after Alex died. His wife answered and she seamed slightly surprised I called and was cordial and offered her condolences and stammered out some sympathetic wishes, but seamed kinda nervous. We chatted a bit and I asked to speak to her husband - my 'brother'. That's how close I thought we were.

He got on the phone and my first words to him were, "Are you okay? I mean, are we okay?! Because ... I haven't heard from you in awhile, and I wasn't sure if you heard about Alex (I knew he did, I just threw that in there to offer him an out) and, you know, I don't understand why you didn't reach out?"

He answered, "Oh ... yeah ... I heard about that - and, I am so sorry for your loss ... understand, that it's just too close to my sister's death, I honestly couldn't offer you anything comfort wise, it's all too difficult for me right now".

And, right there, I suddenly wasn't upset with him anymore - just a little hurt that he couldn't have disclosed that to me instead of letting me think we were not as close as I thought we were. This goes back to my first paragraph - and, I don't have the right to tell him how long, or how to grieve.

He apologized, and I know he felt bad, but, so did I for not knowing why he didn't contact me. But, again, I wasn't expected to know.

I wrote a song about Alex and our family (his two siblings and his mother - my ex and myself) called "Easy". After the song talks about our family growing up together, splitting up, etc., it goes into what happened 'in present day' and how I'm dealing/not dealing with this. The last verse, which I believe needs to be brought out more, talked about more, made aware of more is this:

---

"So, please don't stop being my friend

You can stop me on the street again

Say, "How nice it is to see you, man"

Take me for a beer, and then

That might make it easier

Instead of trying to avoid these things - that's not okay

That's not the way

And if you do, that makes it easy

Well, a little bit easy"

---

My point was not to shame him (or those who didn't, or couldn't, talk to me). But, to remind people that being silent hurts even more. The parents who lost a child are shunned. Nobody wants to be reminded in this life that this happens. It's too tragic. So, they instead, subconciously take care of it by not dealing with it at all. And they just stop talking to you. I understand ... I do. But, that's not the way.

This is one of the reasons I believe that his death, Prince's, should not be held silent just to appease those who can't deal with it, or think it's too long after, or etc., etc., etc. Yadda, yadda, yadda. Nobody should put their own beliefs, or restrictions, upon somebody else. Nobody should bitch at another person because their discomfort in dealing with something should be the same yours. You should be able to grieve for as long as you need to, publicly or privately. The choice in posting this thread is that simple for me. And anyone who has discomfort with this discussion should not click on the thread - the topic or subject matter, is clearly listed in the title. If it is not for you, simply skip this thread. No one will miss you or your reason for doing so.

Thank you. And thanks to all of you who have offered your condolences. I can't state how much those little words, or that moment of sympathy means to me.

Tomás - Easy

Wonderful words June.

It is odd how friends just walk away in times of need. My parents had best friends that they would go on vacation with and do everything together, when my Step Dad passed, my Mom never heard from them again. eek

I'm sorry you are going thru such a heartbreaking time. (hugs)


So sad to hear of the turning away that both of your families experienced.

Can't begin to imagine what it's like to have grief met with that. Reaching out can mean an awful lot, even in ordinary circumstances.

Speaking of infinitely easier circumstances, I asked a question on the Org a while back. I said I'd try to shut up and just listen to any who might care to respond. That's just what I did.

Reflecting on all this, I want to thank those who responded. To leec1, Pennypurple, peggyon, others...your words were very much appreciated!

[Edited 1/7/19 12:05pm]

Reply #44 posted 01/07/19 12:11pm

peggyon

I feel that folks are approaching this thread more carefully this time, which is good.

My thoughts

Prince was a very complex individual. Though he had a private side, he also struck me as somewhat needing attention as well. Alan Leeds said he needed approbation. He wanted it both ways. And, as Bodhi mentioned, the genie is out of that bottle.

I grew up Catholic and went to Catholic schools with exceptionally mean nuns where there was alot of shame, abuse, secrets and authoritarianism. (This was my experience only). I think, partly as a result of that upbringing (my parents were liberal, thank God),I am less tolerant of secrets and shame.

There is a large helping of both in Prince's death narrative and I feel the authoritarianism as well...It is basically saying, don't ask questions, accept the 'party line', 'that' did not happen, etc. etc.. Excuse me? As soon as things get too close for comfort, there are the 'designated' orgers (I can name them), who burst out of the woodwork, issuing ultimatums, 'outrage' and threaten to lock the thread.They are predictable and their behavior is questionable to me.

I feel strongly that there are forces who want to manage the narrative as there are 'things' to suppress. After all, lots of money is at stake.

Unfortunately for them, people are naturally wired to return to situations that don't make sense. So, buckle up for a long ride!

All this speculation would cease in minutes if there was honesty and sincerity from those "in the know"

Reply #45 posted 01/07/19 12:22pm

rednblue

onlyforaminute said:

rednblue said:


I may be completely off base re: what is on your mind, but perhaps romantic interests of famous people also find themselves the targets of a completely irrational level of condemnation.

I'm not saying that lovers/muses/girlfriends/etc. weren't ever naive, or that Prince himself wasn't naive, about how some of these relationships might play out. But the level of careless talk/claims/condemnation, especially vs. appreciation of what these people brought to one another and to the music, is over the top.

No I don't like being snowed. I've been on this planet long enough to know what I'm looking at. We've been through several of these threads we know exactly what gets said in them. There hasn't been a drop of new information to explore so it doesn't take a genius to know that the exact same things that were said in the previous threadz are the exact same things that will be said in this one and any others. SSDD. Many folks on the org ARE still grieving but not everybody is here for compassionate reasons regardless of what's said, Actions trump words. Just stop with the bs, is all I'm saying. You wanna gossip and tell fan fiction.


Some find that the way information has been concealed, at times by Prince himself, may well have proved lethal. Some of the concealing in these situations is undoubtedly due to thoughts of condemnation, by oneself and others. Is it nothing but negative to wish for a world where these things are no longer so unspeakable, and lives might be saved as a result?

Would you approve of an Org where discussion of medical issues and/or artistic temperament was outlawed, but all other topics remained?

Reply #46 posted 01/07/19 12:45pm

onlyforaminute

rednblue said:

 



onlyforaminute said:


rednblue said:

 



I may be completely off base re: what is on your mind, but perhaps romantic interests of famous people also find themselves the targets of a completely irrational level of condemnation.

I'm not saying that lovers/muses/girlfriends/etc. weren't ever naive, or that Prince himself wasn't naive, about how some of these relationships might play out.  But the level of careless talk/claims/condemnation, especially vs. appreciation of what these people brought to one another and to the music, is over the top.



No I don't like being snowed. I've been on this planet long enough to know what I'm looking at. We've been through several of these threads we know exactly what gets said in them. There hasn't been a drop of new information to explore so it doesn't take a genius to know that the exact same things that were said in the previous threadz are the exact same things that will be said in this one and any others. SSDD. Many folks on the org ARE still grieving but not everybody is here for compassionate reasons regardless of what's said, Actions trump words. Just stop with the bs, is all I'm saying. You wanna gossip and tell fan fiction.


Some find that the way information has been concealed, at times by Prince himself, may well have proved lethal.  Some of the concealing in these situations is undoubtedly due to thoughts of condemnation, by oneself and others.  Is it nothing but negative to wish for a world where these things are no longer so unspeakable, and lives might be saved as a result?

Would you approve of an Org where discussion of medical issues and/or artistic temperament was outlawed, but all other topics remained?




You did notice this is the 13th, actually the 14th thread on the exact same thing. All facts available have been discussed, nobody here knows a thing about his health or any facts about his medical history so what is being discussed beyond somebody's fantasy and the power struggle that happens when folks compete over which story gets to make it's way into the narrative. It would be different if there was some concrete info but the reality is, there is very little. And the little there is has been twisted in so many exhausting ways that even those facts get repeated incorrectly.
Year of Return 2019
Reply #47 posted 01/07/19 1:00pm

peggyon

onlyforaminute said:

rednblue said:


Some find that the way information has been concealed, at times by Prince himself, may well have proved lethal. Some of the concealing in these situations is undoubtedly due to thoughts of condemnation, by oneself and others. Is it nothing but negative to wish for a world where these things are no longer so unspeakable, and lives might be saved as a result?

Would you approve of an Org where discussion of medical issues and/or artistic temperament was outlawed, but all other topics remained?

You did notice this is the 13th, actually the 14th thread on the exact same thing. All facts available have been discussed, nobody here knows a thing about his health or any facts about his medical history so what is being discussed beyond somebody's fantasy and the power struggle that happens when folks compete over which story gets to make it's way into the narrative. It would be different if there was some concrete info but the reality is, there is very little. And the little there is has been twisted in so many exhausting ways that even those facts get repeated incorrectly.

Why, why, why or why do you insist on commenting on a thread you find so 'inappropriate'?

Everyone has noticed it. Even June7 has asked that folks who find this thread difficult, steer clear.

Please find another thread more to your liking.

Reply #48 posted 01/07/19 1:10pm

AnnaStesia10

Onlyforaminute - I get what you are saying but maybe some of us want and need to still discuss this. Who cares if this is the 13th thread. There are several threads that are discussing topics from what do you think of 20Ten to was Vanity the love of his life to whatever. And who cares some posters wish to still discuss this. And it is not a veiled attempt to gossip about Prince's medical history or whatever. The exchange of personal stories, thoughts, theories and emotions are beneficial and thought-provoking. If it is not your cup of tea, then why do you come on here to try to change our minds or make us feel like really, you wanna keep talking about this. It is strange to me. Don't post then if you are not getting it. I do not post on threads that are not my thing. I may read them but I respect the fellow posters right to their view points and ideas because that is how I want to be treated.
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #49 posted 01/07/19 1:13pm

Bodhitheblackdog

peggyon said:

onlyforaminute said:

rednblue said: You did notice this is the 13th, actually the 14th thread on the exact same thing. All facts available have been discussed, nobody here knows a thing about his health or any facts about his medical history so what is being discussed beyond somebody's fantasy and the power struggle that happens when folks compete over which story gets to make it's way into the narrative. It would be different if there was some concrete info but the reality is, there is very little. And the little there is has been twisted in so many exhausting ways that even those facts get repeated incorrectly.

Why, why, why or why do you insist on commenting on a thread you find so 'inappropriate'?

Everyone has noticed it. Even June7 has asked that folks who find this thread difficult, steer clear.

Please find another thread more to your liking.

Thanks, peggyon, and AnnaStesia10, my thoughts exactly. Even if no more information about Prince's death were ever to come to light (unlikely IMO), reflections on the manner of his death can only be helpful to Org. members who are struggling with addiction or the addictions of loved ones. I don't think this is a bad thing and is certainly more compassionate, humane and of more lasting value than the endless debates on the Org. as to which Prince album cover was the best or whether physical sales of vinal or CD's are much more valuable than streaming numbers. I would never consider going on those threads and bashing those who are interested in that topic. Why the desperate attempts to stifle conversation over the manner and causes of his death???

[Edited 1/7/19 13:23pm]

Reply #50 posted 01/07/19 1:52pm

onlyforaminute

I haven't bashed one person so stop playing victim. Nobody has to respond to my post anymore than they think I don't have the right to make them. I expressed my opinion there are a variety of folks around and these threads aren't compassionate to them so cut the bs. We've seen the content already, 13 times. Stop putting glitter on a turd calling it jewelry.
Year of Return 2019
Reply #51 posted 01/07/19 2:04pm

June7

Moderator

moderator

onlyforaminute said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

That is the beauty, horror, reality of cyber communication throughout the wired-up world, not just on Prince.Org.

People can be, express, feel whatever they are compelled to share with anyone and everyone (sometimes at their own peril) but, nevertheless, such participation can be liberating, authentic and creative.

To paraphrase June7's comments...those who feel unease about this rampant 'sharing'...should perhaps avoid fan sites, chat rooms, comments sections on news stories, social media, etc.

It's a personal choice to 'go there.'

But that exact same reasoning can be applied to everything. Yet tha rules on this board is there is no rights to free speech here. Everything has limits. Truth. Not everyone knew or adored his son. I doubt he'd want those people all up in his house expressing all their feelings and then telling members of his family they can go to another room where they don't have to hear it. [Edited 1/7/19 9:27am]

I think what you're attempting to do is very transparent. The reality is that I've put my son's death in the spotlight as soon as it happened, because of my postion here for almost twenty years, and because it happened, and I am an admin on this site and the FB page. Nobody wants to hear any shit talk about their child, dead or alive.

The thought that you perceive this to be okay on the org, because it's on the org, and this is 'another room' is ridiculous. No shit talk is okay, and though we try, we don't catch it all, and so many posting on this site have created horrifically offensive threads that have delved into every aspect of his life - from his women to his penis. With your logic in the above post, we should probably shut the site down, out of respect.

Again, and this can't be said enough. If this thread offends you DON'T CLICK ON IT, AND CERTAINLY, DON'T POST ON IT. I may have to start offering a three day vacation from here to those who insist on doing so anyway - and you're right again. Free speech is not guaranteed here at all. We control it. i control it. And that power is utiized.

[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #52 posted 01/07/19 2:32pm

onlyforaminute

June7 said:

 



onlyforaminute said:


Bodhitheblackdog said:

 


That is the beauty, horror, reality of cyber communication throughout the wired-up world, not just on Prince.Org.


 


People can be, express, feel whatever they are compelled to share with anyone and everyone (sometimes at their own peril) but, nevertheless, such participation can be liberating, authentic and creative.


 


To paraphrase June7's comments...those who feel unease about this rampant 'sharing'...should perhaps avoid fan sites, chat rooms, comments sections on news stories, social media, etc.


 


It's a personal choice to 'go there.'



But that exact same reasoning can be applied to everything. Yet tha rules on this board is there is no rights to free speech here. Everything has limits. Truth. Not everyone knew or adored his son. I doubt he'd want those people all up in his house expressing all their feelings and then telling members of his family they can go to another room where they don't have to hear it. [Edited 1/7/19 9:27am]

 


 


I think what you're attempting to do is very transparent. The reality is that I've put my son's death in the spotlight as soon as it happened, because of my postion here for almost twenty years, and because it happened, and I am an admin on this site and the FB page. Nobody wants to hear any shit talk about their child, dead or alive.


 


The thought that you perceive this to be okay on the org, because it's on the org, and this is 'another room' is ridiculous. No shit talk is okay, and though we try, we don't catch it all, and so many posting on this site have created horrifically offensive threads that have delved into every aspect of his life - from his women to his penis. With your logic in the above post, we should probably shut the site down, out of respect. 


 


Again, and this can't be said enough. If this thread offends you DON'T CLICK ON IT, AND CERTAINLY, DON'T POST ON IT. I may have to start offering a three day vacation from here to those who insist on doing so anyway - and you're right again. Free speech is not guaranteed here at all. We control it. i control it. And that power is utiized. 



I can appreciate that. I'm just noting one group of people's feelings keep overriding others, and the others are being told to go sit in a corner somewhere. I've been here from before the very 1st investigation thread so I'm not oblivious to what gets talked about in them and there has been some mean spirited painful things that show up in them. Unlike other threads these are about his death which makes them unique
and these particular ones are coming off as sanctioned and blessed by moderators because you all keep saying you can't catch everything. That is probably the largest complaints about these thread is where they go when the facts run out and since there aren't many facts to talk about then all off-road every single one goes. And other grieving fans just have to put up with it and say nothing.
Year of Return 2019
Reply #53 posted 01/07/19 2:37pm

June7

Moderator

moderator

onlyforaminute said:

June7 said:

I think what you're attempting to do is very transparent. The reality is that I've put my son's death in the spotlight as soon as it happened, because of my postion here for almost twenty years, and because it happened, and I am an admin on this site and the FB page. Nobody wants to hear any shit talk about their child, dead or alive.

The thought that you perceive this to be okay on the org, because it's on the org, and this is 'another room' is ridiculous. No shit talk is okay, and though we try, we don't catch it all, and so many posting on this site have created horrifically offensive threads that have delved into every aspect of his life - from his women to his penis. With your logic in the above post, we should probably shut the site down, out of respect.

Again, and this can't be said enough. If this thread offends you DON'T CLICK ON IT, AND CERTAINLY, DON'T POST ON IT. I may have to start offering a three day vacation from here to those who insist on doing so anyway - and you're right again. Free speech is not guaranteed here at all. We control it. i control it. And that power is utiized.

I can appreciate that. I'm just noting one group of people's feelings keep overriding others, and the others are being told to go sit in a corner somewhere. I've been here from before the very 1st investigation thread so I'm not oblivious to what gets talked about in them and there has been some mean spirited painful things that show up in them. Unlike other threads these are about his death which makes them unique and these particular ones are coming off as sanctioned and blessed by moderators because you all keep saying you can't catch everything. That is probably the largest complaints about these thread is where they go when the facts run out and since there aren't many facts to talk about then all off-road every single one goes. And other grieving fans just have to put up with it and say nothing.

I get what you're saying. I do. The truth is, most Mods wanted these threads done away with. I saw what happened. It is my belief that if you are stifling conversation, any reasonable conversation, you are stifling the one purpose people come here for - to discuss Prince. And, sadly, his death is now part of that discussion. And where else can you go if you want to discuss his death, if not aat a Prince fansite? Doesn't that make sense?

This thread won't be like the others. I'm going to be all over it, which is what I told the other mods when I decided to let it continue.

[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #54 posted 01/07/19 3:02pm

onlyforaminute

June7 said:

 



onlyforaminute said:


June7 said:

 


 


 


I think what you're attempting to do is very transparent. The reality is that I've put my son's death in the spotlight as soon as it happened, because of my postion here for almost twenty years, and because it happened, and I am an admin on this site and the FB page. Nobody wants to hear any shit talk about their child, dead or alive.


 


The thought that you perceive this to be okay on the org, because it's on the org, and this is 'another room' is ridiculous. No shit talk is okay, and though we try, we don't catch it all, and so many posting on this site have created horrifically offensive threads that have delved into every aspect of his life - from his women to his penis. With your logic in the above post, we should probably shut the site down, out of respect. 


 


Again, and this can't be said enough. If this thread offends you DON'T CLICK ON IT, AND CERTAINLY, DON'T POST ON IT. I may have to start offering a three day vacation from here to those who insist on doing so anyway - and you're right again. Free speech is not guaranteed here at all. We control it. i control it. And that power is utiized. 



I can appreciate that. I'm just noting one group of people's feelings keep overriding others, and the others are being told to go sit in a corner somewhere. I've been here from before the very 1st investigation thread so I'm not oblivious to what gets talked about in them and there has been some mean spirited painful things that show up in them. Unlike other threads these are about his death which makes them unique and these particular ones are coming off as sanctioned and blessed by moderators because you all keep saying you can't catch everything. That is probably the largest complaints about these thread is where they go when the facts run out and since there aren't many facts to talk about then all off-road every single one goes. And other grieving fans just have to put up with it and say nothing.

 


I get what you're saying. I do. The truth is, most Mods wanted these threads done away with. I saw what happened. It is my belief that if you are stifling conversation, any reasonable conversation, you are stifling the one purpose people come here for - to discuss Prince. And, sadly, his death is now part of that discussion. And where else can you go if you want to discuss his death, if not aat a Prince fansite? Doesn't that make sense? 


 


This thread won't be like the others. I'm going to be all over it, which is what I told the other mods when I decided to let it continue. 




Well cool. Then there should be no problems.
Year of Return 2019
Reply #55 posted 01/07/19 3:30pm

AnnaStesia10

Right on June7. And well said, this is a Prince fan site and the sad truth is he did die and in a shocking way. And thank you again for opening up this convo it is needed. We discuss everything else and this one main recent event can be thought of as off limits in some peoples eyes is unbelivable. Death is part of life. Funky part of life but true.

I wanted to address your 2nd post on this thread about the loss of Alex. Again, my heart goes out to you and your family and how this has affectrd some of your frienships. You hurt my heart when you mentioned stigma associated with your childs death. It is so sad but can be true. Friends and fam should be there when any type of tragedy occurs and especially in a death of a family member.

I cannot fathom the loss of a child and god bless you for your strength and courage in speaking about this. It is not easy. I have had experiecned loss of family and friends due to a stigma topic such as addiction and I find the same avoidance and "I dont know what to say" vibe still to this day. As you had said before, we all have our ways to deal with grief it is a personal journey. I know people that like to talk about it and people that like to tuck the feelings deep down inside and lock them up. To each is own. I feel you have to look at it like what is the healtiest path to recovery and to move on as best you can for you. For me, it is talking about it and to know that I am not alone with my thoughts and feelings. For my best friend, he likes to keep things inside and in a sense bury them. To each is own.

I appreciate you talking about it and if you feel inclined to speak some more about Alex, I will listen to you and share some stories of my own. I feel all of us on this site have alot of similarities when it comes to love and loss and even in areas of addiction and loss. We are all very much connected even if just via our bad-ass taste for music and our affinity for Prince.

June7 thank you again and to all of you posters out there for your thoughts, investigative work, theories and personal stories. It is not in vain, not gossip and it helps me and others feel we are not alone in this crazy world.

*Edited for typo*
[Edited 1/7/19 15:32pm]
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #56 posted 01/07/19 3:46pm

PennyPurple

Why has Carver County taken down the investigative documents?

Reply #57 posted 01/07/19 4:39pm

AnnaStesia10

I was wondering that too. They have been off the site for a while. I even tried to reach out to the contact via email and was given basically a non-answer and was told to contact some other official. Those doc's are public records and should be available. My only thought is you now have to formally request them to view like a FOIA request now. I am not sure how it works for the state of Minnesota.

I got really busy when I received that email and knew it was a b.s. answer and didnt have time to play the game. I can reach out again and see what is up. If anyone else has any info on this, let us know if you dont mind.

*edited for typos*
[Edited 1/7/19 16:41pm]
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #58 posted 01/07/19 5:29pm

peggyon

AnnaStesia10 said:

I was wondering that too. They have been off the site for a while. I even tried to reach out to the contact via email and was given basically a non-answer and was told to contact some other official. Those doc's are public records and should be available. My only thought is you now have to formally request them to view like a FOIA request now. I am not sure how it works for the state of Minnesota. I got really busy when I received that email and knew it was a b.s. answer and didnt have time to play the game. I can reach out again and see what is up. If anyone else has any info on this, let us know if you dont mind. *edited for typos* [Edited 1/7/19 16:41pm]

Aren't they accessible through the Death Investigation threads?

Reply #59 posted 01/07/19 5:34pm

AnnaStesia10

They could be if posters saved the files on their own computers and then attached. I havent gone back to those threads plus some were taken down due to heated convo's from some posters.
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #60 posted 01/07/19 5:43pm

PennyPurple

I've saved them on my computer but I can not share them for some reason, here is the link to the NY Times files.



https://www.nytimes.com/i...iles1.html

Reply #61 posted 01/07/19 5:52pm

Mumio

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:


Well, well, well.

Someone who reappears as soon as this thread is started.



lol

Welcome to "the org", Mumio…they can have you, but I'll have your love in the end nod
Reply #62 posted 01/07/19 6:18pm

AnnaStesia10

Thanks PennyPurple I found that link too. To you does it look like the complete investigative files thay were released back in April 2018 minus the photos and videos?

I remember viewing some docs back then but I wasnt ready to read and view it was jusy too real for me. Then I wss thinkin its ok I can always go back and view later. Now info is off the Carver County website which is weird. Thanks Penny.
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #63 posted 01/07/19 6:37pm

Cecy

Everything was moved to a Dropbox link when the Carver County website kept crashing. That info isn't there anymore but the Dropbox link is still accessible with all the original files https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dvygxzyvtqwtvwb/AAC9sn7-Srj227RoySDdXQD4a?dl=0
Reply #64 posted 01/07/19 7:04pm

AnnaStesia10

Thanx Cecy. Much appreciated! 💜
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #65 posted 01/08/19 2:16am

SpamelaAnusorn

rednblue said:

June7 said:

One can never have too many enemas. Keeps shit real. eek


June7, you bestowed the "excellent post" award. Now I will bestow the "excellent comeback" award.

SpamelaAnusorn, you've met your match.

ok I don't know what this means

I like it when u DANCE 4 MEN!! Hallerlujah
Reply #66 posted 01/08/19 7:02am

rednblue

SpamelaAnusorn said:

rednblue said:


June7, you bestowed the "excellent post" award. Now I will bestow the "excellent comeback" award.

SpamelaAnusorn, you've met your match.

ok I don't know what this means


When it comes to word play, maybe urine over your head? biggrin

Reply #67 posted 01/08/19 9:28am

Bodhitheblackdog

rednblue said:

SpamelaAnusorn said:

ok I don't know what this means


When it comes to word play, maybe urine over your head? biggrin

OMG, toooo funny...what a way to start the day!

Reply #68 posted 01/08/19 10:38am

ABro

onlyforaminute said:

The same exact stuff over and over again. If that's the energy desired around here, then that's the kind of energy desired around here. But let's not dress it up like something caring and empathetic. Its salacious gossip.

clapping
The character assassination of Prince is endlessly titillating.
Neverending speculation.
Armchair psychology.
Projections.
Feeding.
Juicy.

"So much has been written about me, & people don't know what's right & what's wrong. I'd rather let them stay confused." ~ Prince.
Reply #69 posted 01/08/19 11:10am

rednblue

ABro said:

onlyforaminute said:

The same exact stuff over and over again. If that's the energy desired around here, then that's the kind of energy desired around here. But let's not dress it up like something caring and empathetic. Its salacious gossip.

clapping
The character assassination of Prince is endlessly titillating.
Neverending speculation.
Armchair psychology.
Projections.
Feeding.
Juicy.



Is is character assassination to say someone may have suffered from diabetes? Someone might say it's "none of our business," but you choose the words character assassination?

Have you applied the words "character assassination" to many other Org topics?

If not, I guess this is the standout place on the Org to find:

"Neverending speculation.
Armchair psychology.
Projections.
Feeding.
Juicy."

Interesting assessments people make.

Reply #70 posted 01/08/19 11:20am

Bodhitheblackdog

ABro said:

onlyforaminute said:

The same exact stuff over and over again. If that's the energy desired around here, then that's the kind of energy desired around here. But let's not dress it up like something caring and empathetic. Its salacious gossip.

clapping
The character assassination of Prince is endlessly titillating.
Neverending speculation.
Armchair psychology.
Projections.
Feeding.
Juicy.

"So much has been written about me, & people don't know what's right & what's wrong. I'd rather let them stay confused." ~ Prince.

Good job. You have chosen the perfect Prince quote to illustrate and explain why there has been "neverending speculation" about his death. Perhaps if his death hadn't been so confusingly at odds with the life he led people to think he really led the "armchair psychology" (aka as wisdom born of experience) wouldn't be so prevalent. As to the "character assassination" observations...it's not like he died of natural causes at a ripe old age surrounded by his loving family and friends. We all have to deal with that sad reality and ignoring the horrific circumstances will not make them go away...it's called denial...and denial was a factor in his death.

Reply #71 posted 01/08/19 11:29am

peggyon

ABro said:

clapping
The character assassination of Prince is endlessly titillating.
Neverending speculation.
Armchair psychology.
Projections.
Feeding.
Juicy.

I thought we had this conversation yesterday. June 7 has asked that orgers who find this thread

disturbing should not be posting. SIGH...

[Edited 1/8/19 12:03pm]

Reply #72 posted 01/08/19 12:25pm

PennyPurple

peggyon said:

I thought we had this conversation yesterday. June 7 has asked that orgers who find this thread

disturbing should not be posting. SIGH...

[Edited 1/8/19 12:03pm]

Yeah, I thouht that stuff was suppose to stop??

Reply #73 posted 01/08/19 2:51pm

ABro

Death thread part 14.
First (& last) I've commented on.
15 words triggered "people" who've typed in thousands on 14 Death threads.
Hit dogs holla.

"So much has been written about me, & people don't know what's right & what's wrong. I'd rather let them stay confused." ~ Prince.
Reply #74 posted 01/08/19 4:18pm

rednblue

ABro said:

Death thread part 14.
First (& last) I've commented on.
15 words triggered "people" who've typed in thousands on 14 Death threads.
Hit dogs holla.


Just before your recent appearance, I said, "there's such a long way to go." That's my holla, and you'll hear it again, because there are so many with this attitude. You're far from the first, and you won't be the last.

Amidst the endless topics on the Org, you single out a topic related to P possibly having been in a difficult place with a substance. Many Org topics are discussed repeatedly, and at great length, despite "no new developments." You single out this topic as "character assassination of Prince."

So I could thank you for affirming my statement. However, I don't need your affirmation, as folks with such attitude are everywhere.

Long way to go, indeed.

[Edited 1/8/19 17:24pm]

Reply #75 posted 01/08/19 6:47pm

nelcp777

Carver county could have got dna from Kirk or the record store owner from discarded items to test the pill bottles. The second bag that the dea found containing more pills may clue when or who provided the pills.
Reply #76 posted 01/08/19 6:52pm

Bodhitheblackdog

nelcp777 said:

Carver county could have got dna from Kirk or the record store owner from discarded items to test the pill bottles. The second bag that the dea found containing more pills may clue when or who provided the pills.

From reading the investigation file, I've never gotten the impression that LE was terribly concerned about where he got the deadly pills. I wonder why...

Reply #77 posted 01/08/19 7:30pm

peggyon

nelcp777 said:

Carver county could have got dna from Kirk or the record store owner from discarded items to test the pill bottles. The second bag that the dea found containing more pills may clue when or who provided the pills.

Do you mean the guy who was back-stage in Atlanta? I don't remember, did LE talk with him?

Reply #78 posted 01/08/19 9:29pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

peggyon said:

nelcp777 said:

Carver county could have got dna from Kirk or the record store owner from discarded items to test the pill bottles. The second bag that the dea found containing more pills may clue when or who provided the pills.

Do you mean the guy who was back-stage in Atlanta? I don't remember, did LE talk with him?



I could not find that he was interviewed.

Reply #79 posted 01/09/19 6:19am

nelcp777

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

peggyon said:

Do you mean the guy who was back-stage in Atlanta? I don't remember, did LE talk with him?



I could not find that he was interviewed.

I do not believe that was ever pursued either. Maybe the DEA did, but I am not sure on their investigation.

I just found it interesting that a second bag contained the pills (amongst other areas). But the bags were for travel, so it may help investigators pinpoint a location or contact.

Investigators are supposed to look into each lead and rule out false leads. This strengthens the case if it goes to trial.

If this case was ever to go to trial, it would be a defending lawyers playground (and I do not mean that in any negative way). Perhaps the DA was frustrated with the investigation during his review?

Reply #80 posted 01/09/19 3:55pm

leec1

nelcp777 said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



I could not find that he was interviewed.

I do not believe that was ever pursued either. Maybe the DEA did, but I am not sure on their investigation.

I just found it interesting that a second bag contained the pills (amongst other areas). But the bags were for travel, so it may help investigators pinpoint a location or contact.

Investigators are supposed to look into each lead and rule out false leads. This strengthens the case if it goes to trial.

If this case was ever to go to trial, it would be a defending lawyers playground (and I do not mean that in any negative way). Perhaps the DA was frustrated with the investigation during his review?

Below is the link to the KSTP article on the DEA investigation which has the link to the actual DEA investigation file in case anyone needs access to this information.

https://kstp.com/news/new-documents-describe-princes-stay-in-an-illinois-hospital-/5012465/

Reply #81 posted 01/09/19 8:05pm

Rev

June7 said:

AnnaStesia10 said:

Thank u June7 for opening up this topic again for anyone on this forum still interested in talking about or reading about it. I for one am interested because for me, I am still not over his death and am in a way haunted by it. It is not a haunt that keeps me up at night or contributes to an unhealthy obsession. A haunt in a sense that I feel, still after the death investigation is over, we all are still not getting the full story. You will have the people here go on and on about leave this alone he deserves his privacy. Let the man rest. But I say since Prince was a beloved public figure who touched the souls of so many and died by the the hands of a major pain med and I am sorry in such an odd way and found in an elevator in his musical oasis, that I do feel his fans and supporters do deserve to know the truth. The truth could bring full closure from any grief and also help people struggling with pain management and possible addiction to get the help they need. This all still does not make any fuckin' sense to me.

Excellent post.

Nobody can, or has the right to, tell anyone for how long they should grieve. I'm coming up to a year in my own son's death (on the 12th), and I'm still beside myself. Talking ... talking ... about his death, him, remembrences, etc., does help.

What people don't understand, or don't think about, is the condition or public understanding of how death affects those immediately surrounding you, or how it actually is felt, or how you're perceived from everytone around you when you lose a loved one, it's expected - we live, we die - it's in the bible. It's life. It's death. Most of us are, and have accepted the fact that this is so. But, when the death is your son, your child, it brings on a whole new sideline of empathy, sympathy and stigma. Yes ... I said stigma.

People are strange.

I have actually lost friends due to his death. Not in a way that they think you suck and have publicly stated that they never want to speak to you again, or anything like that - it's subtle. It's just a disappearance. And, normally I wouldn't have even noticed it if it were someone I was just an aquaintance of. But, this one person is/was a very dear friend, who, when this happened, just ... stopped ... talking ... to ... me.

This one I noticed - and, I called him on it. I called him at home about after a month after Alex died. His wife answered and she seamed slightly surprised I called and was cordial and offered her condolences and stammered out some sympathetic wishes, but seamed kinda nervous. We chatted a bit and I asked to speak to her husband - my 'brother'. That's how close I thought we were.

He got on the phone and my first words to him were, "Are you okay? I mean, are we okay?! Because ... I haven't heard from you in awhile, and I wasn't sure if you heard about Alex (I knew he did, I just threw that in there to offer him an out) and, you know, I don't understand why you didn't reach out?"

He answered, "Oh ... yeah ... I heard about that - and, I am so sorry for your loss ... understand, that it's just too close to my sister's death, I honestly couldn't offer you anything comfort wise, it's all too difficult for me right now".

And, right there, I suddenly wasn't upset with him anymore - just a little hurt that he couldn't have disclosed that to me instead of letting me think we were not as close as I thought we were. This goes back to my first paragraph - and, I don't have the right to tell him how long, or how to grieve.

He apologized, and I know he felt bad, but, so did I for not knowing why he didn't contact me. But, again, I wasn't expected to know.

I wrote a song about Alex and our family (his two siblings and his mother - my ex and myself) called "Easy". After the song talks about our family growing up together, splitting up, etc., it goes into what happened 'in present day' and how I'm dealing/not dealing with this. The last verse, which I believe needs to be brought out more, talked about more, made aware of more is this:

---

"So, please don't stop being my friend

You can stop me on the street again

Say, "How nice it is to see you, man"

Take me for a beer, and then

That might make it easier

Instead of trying to avoid these things - that's not okay

That's not the way

And if you do, that makes it easy

Well, a little bit easy"

---

My point was not to shame him (or those who didn't, or couldn't, talk to me). But, to remind people that being silent hurts even more. The parents who lost a child are shunned. Nobody wants to be reminded in this life that this happens. It's too tragic. So, they instead, subconciously take care of it by not dealing with it at all. And they just stop talking to you. I understand ... I do. But, that's not the way.

This is one of the reasons I believe that his death, Prince's, should not be held silent just to appease those who can't deal with it, or think it's too long after, or etc., etc., etc. Yadda, yadda, yadda. Nobody should put their own beliefs, or restrictions, upon somebody else. Nobody should bitch at another person because their discomfort in dealing with something should be the same yours. You should be able to grieve for as long as you need to, publicly or privately. The choice in posting this thread is that simple for me. And anyone who has discomfort with this discussion should not click on the thread - the topic or subject matter, is clearly listed in the title. If it is not for you, simply skip this thread. No one will miss you or your reason for doing so.

Thank you. And thanks to all of you who have offered your condolences. I can't state how much those little words, or that moment of sympathy means to me.

Tomás - Easy

Good evening June7,

I've never commented on a post of yours in the time I've been here. Sorry for the loss of your son. I have a teenage daughter and don't know how I could handle that. I'm of the age where my parents generation are passing quickly. It's sad.

Prince was in essence my imaginary friend as a teenager. His passing from his addiction was devestating and confusing. This format to communicate and share is valuable.

Thank you for your efforts to keep this Prince thing alive.

Reply #82 posted 01/10/19 12:08pm

nelcp777

leec1 said:

nelcp777 said:

I do not believe that was ever pursued either. Maybe the DEA did, but I am not sure on their investigation.

I just found it interesting that a second bag contained the pills (amongst other areas). But the bags were for travel, so it may help investigators pinpoint a location or contact.

Investigators are supposed to look into each lead and rule out false leads. This strengthens the case if it goes to trial.

If this case was ever to go to trial, it would be a defending lawyers playground (and I do not mean that in any negative way). Perhaps the DA was frustrated with the investigation during his review?

Below is the link to the KSTP article on the DEA investigation which has the link to the actual DEA investigation file in case anyone needs access to this information.

https://kstp.com/news/new-documents-describe-princes-stay-in-an-illinois-hospital-/5012465/

I have looked at the DEA files that were released, but wonder if that is all that is in the files.

I wonder if any agency has spoken with Chaka Kahn. She voluntarily went into rehab for fentanyl after Prince's passing. She may have had the same source.

Reply #83 posted 01/10/19 12:55pm

XxAxX

rednblue said:

SpamelaAnusorn said:

ok I don't know what this means


When it comes to word play, maybe urine over your head? biggrin



nod maybe ole Spamula simply hasn't ma-turd enough to understand yet

Reply #84 posted 01/10/19 2:20pm

leec1

nelcp777 said:

leec1 said:

Below is the link to the KSTP article on the DEA investigation which has the link to the actual DEA investigation file in case anyone needs access to this information.

https://kstp.com/news/new-documents-describe-princes-stay-in-an-illinois-hospital-/5012465/

I have looked at the DEA files that were released, but wonder if that is all that is in the files.

I wonder if any agency has spoken with Chaka Kahn. She voluntarily went into rehab for fentanyl after Prince's passing. She may have had the same source.

I am mostly familiar with Chaka Khan's music. Does she live in Minneapolis? I thought she stopped touring with Prince in the early 2000's.

I have to review the DEA file in greater detail but there are probably redacted parts to their file.

Reply #85 posted 01/10/19 2:36pm

nelcp777

leec1 said:

nelcp777 said:

I have looked at the DEA files that were released, but wonder if that is all that is in the files.

I wonder if any agency has spoken with Chaka Kahn. She voluntarily went into rehab for fentanyl after Prince's passing. She may have had the same source.

I am mostly familiar with Chaka Khan's music. Does she live in Minneapolis? I thought she stopped touring with Prince in the early 2000's.

I have to review the DEA file in greater detail but there are probably redacted parts to their file.

They may not have the same supplier, but it would be something to look into. Maybe she was using pill form. She may have had the same connections without even knowing it.I do know that Prince's passing scared her enough to get help (the announcement said as much).

There was a lot of leads that were just dropped or never followed up on.

I am still confused on the dialud. It was in P's system on the 20th. None were found by Carver County during their initial search. But to put things in perspective, they did miss the 2 bottles of fentanyl in the vitamin c containers. I am not dogging anyway, just stating facts.

I am also stuck on the last part of the doctor visit on the 20th. Per Dr. S, he and Prince spent almost 30 minutes talking about withdrawal from opiattes (paraphrased). I wonder if Prince had a major reality check that he was not getting off this stuff on his own. Which is slightly confirmed of what he told Kirk in the car about not beating it (paraphrased).

I also did not see a shredder in the photos of PP during the initial search. Though it could have been overlooked. I only mention this because of the accusation the Phaedra, Meron and Kirk were shredding things.I wonder if this has ever been validated.

Reply #86 posted 01/10/19 5:17pm

June7

Moderator

moderator

Good evening June7,


 


I've never commented on a post of yours in the time I've been here. Sorry for the loss of your son. I have a teenage daughter and don't know how I could handle that. I'm of the age where my parents generation are passing quickly. It's sad.


 


Prince was in essence my imaginary friend as a teenager. His passing from his addiction was devestating and confusing. This format to communicate and share is valuable.


 


Thank you for your efforts to keep this Prince thing alive.



You’re welcome. I believe it to be an important part of healing - discussion. Thanks for your comments. I appreciate them.
[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #87 posted 01/10/19 6:23pm

PennyPurple

Here is the FB page of Jay Corn the author of The Death of Prince Rogers Nelson. He brings up some interesting things. This is what he said today.

Kiran Sharma told me WhatsApp conversations between Kirk, Phaedra and Meron took place both *before* and after Prince’s death. Kiran classified her interactions with law enforcement as “very frustrating,” adding they “did not release everything I said.” More soon.





https://www.facebook.com/...e_internal



In the below link you can go to the evidence tab and he's got the investigation files seperated into groups. **If you don't want to look at the photo's then don't click on the photo tab.**



https://thedeathofprincer...RpQCSYWlzs

Reply #88 posted 01/10/19 9:50pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

PennyPurple said:

Here is the FB page of Jay Corn the author of The Death of Prince Rogers Nelson. He brings up some interesting things. This is what he said today.

Kiran Sharma told me WhatsApp conversations between Kirk, Phaedra and Meron took place both *before* and after Prince’s death. Kiran classified her interactions with law enforcement as “very frustrating,” adding they “did not release everything I said.” More soon.





https://www.facebook.com/...e_internal



In the below link you can go to the evidence tab and he's got the investigation files seperated into groups. **If you don't want to look at the photo's then don't click on the photo tab.**



https://thedeathofprincer...RpQCSYWlzs



Well then.... Kiran should have told us what she said that was not released.

Lawdy.

Another cryptic associate who wants us to figure out the puzzle on our own while throwing darts to law enforcement.

Reply #89 posted 01/11/19 3:38am

PURPLEIZED3121

Important & quick point of note. Did anyone see Andy Murray's press conferance announcing his pending retirement at the age of 31. This follows hip surgery & the pain is apparently incredibly bad & has left him unable to tie his shoe laces without pain.

This makes you truly appreciate how much pain P must have been in & to continue working, touring, writing, recording was frankly a miracle.

His quality of life [Prince's] would have been truly awful as he got older even after possible withdrawly treatment for dependancy.

Reply #90 posted 01/11/19 4:57am

Dimitri10

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

Important & quick point of note. Did anyone see Andy Murray's press conferance announcing his pending retirement at the age of 31. This follows hip surgery & the pain is apparently incredibly bad & has left him unable to tie his shoe laces without pain.

This makes you truly appreciate how much pain P must have been in & to continue working, touring, writing, recording was frankly a miracle.

His quality of life [Prince's] would have been truly awful as he got older even after possible withdrawly treatment for dependancy.

Yes did see this and its very sad, he had more left in him.

On the subject of Prince, he indeed was also an athlete and performing the way he did with the same injury is unbelievable.

I played soccer for many years and all the injuries are causing issues later on now in life, truly frustrating and can relate.

"Prince don't know how many hits he got"
Reply #91 posted 01/11/19 6:13am

leec1

nelcp777 said:

leec1 said:

I am mostly familiar with Chaka Khan's music. Does she live in Minneapolis? I thought she stopped touring with Prince in the early 2000's.

I have to review the DEA file in greater detail but there are probably redacted parts to their file.

They may not have the same supplier, but it would be something to look into. Maybe she was using pill form. She may have had the same connections without even knowing it.I do know that Prince's passing scared her enough to get help (the announcement said as much).

There was a lot of leads that were just dropped or never followed up on.

I am still confused on the dialud. It was in P's system on the 20th. None were found by Carver County during their initial search. But to put things in perspective, they did miss the 2 bottles of fentanyl in the vitamin c containers. I am not dogging anyway, just stating facts.

I am also stuck on the last part of the doctor visit on the 20th. Per Dr. S, he and Prince spent almost 30 minutes talking about withdrawal from opiattes (paraphrased). I wonder if Prince had a major reality check that he was not getting off this stuff on his own. Which is slightly confirmed of what he told Kirk in the car about not beating it (paraphrased).

I also did not see a shredder in the photos of PP during the initial search. Though it could have been overlooked. I only mention this because of the accusation the Phaedra, Meron and Kirk were shredding things.I wonder if this has ever been validated.

I don't want to sound elitist but I have wondered if this investigation had taken place in a major city such as: New York, Los Angeles or Chicago if the outcome would have different. The major cities I mention have large homicide divisions and should be better suited to handle a high profile death.

To my knowledge, the shredding was mentioned by Omar to the police and is thirdhand information which may be why LE chose not to pursue this.

Reply #92 posted 01/11/19 6:43am

PURPLEIZED3121

leec1 said:

nelcp777 said:

They may not have the same supplier, but it would be something to look into. Maybe she was using pill form. She may have had the same connections without even knowing it.I do know that Prince's passing scared her enough to get help (the announcement said as much).

There was a lot of leads that were just dropped or never followed up on.

I am still confused on the dialud. It was in P's system on the 20th. None were found by Carver County during their initial search. But to put things in perspective, they did miss the 2 bottles of fentanyl in the vitamin c containers. I am not dogging anyway, just stating facts.

I am also stuck on the last part of the doctor visit on the 20th. Per Dr. S, he and Prince spent almost 30 minutes talking about withdrawal from opiattes (paraphrased). I wonder if Prince had a major reality check that he was not getting off this stuff on his own. Which is slightly confirmed of what he told Kirk in the car about not beating it (paraphrased).

I also did not see a shredder in the photos of PP during the initial search. Though it could have been overlooked. I only mention this because of the accusation the Phaedra, Meron and Kirk were shredding things.I wonder if this has ever been validated.

I don't want to sound elitist but I have wondered if this investigation had taken place in a major city such as: New York, Los Angeles or Chicago if the outcome would have different. The major cities I mention have large homicide divisions and should be better suited to handle a high profile death.

To my knowledge, the shredding was mentioned by Omar to the police and is thirdhand information which may be why LE chose not to pursue this.

thta's a whole new thread on the recent book released. Totally agree with you...Carver County seemed totally inept & way out of their depth. Can't imagine Meron B, Phaedra or Kirky J being allowed to call the shots as they did. Noted that Meron B is all over insta' now with her modelling pics.

Reply #93 posted 01/11/19 6:47am

PennyPurple

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

PennyPurple said:

Here is the FB page of Jay Corn the author of The Death of Prince Rogers Nelson. He brings up some interesting things. This is what he said today.

Kiran Sharma told me WhatsApp conversations between Kirk, Phaedra and Meron took place both *before* and after Prince’s death. Kiran classified her interactions with law enforcement as “very frustrating,” adding they “did not release everything I said.” More soon.





https://www.facebook.com/...e_internal



In the below link you can go to the evidence tab and he's got the investigation files seperated into groups. **If you don't want to look at the photo's then don't click on the photo tab.**



https://thedeathofprincer...RpQCSYWlzs



Well then.... Kiran should have told us what she said that was not released.

Lawdy.

Another cryptic associate who wants us to figure out the puzzle on our own while throwing darts to law enforcement.

I think it's the Author trying to make us think. Sounds like he has talked to Kiran.

Reply #94 posted 01/11/19 9:56am

nelcp777

PennyPurple said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



Well then.... Kiran should have told us what she said that was not released.

Lawdy.

Another cryptic associate who wants us to figure out the puzzle on our own while throwing darts to law enforcement.

I think it's the Author trying to make us think. Sounds like he has talked to Kiran.

Perhaps the releasing of documents is a last ditch effort to get more leads (not that many original were followed up on thoroughly).

I think the criminal case is lost. At this point, the family should pursue a civil case against at a minimum, Kirk, Phaedra and Meron, not for remedies but for deposition purposes alone. That is really the only shot they have to get them to talk.

Reply #95 posted 01/11/19 10:34am

PennyPurple

nelcp777 said:

PennyPurple said:

I think it's the Author trying to make us think. Sounds like he has talked to Kiran.

Perhaps the releasing of documents is a last ditch effort to get more leads (not that many original were followed up on thoroughly).

I think the criminal case is lost. At this point, the family should pursue a civil case against at a minimum, Kirk, Phaedra and Meron, not for remedies but for deposition purposes alone. That is really the only shot they have to get them to talk.

As much as I wish that it would happen, it's doubtful...they still have at least Kirk on their payroll. I don't know if Phaedra is still working for them or not.

Reply #96 posted 01/11/19 10:41am

peggyon

PennyPurple said:

nelcp777 said:

Perhaps the releasing of documents is a last ditch effort to get more leads (not that many original were followed up on thoroughly).

I think the criminal case is lost. At this point, the family should pursue a civil case against at a minimum, Kirk, Phaedra and Meron, not for remedies but for deposition purposes alone. That is really the only shot they have to get them to talk.

As much as I wish that it would happen, it's doubtful...they still have at least Kirk on their payroll. I don't know if Phaedra is still working for them or not.

There 'may be a reason' the family will not press charges against them. I don't think these 3 were the only complicit actors.

Reply #97 posted 01/11/19 10:43am

PennyPurple

peggyon said:

PennyPurple said:

As much as I wish that it would happen, it's doubtful...they still have at least Kirk on their payroll. I don't know if Phaedra is still working for them or not.

There 'may be a reason' the family will not press charges against them. I don't think these 3 were the only complicit actors.

That's very true.

Reply #98 posted 01/11/19 11:11am

Bodhitheblackdog

PennyPurple said:

peggyon said:

There 'may be a reason' the family will not press charges against them. I don't think these 3 were the only complicit actors.

That's very true.

I agree. Look at his fam neutral

Reply #99 posted 01/11/19 11:56am

ThatWhiteDude

PennyPurple said:

Here is the FB page of Jay Corn the author of The Death of Prince Rogers Nelson. He brings up some interesting things. This is what he said today.

Kiran Sharma told me WhatsApp conversations between Kirk, Phaedra and Meron took place both *before* and after Prince’s death. Kiran classified her interactions with law enforcement as “very frustrating,” adding they “did not release everything I said.” More soon.





https://www.facebook.com/...e_internal



In the below link you can go to the evidence tab and he's got the investigation files seperated into groups. **If you don't want to look at the photo's then don't click on the photo tab.**



https://thedeathofprincer...RpQCSYWlzs

So he's still posting on FB but can't answer my questions? Interesting... neutral

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."


"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker
Reply #100 posted 01/11/19 12:46pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

PennyPurple said:

nelcp777 said:

Perhaps the releasing of documents is a last ditch effort to get more leads (not that many original were followed up on thoroughly).

I think the criminal case is lost. At this point, the family should pursue a civil case against at a minimum, Kirk, Phaedra and Meron, not for remedies but for deposition purposes alone. That is really the only shot they have to get them to talk.

As much as I wish that it would happen, it's doubtful...they still have at least Kirk on their payroll. I don't know if Phaedra is still working for them or not.



Phaedra is not working for them.

Rhonda Trotter is working for Bremer. It appears she is working on the Italian lawsuit.

Reply #101 posted 01/11/19 4:00pm

PennyPurple

Yeah, IKR.....he cut and ran.

ThatWhiteDude said:

PennyPurple said:

Here is the FB page of Jay Corn the author of The Death of Prince Rogers Nelson. He brings up some interesting things. This is what he said today.

Kiran Sharma told me WhatsApp conversations between Kirk, Phaedra and Meron took place both *before* and after Prince’s death. Kiran classified her interactions with law enforcement as “very frustrating,” adding they “did not release everything I said.” More soon.





https://www.facebook.com/...e_internal



In the below link you can go to the evidence tab and he's got the investigation files seperated into groups. **If you don't want to look at the photo's then don't click on the photo tab.**



https://thedeathofprincer...RpQCSYWlzs

So he's still posting on FB but can't answer my questions? Interesting... neutral

Reply #102 posted 01/11/19 9:18pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

PennyPurple said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



Well then.... Kiran should have told us what she said that was not released.

Lawdy.

Another cryptic associate who wants us to figure out the puzzle on our own while throwing darts to law enforcement.

I think it's the Author trying to make us think. Sounds like he has talked to Kiran.



Sorry Penny, I was skimming too fast...I get what you are saying now.


We have discussed this previously about how the LE written reports of many witnesses differed from the audio interview because the audio contained more info than the written report contained. LE did not release the audio of Kiran. So, there is something within her audio interview the police do not want us to know. Kiran should be more transparent and tell us what they left out of her interview.

Reply #103 posted 01/11/19 9:52pm

peggyon

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

PennyPurple said:

I think it's the Author trying to make us think. Sounds like he has talked to Kiran.



Sorry Penny, I was skimming too fast...I get what you are saying now.


We have discussed this previously about how the LE written reports of many witnesses differed from the audio interview because the audio contained more info than the written report contained. LE did not release the audio of Kiran. So, there is something within her audio interview the police do not want us to know. Kiran should be more transparent and tell us what they left out of her interview.

Why is he (author) radio silent now when he was so interested in communicating 2 weeks ago?

And, I agree re: Kiran.

Reply #104 posted 01/11/19 10:37pm

PennyPurple

peggyon said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



Sorry Penny, I was skimming too fast...I get what you are saying now.


We have discussed this previously about how the LE written reports of many witnesses differed from the audio interview because the audio contained more info than the written report contained. LE did not release the audio of Kiran. So, there is something within her audio interview the police do not want us to know. Kiran should be more transparent and tell us what they left out of her interview.

Why is he (author) radio silent now when he was so interested in communicating 2 weeks ago?

And, I agree re: Kiran.

From what I gather people were giving him a hard time and he said he wanted his life back...??

Reply #105 posted 01/12/19 4:34am

peggyon

PennyPurple said:

peggyon said:

Why is he (author) radio silent now when he was so interested in communicating 2 weeks ago?

And, I agree re: Kiran.

From what I gather people were giving him a hard time and he said he wanted his life back...??

Hmmm...

[Edited 1/12/19 5:24am]

Reply #106 posted 01/12/19 2:14pm

Roby78

There are 2 things that I can not explain.

1 = the body of those who die of overdose expels urine and faeces and from the mouth comes out of the foamy liguido. K I can understand that the liguido from the mouth can be vomit in the mouth .... but the urine and feces? Even if he had really been in the elevator for 4 or 5 hours at high temperature and had dried out there would always be the halo of the edge of the urine thing that his pants did not have. Not to mention that after all those hours the rigor of mortis would be on the whole body and not only on the arm.

2 = nobody has noticed anything strange in what would be his bed? I sleep in a double bed and when I get up I do not pull the blankets down like that, half the blankets remain almost intact. I tried to rehearse and the only way to get the bed like that is for me to stand up and pull the bed down even with a single gesture.

Another thing that I never understood (and I've already said in the past) is why nobody was persecuted for breaking the seals they had put in the toast room on the 21st?In my part is considered tampering with evidence and intrigue investigation, in america?Sorry excuse the poccolo but these things do not go right down 'also because' show that the police has cared of the case, and 'as if the only thing they wanted was to close the matter as soon as possible, and maybe It is precisely for this reason that there are people like me who can not make peace.

Reply #107 posted 01/12/19 2:38pm

Mumio

PennyPurple said:

peggyon said:

Why is he (author) radio silent now when he was so interested in communicating 2 weeks ago?

And, I agree re: Kiran.

From what I gather people were giving him a hard time and he said he wanted his life back...??



Rumors on the grapevine lol lol have it that this happened because during conversation with fans on his Twitter account, he put up a tweet that implied that EF employees may have had something to say about Prince and people should ask them about it. He was gonna be selling his book instore at EF and some fans contacted EF and told them what he said and that they shouldn't be supporting him nor his book. Someone had posted right on EF's FB page about it. Supposedly, EF pulled his book and no longer support him. Right after that, he put up that post on that Twitter acct about leaving it inactive.

Welcome to "the org", Mumio…they can have you, but I'll have your love in the end nod
Reply #108 posted 01/12/19 2:47pm

PennyPurple

Mumio said:

PennyPurple said:

From what I gather people were giving him a hard time and he said he wanted his life back...??



Rumors on the grapevine lol lol have it that this happened because during conversation with fans on his Twitter account, he put up a tweet that implied that EF employees may have had something to say about Prince and people should ask them about it. He was gonna be selling his book instore at EF and some fans contacted EF and told them what he said and that they shouldn't be supporting him nor his book. Someone had posted right on EF's FB page about it. Supposedly, EF pulled his book and no longer support him. Right after that, he put up that post on that Twitter acct about leaving it inactive.

Yep. You are correct! It got too hot in the kitchen for him. biggrin So he ran away. lol

Reply #109 posted 01/12/19 6:45pm

peggyon

Roby78 said:

There are 2 things that I can not explain.

1 = the body of those who die of overdose expels urine and faeces and from the mouth comes out of the foamy liguido. K I can understand that the liguido from the mouth can be vomit in the mouth .... but the urine and feces? Even if he had really been in the elevator for 4 or 5 hours at high temperature and had dried out there would always be the halo of the edge of the urine thing that his pants did not have. Not to mention that after all those hours the rigor of mortis would be on the whole body and not only on the arm.

2 = nobody has noticed anything strange in what would be his bed? I sleep in a double bed and when I get up I do not pull the blankets down like that, half the blankets remain almost intact. I tried to rehearse and the only way to get the bed like that is for me to stand up and pull the bed down even with a single gesture.

Another thing that I never understood (and I've already said in the past) is why nobody was persecuted for breaking the seals they had put in the toast room on the 21st?In my part is considered tampering with evidence and intrigue investigation, in america?Sorry excuse the poccolo but these things do not go right down 'also because' show that the police has cared of the case, and 'as if the only thing they wanted was to close the matter as soon as possible, and maybe It is precisely for this reason that there are people like me who can not make peace.

I think you have interesting points about #1 in particular. I was reluctant to bring this up as I thought some orgers would be obstructive and/or have difficulty dealing with the graphic nature of this, but it is my understanding that those who die from an opiate OD, often have what is called a 'foam cone' around the nose/mouth. (Not same as vomit). It is foamy material that originates in the lungs and is caused by pulmonary edema while someone is dying. (Can google, it is disturbing, so be careful.

Also, there is often urine/feces evident from relaxation of sphincters.

This is why I think he may have been cleaned up and redressed and perhaps moved. His rigor was fairly mild. LE could have cleaned him up too before pics.

#2 The turn down of the bed clothes does seem a bit excessive and could have been someone else pulling the covers back.

[Edited 1/12/19 18:54pm]

Reply #110 posted 01/12/19 8:11pm

nelcp777

Dna testing of the clothing would resolve the cleanup and depress issue. But like so many things, that was not done. As for the bed, I always got the vibe Prince did not sleep, but may have laid back in it while on the laptop.



peggyon said:

 



Roby78 said:


There are 2 things that I can not explain.


1 = the body of those who die of overdose expels urine and faeces and from the mouth comes out of the foamy liguido. K I can understand that the liguido from the mouth can be vomit in the mouth .... but the urine and feces? Even if he had really been in the elevator for 4 or 5 hours at high temperature and had dried out there would always be the halo of the edge of the urine thing that his pants did not have. Not to mention that after all those hours the rigor of mortis would be on the whole body and not only on the arm.


2 = nobody has noticed anything strange in what would be his bed? I sleep in a double bed and when I get up I do not pull the blankets down like that, half the blankets remain almost intact. I tried to rehearse and the only way to get the bed like that is for me to stand up and pull the bed down even with a single gesture.


 


Another thing that I never understood (and I've already said in the past) is why nobody was persecuted for breaking the seals they had put in the toast room on the 21st?In my part is considered tampering with evidence and intrigue investigation, in america?Sorry excuse the poccolo but these things do not go right down 'also because' show that the police has cared of the case, and 'as if the only thing they wanted was to close the matter as soon as possible, and maybe It is precisely for this reason that there are people like me who can not make peace. 



 


 


I think you have interesting points about #1 in particular. I was reluctant to bring this up as I thought some orgers would be obstructive and/or have difficulty dealing with the graphic nature of this, but it is my understanding that those who die from an opiate OD, often have what is called a 'foam cone' around the nose/mouth. (Not same as vomit). It is foamy material that originates in  the lungs and is caused by  pulmonary edema while someone is dying. (Can google, it is disturbing, so be careful.


Also, there is often urine/feces evident from relaxation of sphincters.


 


This is why I think he may have been cleaned up and redressed and perhaps moved. His rigor was fairly mild. LE could have cleaned him up  too before pics.


 


#2 The turn down of the bed clothes does seem a bit excessive and could have been someone else pulling the covers back.


 


 


 


 


 


 

[Edited 1/12/19 18:54pm]

Reply #111 posted 01/12/19 8:21pm

muchtoofast

Roby78 said:

There are 2 things that I can not explain.


1 = the body of those who die of overdose expels urine and faeces and from the mouth comes out of the foamy liguido. K I can understand that the liguido from the mouth can be vomit in the mouth .... but the urine and feces? Even if he had really been in the elevator for 4 or 5 hours at high temperature and had dried out there would always be the halo of the edge of the urine thing that his pants did not have. Not to mention that after all those hours the rigor of mortis would be on the whole body and not only on the arm.


2 = nobody has noticed anything strange in what would be his bed? I sleep in a double bed and when I get up I do not pull the blankets down like that, half the blankets remain almost intact. I tried to rehearse and the only way to get the bed like that is for me to stand up and pull the bed down even with a single gesture.


 


Another thing that I never understood (and I've already said in the past) is why nobody was persecuted for breaking the seals they had put in the toast room on the 21st?In my part is considered tampering with evidence and intrigue investigation, in america?Sorry excuse the poccolo but these things do not go right down 'also because' show that the police has cared of the case, and 'as if the only thing they wanted was to close the matter as soon as possible, and maybe It is precisely for this reason that there are people like me who can not make peace. 


Whether you urinate or defecate when you die depends first on how much stuff is in your GI and urinary system when you die. If someone died shortly after urinating and defecating, then no, nothing extra will go out. On the other hand, if you are on the toilet and die right before doing your business, then yes, it probably will come out when you die.
Reply #112 posted 01/12/19 10:13pm

sonshine

I am going to try and make a point then I will leave this thread as I am one that doesn't like the direction these threads always go.
Firstly, my sympathies to Tomas on the loss of your son. I recently experienced a similar loss and completely understand the desire to keep a loved one's memory alive, and the pain of basically being abandoned in your despair. I wish I didn't know what you are going through as this isn't a club anyone wants to join.
I share June7's opinion about grieving and support an individual's journey thru the grief process, but I do not believe that is the motive for the folks heavily involved in these threads. Personally, I would be mortified and deeply hurt/offended by people discussing the details of my loved one's passing. You will have to forgive me for being insulted that people here are trying to pass off diving nose first into none of their business as "grieving". Please.
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
Reply #113 posted 01/13/19 12:31am

June7

Moderator

moderator

sonshine said:

I am going to try and make a point then I will leave this thread as I am one that doesn't like the direction these threads always go. Firstly, my sympathies to Tomas on the loss of your son. I recently experienced a similar loss and completely understand the desire to keep a loved one's memory alive, and the pain of basically being abandoned in your despair. I wish I didn't know what you are going through as this isn't a club anyone wants to join. I share June7's opinion about grieving and support an individual's journey thru the grief process, but I do not believe that is the motive for the folks heavily involved in these threads. Personally, I would be mortified and deeply hurt/offended by people discussing the details of my loved one's passing. You will have to forgive me for being insulted that people here are trying to pass off diving nose first into none of their business as "grieving". Please.

First, thank you for your sympathies, means a lot to me. Today, well 5 minutes ago, so yesterday was a year, and it's been tough.

Also, I appreciate your comment regarding the thread. It was cordial and written with class - no flaming or creating drama (though that last sentence was borderline wink ).


When I decided to let this continue, it wasn't for my own grief process - I have other outlets in which to discuss my son's death, though, because of my position here for two decades, it was posted, and the response from the members here were deeply felt by me and my Ex, my son and my daughter. I was in awe of the amount of people who commented on the situatuon, and offered their support. It helped a lot.

I somewhat agree with you that not all the talk in here is specifically grieving, some are actually piecing together the events of that horrible day. The thing is, you can't really and truly know if their process is NOT grieving. Everyone handles grief in different ways. There's no way to list all of the ways people work when dealing with grief, and I'm not licensed in any way to consider which is what, or who is allowed to grieve and who isn't.

However, having said that, the thread is titled, "The Prince Death & Investigation Thread" which should make it obvious that what's discussed in this thread is both. I know some people who consider talking about it, any of it, is carthartic. I am not one to disagree or agree - just offer the venue.

I'm sorry you're insulted, and I'm also sorry you feel it improper to discuss this here, but, you're wrong about it not being our business - this whole site is about Prince's business and it has made it a point to get into every aspect of his life (and now death) for all this time.. The family has accepted this as fact when they inclluded us in their arrangements of services at special venues, dedications in the program for his funeral, special access interviews to family members and as a sounding board, etc. They recognize we are the formost unofficial fansite and we are so honored to be so for over 23 years. Not one of them have contacted us with a request to please cease this discussion. But, again, I appreciate your thoughts on this, and hope if you continue to post in this thread, that you continue to do so as you did today. - Thank you, June7 / Tomás

[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #114 posted 01/13/19 12:49pm

Roby78

peggyon said:

Roby78 said:

There are 2 things that I can not explain.

1 = the body of those who die of overdose expels urine and faeces and from the mouth comes out of the foamy liguido. K I can understand that the liguido from the mouth can be vomit in the mouth .... but the urine and feces? Even if he had really been in the elevator for 4 or 5 hours at high temperature and had dried out there would always be the halo of the edge of the urine thing that his pants did not have. Not to mention that after all those hours the rigor of mortis would be on the whole body and not only on the arm.

2 = nobody has noticed anything strange in what would be his bed? I sleep in a double bed and when I get up I do not pull the blankets down like that, half the blankets remain almost intact. I tried to rehearse and the only way to get the bed like that is for me to stand up and pull the bed down even with a single gesture.

Another thing that I never understood (and I've already said in the past) is why nobody was persecuted for breaking the seals they had put in the toast room on the 21st?In my part is considered tampering with evidence and intrigue investigation, in america?Sorry excuse the poccolo but these things do not go right down 'also because' show that the police has cared of the case, and 'as if the only thing they wanted was to close the matter as soon as possible, and maybe It is precisely for this reason that there are people like me who can not make peace.

I think you have interesting points about #1 in particular. I was reluctant to bring this up as I thought some orgers would be obstructive and/or have difficulty dealing with the graphic nature of this, but it is my understanding that those who die from an opiate OD, often have what is called a 'foam cone' around the nose/mouth. (Not same as vomit). It is foamy material that originates in the lungs and is caused by pulmonary edema while someone is dying. (Can google, it is disturbing, so be careful.

Also, there is often urine/feces evident from relaxation of sphincters.

This is why I think he may have been cleaned up and redressed and perhaps moved. His rigor was fairly mild. LE could have cleaned him up too before pics.

#2 The turn down of the bed clothes does seem a bit excessive and could have been someone else pulling the covers back.

[Edited 1/12/19 18:54pm]

That's exactly what I meant, I'm happy to see that someone thinks like me

Reply #115 posted 01/13/19 12:58pm

Roby78

muchtoofast said:

Roby78 said:

There are 2 things that I can not explain.

1 = the body of those who die of overdose expels urine and faeces and from the mouth comes out of the foamy liguido. K I can understand that the liguido from the mouth can be vomit in the mouth .... but the urine and feces? Even if he had really been in the elevator for 4 or 5 hours at high temperature and had dried out there would always be the halo of the edge of the urine thing that his pants did not have. Not to mention that after all those hours the rigor of mortis would be on the whole body and not only on the arm.

2 = nobody has noticed anything strange in what would be his bed? I sleep in a double bed and when I get up I do not pull the blankets down like that, half the blankets remain almost intact. I tried to rehearse and the only way to get the bed like that is for me to stand up and pull the bed down even with a single gesture.

Another thing that I never understood (and I've already said in the past) is why nobody was persecuted for breaking the seals they had put in the toast room on the 21st?In my part is considered tampering with evidence and intrigue investigation, in america?Sorry excuse the poccolo but these things do not go right down 'also because' show that the police has cared of the case, and 'as if the only thing they wanted was to close the matter as soon as possible, and maybe It is precisely for this reason that there are people like me who can not make peace.

Whether you urinate or defecate when you die depends first on how much stuff is in your GI and urinary system when you die. If someone died shortly after urinating and defecating, then no, nothing extra will go out. On the other hand, if you are on the toilet and die right before doing your business, then yes, it probably will come out when you die.

sorry if I disagree with you but I talked to a coroner (friend of my cousin) who has been doing this job for 30 years, I showed him the pictures and he assured me that those are not the clothes he died with and that the body is always liquid, I also explained that maybe not ate for days and he replied that it does not matter the body creates liquid that then expels in the first 2 hours of death, and does so through the rectum and urine .

if any of you have the chance to hear other specialized voices about it I would be very pleased

Reply #116 posted 01/13/19 1:09pm

PennyPurple

Roby78 said:

sorry if I disagree with you but I talked to a coroner (friend of my cousin) who has been doing this job for 30 years, I showed him the pictures and he assured me that those are not the clothes he died with and that the body is always liquid, I also explained that maybe not ate for days and he replied that it does not matter the body creates liquid that then expels in the first 2 hours of death, and does so through the rectum and urine .

if any of you have the chance to hear other specialized voices about it I would be very pleased

So basically it would be soiled where he was found? The bed sheets did not look soiled, and they didn't look like they were changed because of the pill they found in the sheets.

Reply #117 posted 01/13/19 1:19pm

Roby78

PennyPurple said:

Roby78 said:

sorry if I disagree with you but I talked to a coroner (friend of my cousin) who has been doing this job for 30 years, I showed him the pictures and he assured me that those are not the clothes he died with and that the body is always liquid, I also explained that maybe not ate for days and he replied that it does not matter the body creates liquid that then expels in the first 2 hours of death, and does so through the rectum and urine .

if any of you have the chance to hear other specialized voices about it I would be very pleased

So basically it would be soiled where he was found? The bed sheets did not look soiled, and they didn't look like they were changed because of the pill they found in the sheets.

exactly what the doctor told me

Reply #118 posted 01/13/19 1:59pm

Bodhitheblackdog

PennyPurple said:

Roby78 said:

sorry if I disagree with you but I talked to a coroner (friend of my cousin) who has been doing this job for 30 years, I showed him the pictures and he assured me that those are not the clothes he died with and that the body is always liquid, I also explained that maybe not ate for days and he replied that it does not matter the body creates liquid that then expels in the first 2 hours of death, and does so through the rectum and urine .

if any of you have the chance to hear other specialized voices about it I would be very pleased

So basically it would be soiled where he was found? The bed sheets did not look soiled, and they didn't look like they were changed because of the pill they found in the sheets.

Penny, I recall seeing pics in the original Carver County files of 'soiled' white sheets(yellowish/brown staining) discarded along with Fleet enema bottles in the dumpster out back...there was even talk on previous threads if DNA from those sheets had been tied to PRN. Maybe an armload or two of such material was dumped as part of a general post mortem clean up of the death scene. I think the silence was/is bc people are afraid of being criminally charged with tampering with the scene of a 'crime'...It may take a while but, IMO, someone will eventually talk...

[Edited 1/13/19 14:39pm]

Reply #119 posted 01/13/19 3:52pm

PennyPurple

[Edited 1/13/19 19:27pm]

Reply #120 posted 01/13/19 7:10pm

sonshine

June7 said:

 



sonshine said:


I am going to try and make a point then I will leave this thread as I am one that doesn't like the direction these threads always go. Firstly, my sympathies to Tomas on the loss of your son. I recently experienced a similar loss and completely understand the desire to keep a loved one's memory alive, and the pain of basically being abandoned in your despair. I wish I didn't know what you are going through as this isn't a club anyone wants to join. I share June7's opinion about grieving and support an individual's journey thru the grief process, but I do not believe that is the motive for the folks heavily involved in these threads. Personally, I would be mortified and deeply hurt/offended by people discussing the details of my loved one's passing. You will have to forgive me for being insulted that people here are trying to pass off diving nose first into none of their business as "grieving". Please.

First, thank you for your sympathies, means a lot to me. Today, well 5 minutes ago, so yesterday was a year, and it's been tough. 


 


Also, I appreciate your comment regarding the thread. It was cordial and written with class - no flaming or creating drama (though that last sentence was borderline wink ). 


 



When I decided to let this continue, it wasn't for my own grief process - I have other outlets in which to discuss my son's death, though, because of my position here for two decades, it was posted, and the response from the members here were deeply felt by me and my Ex, my son and my daughter. I was in awe of the amount of people who commented on the situatuon, and offered their support. It helped a lot. 


 


 


I somewhat agree with you that not all the talk in here is specifically grieving, some are actually piecing together the events of that horrible day. The thing is, you can't really and truly know if their process is NOT grieving. Everyone handles grief in different ways. There's no way to list all of the ways people work when dealing with grief, and I'm not licensed in any way to consider which is what, or who is allowed to grieve and who isn't.


 


 


However, having said that, the thread is titled, "The Prince Death & Investigation Thread" which should make it obvious that what's discussed in this thread is both. I know some people who consider talking about it, any of it, is carthartic. I am not one to disagree or agree - just offer the venue. 


 


 


I'm sorry you're insulted, and I'm also sorry you feel it improper to discuss this here, but, you're wrong about it not being our business - this whole site is about Prince's business and it has made it a point to get into every aspect of his life (and now death) for all this time.. The family has accepted this as fact when they inclluded us in their arrangements of services at special venues, dedications in the program for his funeral, special access interviews to family members and as a sounding board, etc. They recognize we are the formost unofficial fansite and we are so honored to be so for over 23 years. Not one of them have contacted us  with a request to please cease this discussion. But, again, I appreciate your thoughts on this, and hope if you continue to post in this thread, that you continue to do so as you did today. - Thank you, June7 / Tomás


 


I understand. Thanks for your reply. And as promised I will stay off this thread since I can't help but find the subject matter repulsive. Then again I'm only six weeks from the tragic accident that claimed my husband's life so admittedly I'm super sensitive. As they say different strokes for different folks and that applies even to processing grief I suppose. Have a nice day and thank u for all u do here. Continued peace and healing to you and your family.
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
Reply #121 posted 01/13/19 7:32pm

rednblue

sonshine said:

June7 said:

First, thank you for your sympathies, means a lot to me. Today, well 5 minutes ago, so yesterday was a year, and it's been tough.

Also, I appreciate your comment regarding the thread. It was cordial and written with class - no flaming or creating drama (though that last sentence was borderline wink ).


When I decided to let this continue, it wasn't for my own grief process - I have other outlets in which to discuss my son's death, though, because of my position here for two decades, it was posted, and the response from the members here were deeply felt by me and my Ex, my son and my daughter. I was in awe of the amount of people who commented on the situatuon, and offered their support. It helped a lot.

I somewhat agree with you that not all the talk in here is specifically grieving, some are actually piecing together the events of that horrible day. The thing is, you can't really and truly know if their process is NOT grieving. Everyone handles grief in different ways. There's no way to list all of the ways people work when dealing with grief, and I'm not licensed in any way to consider which is what, or who is allowed to grieve and who isn't.

However, having said that, the thread is titled, "The Prince Death & Investigation Thread" which should make it obvious that what's discussed in this thread is both. I know some people who consider talking about it, any of it, is carthartic. I am not one to disagree or agree - just offer the venue.

I'm sorry you're insulted, and I'm also sorry you feel it improper to discuss this here, but, you're wrong about it not being our business - this whole site is about Prince's business and it has made it a point to get into every aspect of his life (and now death) for all this time.. The family has accepted this as fact when they inclluded us in their arrangements of services at special venues, dedications in the program for his funeral, special access interviews to family members and as a sounding board, etc. They recognize we are the formost unofficial fansite and we are so honored to be so for over 23 years. Not one of them have contacted us with a request to please cease this discussion. But, again, I appreciate your thoughts on this, and hope if you continue to post in this thread, that you continue to do so as you did today. - Thank you, June7 / Tomás

I understand. Thanks for your reply. And as promised I will stay off this thread since I can't help but find the subject matter repulsive. Then again I'm only six weeks from the tragic accident that claimed my husband's life so admittedly I'm super sensitive. As they say different strokes for different folks and that applies even to processing grief I suppose. Have a nice day and thank u for all u do here. Continued peace and healing to you and your family.


Just heartbreaking. Deep love is so precious. To have it taken away...no words.

The Prince quote at the end of your posts means so much. I love that people see it every time you post. I'm still thinking about an answer to the "Love 4 one another - What Does That Mean To You?" thread. Your "tagline" quote is the first thing I thought of when I saw the question.

Reply #122 posted 01/13/19 8:56pm

peggyon

Might explain why the clothes were on backwards.

There is often a degree of 'messiness' with this type of death, there could have been some clean-up here and there. Might not have gotten on the sheets, though.

I am fine not talking about this further as it can be upsetting.

[Edited 1/13/19 21:02pm]

Reply #123 posted 01/13/19 9:55pm

PennyPurple

peggyon said:

Might explain why the clothes were on backwards.

There is often a degree of 'messiness' with this type of death, there could have been some clean-up here and there. Might not have gotten on the sheets, though.

I am fine not talking about this further as it can be upsetting.

[Edited 1/13/19 21:02pm]

I agree Peggy, in fact I probably won't be keeping up on this thread.

Reply #124 posted 01/13/19 11:01pm

peggyon

PennyPurple said:

peggyon said:

Might explain why the clothes were on backwards.

There is often a degree of 'messiness' with this type of death, there could have been some clean-up here and there. Might not have gotten on the sheets, though.

I am fine not talking about this further as it can be upsetting.

[Edited 1/13/19 21:02pm]

I agree Peggy, in fact I probably won't be keeping up on this thread.

I will likely remain but I understand

Reply #125 posted 01/14/19 3:02pm

AnnaStesia10

Prince's clothing on backwards socks included always got to me.
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #126 posted 01/14/19 4:23pm

luvsexy4all

was /is the investigation sloppy because its Minn?? a bigger city would ve been more precise??

Reply #127 posted 01/14/19 6:06pm

Bodhitheblackdog

luvsexy4all said:

was /is the investigation sloppy because its Minn?? a bigger city would ve been more precise??

interesting question...and we can't discount the corrosive and unhelpful aspect of 'celebrity'...which distorts and changes everything it touches IMO.

Reply #128 posted 01/14/19 8:41pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

luvsexy4all said:

was /is the investigation sloppy because its Minn?? a bigger city would ve been more precise??



Yes.

Small suburbs usually do not have a lot of complex death investigations.

This is one of the reasons why the DEA was called in to help.

Reply #129 posted 01/15/19 3:32am

MoBettaBliss

June7 said:

sonshine said:

I am going to try and make a point then I will leave this thread as I am one that doesn't like the direction these threads always go. Firstly, my sympathies to Tomas on the loss of your son. I recently experienced a similar loss and completely understand the desire to keep a loved one's memory alive, and the pain of basically being abandoned in your despair. I wish I didn't know what you are going through as this isn't a club anyone wants to join. I share June7's opinion about grieving and support an individual's journey thru the grief process, but I do not believe that is the motive for the folks heavily involved in these threads. Personally, I would be mortified and deeply hurt/offended by people discussing the details of my loved one's passing. You will have to forgive me for being insulted that people here are trying to pass off diving nose first into none of their business as "grieving". Please.

First, thank you for your sympathies, means a lot to me. Today, well 5 minutes ago, so yesterday was a year, and it's been tough.

Also, I appreciate your comment regarding the thread. It was cordial and written with class - no flaming or creating drama (though that last sentence was borderline wink ).


When I decided to let this continue, it wasn't for my own grief process - I have other outlets in which to discuss my son's death, though, because of my position here for two decades, it was posted, and the response from the members here were deeply felt by me and my Ex, my son and my daughter. I was in awe of the amount of people who commented on the situatuon, and offered their support. It helped a lot.

I somewhat agree with you that not all the talk in here is specifically grieving, some are actually piecing together the events of that horrible day. The thing is, you can't really and truly know if their process is NOT grieving. Everyone handles grief in different ways. There's no way to list all of the ways people work when dealing with grief, and I'm not licensed in any way to consider which is what, or who is allowed to grieve and who isn't.

However, having said that, the thread is titled, "The Prince Death & Investigation Thread" which should make it obvious that what's discussed in this thread is both. I know some people who consider talking about it, any of it, is carthartic. I am not one to disagree or agree - just offer the venue.

I'm sorry you're insulted, and I'm also sorry you feel it improper to discuss this here, but, you're wrong about it not being our business - this whole site is about Prince's business and it has made it a point to get into every aspect of his life (and now death) for all this time.. The family has accepted this as fact when they inclluded us in their arrangements of services at special venues, dedications in the program for his funeral, special access interviews to family members and as a sounding board, etc. They recognize we are the formost unofficial fansite and we are so honored to be so for over 23 years. Not one of them have contacted us with a request to please cease this discussion. But, again, I appreciate your thoughts on this, and hope if you continue to post in this thread, that you continue to do so as you did today. - Thank you, June7 / Tomás



[Snipped - Action Taken - June7]

Reply #130 posted 01/15/19 4:14pm

luvsexy4all

I need to see his dead body or I would think he might still be alive.

Reply #131 posted 01/15/19 7:00pm

upinclouds

These threads are interesting, others have picked up on things I haven't noticed before.

I think some of the naysayers are genuinely looking out for Prince, and I think there are others that may be "cleaners". guilt much?

I want to see the people who sold & gave him those pills charged. That would be justice for Prince & hopefully an eye opening lesson for most about street pills.

cloud9
Reply #132 posted 01/15/19 9:05pm

sonshine

MoBettaBliss said:

 



June7 said:


 



sonshine said:


I am going to try and make a point then I will leave this thread as I am one that doesn't like the direction these threads always go. Firstly, my sympathies to Tomas on the loss of your son. I recently experienced a similar loss and completely understand the desire to keep a loved one's memory alive, and the pain of basically being abandoned in your despair. I wish I didn't know what you are going through as this isn't a club anyone wants to join. I share June7's opinion about grieving and support an individual's journey thru the grief process, but I do not believe that is the motive for the folks heavily involved in these threads. Personally, I would be mortified and deeply hurt/offended by people discussing the details of my loved one's passing. You will have to forgive me for being insulted that people here are trying to pass off diving nose first into none of their business as "grieving". Please.

First, thank you for your sympathies, means a lot to me. Today, well 5 minutes ago, so yesterday was a year, and it's been tough. 


 


Also, I appreciate your comment regarding the thread. It was cordial and written with class - no flaming or creating drama (though that last sentence was borderline wink ). 


 



When I decided to let this continue, it wasn't for my own grief process - I have other outlets in which to discuss my son's death, though, because of my position here for two decades, it was posted, and the response from the members here were deeply felt by me and my Ex, my son and my daughter. I was in awe of the amount of people who commented on the situatuon, and offered their support. It helped a lot. 


 


 


I somewhat agree with you that not all the talk in here is specifically grieving, some are actually piecing together the events of that horrible day. The thing is, you can't really and truly know if their process is NOT grieving. Everyone handles grief in different ways. There's no way to list all of the ways people work when dealing with grief, and I'm not licensed in any way to consider which is what, or who is allowed to grieve and who isn't.


 


 


However, having said that, the thread is titled, "The Prince Death & Investigation Thread" which should make it obvious that what's discussed in this thread is both. I know some people who consider talking about it, any of it, is carthartic. I am not one to disagree or agree - just offer the venue. 


 


 


I'm sorry you're insulted, and I'm also sorry you feel it improper to discuss this here, but, you're wrong about it not being our business - this whole site is about Prince's business and it has made it a point to get into every aspect of his life (and now death) for all this time.. The family has accepted this as fact when they inclluded us in their arrangements of services at special venues, dedications in the program for his funeral, special access interviews to family members and as a sounding board, etc. They recognize we are the formost unofficial fansite and we are so honored to be so for over 23 years. Not one of them have contacted us  with a request to please cease this discussion. But, again, I appreciate your thoughts on this, and hope if you continue to post in this thread, that you continue to do so as you did today. - Thank you, June7 / Tomás


 





[Snipped - Action Taken - June7]

 


[Snipped - Action Taken - June7]
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
Reply #133 posted 01/15/19 9:06pm

sonshine

upinclouds said:

These threads are interesting, others have picked up on things I haven't noticed before. 


I think some of the naysayers are genuinely looking out for Prince, and I think there are others that may be "cleaners". guilt much? 


I want to see the people who sold & gave him those pills charged. That would be justice for Prince & hopefully an eye opening lesson for most about street pills. 


Not going to happen. The time when that may have been possible came and went a long time ago. Just sayin'.
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
Reply #134 posted 01/16/19 8:36am

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

sonshine said:

Honestly, I couldn't agree more. But the ones who don't just come on here and say to stay out of these threads if that's how we feel. So I gave up trying to persuade them to let it go. Some people are twisted that's all I got.


[Snipped - Action Taken - June7]

Reply #135 posted 01/16/19 9:04am

darlingnikkkki

[Snipped - Action Taken - June7]
"I want to be the only one you come for...."
Reply #136 posted 01/16/19 4:52pm

luvsexy4all

if there are parties responsible then God will do a number on them...i just want the truth

Reply #137 posted 01/17/19 6:55pm

funksterr

luvsexy4all said:

if there are parties responsible then God will do a number on them...i just want the truth

No you don't. The truth is bizarre AF. It's illogical. You won't accept it even when you hear it.

Reply #138 posted 01/17/19 8:10pm

Bodhitheblackdog

funksterr said:

luvsexy4all said:

if there are parties responsible then God will do a number on them...i just want the truth

No you don't. The truth is bizarre AF. It's illogical. You won't accept it even when you hear it.

I agree that much of what we do know about Prince's death is bizarre and illogical and I'm sure that many here would be blown away if we knew it all. I think that's why it's so hard to walk away from the unanswered questions and inconsistancies...can't live with the truth...can't live without it.

Reply #139 posted 01/18/19 8:45am

AnnaStesia10

^^^^
True, how he died makes no f'ing sense from the near death incident on the plane one week before he died, his pill usage, the massive amounts of Fentanyl in his body, how he was about to get help the next day for his dependence on pain pills,but then is found in an elevator dead with his clothes on backward, no will, and Kirk, Meron, Phaedra and Tyka aren't speaking and did not help the authorities with his death investigation, no one else in his circle past and current are not speaking either, and now the death investigation is closed with just a determination that it was an accidental overdose of Fentanyl mind you he had MASSIVE amounts of it in his system and doesnt ring alarm bells to anyone. So yeah, his death is shrouded in mystery and fuckery. And yet people want us to shut up and question why we still wanna beat a dead horse and let Prince rest in peace. Prince is gone he doesn't care one bit what we all say and think now. I cannot believe how he went out and how his "friends and family" reacted in the aftermath. It is unreal.
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #140 posted 01/18/19 9:09am

PennyPurple

funksterr said:

luvsexy4all said:

if there are parties responsible then God will do a number on them...i just want the truth

No you don't. The truth is bizarre AF. It's illogical. You won't accept it even when you hear it.

I think we are all adult enough to know the truth and to deal with it.

Reply #141 posted 01/18/19 12:11pm

Bodhitheblackdog

AnnaStesia10 said:

^^^^ True, how he died makes no f'ing sense from the near death incident on the plane one week before he died, his pill usage, the massive amounts of Fentanyl in his body, how he was about to get help the next day for his dependence on pain pills,but then is found in an elevator dead with his clothes on backward, no will, and Kirk, Meron, Phaedra and Tyka aren't speaking and did not help the authorities with his death investigation, no one else in his circle past and current are not speaking either, and now the death investigation is closed with just a determination that it was an accidental overdose of Fentanyl mind you he had MASSIVE amounts of it in his system and doesnt ring alarm bells to anyone. So yeah, his death is shrouded in mystery and fuckery. And yet people want us to shut up and question why we still wanna beat a dead horse and let Prince rest in peace. Prince is gone he doesn't care one bit what we all say and think now. I cannot believe how he went out and how his "friends and family" reacted in the aftermath. It is unreal.

WOW...you nailed it!!! yes

Reply #142 posted 01/18/19 1:26pm

leec1

Bodhitheblackdog said:

 



AnnaStesia10 said:


^^^^ True, how he died makes no f'ing sense from the near death incident on the plane one week before he died, his pill usage, the massive amounts of Fentanyl in his body, how he was about to get help the next day for his dependence on pain pills,but then is found in an elevator dead with his clothes on backward, no will, and Kirk, Meron, Phaedra and Tyka aren't speaking and did not help the authorities with his death investigation, no one else in his circle past and current are not speaking either, and now the death investigation is closed with just a determination that it was an accidental overdose of Fentanyl mind you he had MASSIVE amounts of it in his system and doesnt ring alarm bells to anyone. So yeah, his death is shrouded in mystery and fuckery. And yet people want us to shut up and question why we still wanna beat a dead horse and let Prince rest in peace. Prince is gone he doesn't care one bit what we all say and think now. I cannot believe how he went out and how his "friends and family" reacted in the aftermath. It is unreal.

WOW...you nailed it!!! yes


Cosign
Reply #143 posted 01/18/19 4:22pm

Dimitri10

leec1 said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

 



AnnaStesia10 said:


^^^^ True, how he died makes no f'ing sense from the near death incident on the plane one week before he died, his pill usage, the massive amounts of Fentanyl in his body, how he was about to get help the next day for his dependence on pain pills,but then is found in an elevator dead with his clothes on backward, no will, and Kirk, Meron, Phaedra and Tyka aren't speaking and did not help the authorities with his death investigation, no one else in his circle past and current are not speaking either, and now the death investigation is closed with just a determination that it was an accidental overdose of Fentanyl mind you he had MASSIVE amounts of it in his system and doesnt ring alarm bells to anyone. So yeah, his death is shrouded in mystery and fuckery. And yet people want us to shut up and question why we still wanna beat a dead horse and let Prince rest in peace. Prince is gone he doesn't care one bit what we all say and think now. I cannot believe how he went out and how his "friends and family" reacted in the aftermath. It is unreal.

WOW...you nailed it!!! yes


Cosign


Agree 100% the whole situation is fked up
"Prince don't know how many hits he got"
Reply #144 posted 01/18/19 10:52pm

Lovejunky

Fascinating ..Just came onto my facebook feed...

WOW...

[Edited 1/18/19 22:58pm]

“LOVE IS THE MASTERPLAN”
Reply #145 posted 01/19/19 7:19am

Bodhitheblackdog

Lovejunky said:

Fascinating ..Just came onto my facebook feed...

WOW...

[Edited 1/18/19 22:58pm]

like I said recently, 'celebrity' changes/pollutes everything it touches....great addition to this thread...so, either Tyka was granted extraordinary considerations bc her brother was so famous OR there are aspects to the HOMOCIDE INVESTIGATION SURROUNDING PRINCE'S DEATH that have yet to see the light of day..(.which makes this thread so unbearably, sadly important) OR Tyka was prepared, just waiting for this 'inevitable' OD OR....

Reply #146 posted 01/19/19 11:14am

luvsexy4all

dont understand why some people say we know the truth ..and cant accept it...bullocks

Reply #147 posted 01/19/19 7:08pm

PurpleDiamonds1

AnnaStesia10 said:

^^^^
True, how he died makes no f'ing sense from the near death incident on the plane one week before he died, his pill usage, the massive amounts of Fentanyl in his body, how he was about to get help the next day for his dependence on pain pills,but then is found in an elevator dead with his clothes on backward, no will, and Kirk, Meron, Phaedra and Tyka aren't speaking and did not help the authorities with his death investigation, no one else in his circle past and current are not speaking either, and now the death investigation is closed with just a determination that it was an accidental overdose of Fentanyl mind you he had MASSIVE amounts of it in his system and doesnt ring alarm bells to anyone. So yeah, his death is shrouded in mystery and fuckery. And yet people want us to shut up and question why we still wanna beat a dead horse and let Prince rest in peace. Prince is gone he doesn't care one bit what we all say and think now. I cannot believe how he went out and how his "friends and family" reacted in the aftermath. It is unreal.

Glad you posted this. Agree with you. His death was no accident and IMO was not his doing.
I have been listening to all the Piano and microphone Australia shows....he performed great not like someone in trouble with an out of control drug habit needing rehab. The media lies hurt so much, he deserved better...
Reply #148 posted 01/19/19 8:22pm

ladygirl99

funksterr said:

luvsexy4all said:

if there are parties responsible then God will do a number on them...i just want the truth

No you don't. The truth is bizarre AF. It's illogical. You won't accept it even when you hear it.

I knew there is more to his death than meets the eye and I had been saying this for nearly the last three years. Some of the fans are pissed off at us who got the idea what happened and speaking riddles and cryptic but that frustrated should go toward the family and estate.

I understand some people would still say, What actually happened to him isn't the fans business but the problem is fans are the only one are left out of the dark. But damn I want some closure. I fucking hate how his family and the associates and even people out West in the industry know more but selling some bullshit drug junkie narrative not saying the word because of fear of tainted his legacy. I saw in my own eyes on Facebook that some of P's distant relatives said we don't know the whole story and his death wasn't a simple OD. I even read comments off of Yahoo from the people (a hairdresser and musician) who said, There was more to his death than just some opioid overdose. And members of his final entourage were hinting the same. Rumour had it that people on Facebook who lives in Minni got information from Tyka got the real info of his death and she was telling folks it wasn't a simple OD, and she was preparing for the outcome.

I want to know did he took drugs only because of body pain from performing or did he had some underlying disease or both?

There is so much redacted going on with court documents and police ones too I don't know what to trust anymore.

Reply #149 posted 01/19/19 9:44pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

AnnaStesia10 said:
^^^^ True, how he died makes no f'ing sense from the near death incident on the plane one week before he died, his pill usage, the massive amounts of Fentanyl in his body, how he was about to get help the next day for his dependence on pain pills,but then is found in an elevator dead with his clothes on backward, no will, and Kirk, Meron, Phaedra and Tyka aren't speaking and did not help the authorities with his death investigation, no one else in his circle past and current are not speaking either, and now the death investigation is closed with just a determination that it was an accidental overdose of Fentanyl mind you he had MASSIVE amounts of it in his system and doesnt ring alarm bells to anyone. So yeah, his death is shrouded in mystery and fuckery. And yet people want us to shut up and question why we still wanna beat a dead horse and let Prince rest in peace. Prince is gone he doesn't care one bit what we all say and think now. I cannot believe how he went out and how his "friends and family" reacted in the aftermath. It is unreal.
Glad you posted this. Agree with you. His death was no accident and IMO was not his doing. I have been listening to all the Piano and microphone Australia shows....he performed great not like someone in trouble with an out of control drug habit needing rehab. The media lies hurt so much, he deserved better...



You must have not looked at the photos, which clearly showed P was having serious problems.

[Edited 1/19/19 21:56pm]

Reply #150 posted 01/19/19 9:55pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

Lovejunky said:

Fascinating ..Just came onto my facebook feed...

WOW...



I am conflicted with this video.

Jews have to be buried before sundown.


Figure it out. Explain the same logistics.

Most of the responses onYouTube turned it into a murdered thread. P was not murdered.



Also, if you believe this video, do you believe the one in which she claims Capriccio is P's son?





[Edited 1/20/19 8:27am]

Reply #151 posted 01/19/19 10:01pm

rednblue


The woman in the video says "you don't have an accidental homicide," but doesn't comment further on how the law works.

Just checking that people understand that regardless of the counterintuitive sound to the language, and especially in overdose cases like this, a homicide charge doesn't require anybody to have attempted to kill the victim. So in this case, a homicide investigation can happen absent any reason to suspect that anyone may have tried to kill Prince.

[Edited 1/19/19 23:05pm]

Reply #152 posted 01/20/19 3:14am

Dimitri10

2hr window to organise everything....Really!!!!! - well I suppose Prince was known to organise a whole tour at the last minute.

What's a pain in the neck with this whole situation is that a certain few know what went down and have all moved on from it, the rest of us can all keep reading into it and try to make some sort of sense of it, finding this more of a head fkkk now but glued to the net in case something comes out, unbelievable.....

"Prince don't know how many hits he got"
Reply #153 posted 01/20/19 5:39am

ThatWhiteDude

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

AnnaStesia10 said: Glad you posted this. Agree with you. His death was no accident and IMO was not his doing. I have been listening to all the Piano and microphone Australia shows....he performed great not like someone in trouble with an out of control drug habit needing rehab. The media lies hurt so much, he deserved better...



You must have not looked at the photos, which clearly showed P was having serious problems.

[Edited 1/19/19 21:56pm]

Exactly, how can people see these photos and not see that this man had problems? I remember the first three days after he died, when the OD wasn't comfirmed yet. I visited my mother and we were on the couch, watching the news and saw a photo of him and my mother just said: "He looks really sick there." Wich he did, he didn't look healthy, he was very thin.

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."


"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker
Reply #154 posted 01/20/19 10:44am

leec1

ThatWhiteDude said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



You must have not looked at the photos, which clearly showed P was having serious problems.

[Edited 1/19/19 21:56pm]

Exactly, how can people see these photos and not see that this man had problems? I remember the first three days after he died, when the OD wasn't comfirmed yet. I visited my mother and we were on the couch, watching the news and saw a photo of him and my mother just said: "He looks really sick there." Wich he did, he didn't look healthy, he was very thin.

I don't agree with this assesment on the reason for how thin Prince was before he died. Many addicts lose weight and become very thin.

I am providing the link below to US Library of Medicine article on the side effects of opiods.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18443635

In addition to the above, there are various aspects of his health mentioned within the investigation but none that mention life threatening illness.


Reply #155 posted 01/20/19 11:09am

PennyPurple

I've seen that video before but I did re-watch it.


She had questions on the time of death. I think the time of death was 10:07am (I'm not sure on the minute). The medical people that were there estimated by the rigor that he had probably died 6 hours before that. She was questioning why the time difference.


Prince's death was unattended, so there had to be medical personnel that could call the time of death when it was confirmed. It's quite normal for this to happen. I'm surprised she didn't know that.



Reply #156 posted 01/20/19 11:27am

stpaisios

darlingnikkkki said:

Reading these theads is like beating a dead horse, or in this case, a dead Prince. Let him rest in peace already... sad


Conspiracy theories are very favorite bait for majority of ppl... it was there as long as we know about this thing called civilization.

Unfortunately, are beloved Prince was addict who gone too far. I read about drug/oploids addiction patients experience, doctors explainations, and i couldnt believe how much symptoms you could trace in Prince life from 2009 onwards.

There is a video of Prince during his shows in France, when he answered questions to journalists. In one question, journalist was aksing Prince what keeps him going as a musican, what pleasure he has in doing music after all this years or something like that, and he answered in criptic manner about not being able to sleep, reality is always better than the dream. Well, someones sleep should not be anyone problem, but its not just about sleep. In later interviews in 2012/13/14 he talks about no need for sleep, eat or even drink water. His monk like life was seen as mysticism (and i really believe Prince was a real mystic in our secular-society, rarest form of real genius), but guess what. All experiences i read on topic about oploids/drug addicts are totally similar. They all have phases not needing to eat, drink and getting sleep. In that state, if you are not getting help, you are going trough vey severe forms of hybrid personality disorders. I dont like psychological turn on Prince, its very dangerous zone, but i think he was always in mild schizoid place. So, we need to accept as fans that side of story. Even Prince acknowledged that he needed help, we are sad it was too late. But who knows why is that over in that way? We dont have answers for everything, especcialy when in comes to humans.
Reply #157 posted 01/20/19 1:57pm

ThatWhiteDude

leec1 said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

Exactly, how can people see these photos and not see that this man had problems? I remember the first three days after he died, when the OD wasn't comfirmed yet. I visited my mother and we were on the couch, watching the news and saw a photo of him and my mother just said: "He looks really sick there." Wich he did, he didn't look healthy, he was very thin.

I don't agree with this assesment on the reason for how thin Prince was before he died. Many addicts lose weight and become very thin.

I am providing the link below to US Library of Medicine article on the side effects of opiods.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18443635

In addition to the above, there are various aspects of his health mentioned within the investigation but none that mention life threatening illness.


Uhm I didn't say he had some underlying illness or something. I just wrote down what my mother said when she saw the pictures after he died. We didn't even know anything about the OD or that he was addicted. The news channels over here still talked about the flu.

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."


"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker
Reply #158 posted 01/20/19 2:21pm

XxAxX

funksterr said:

luvsexy4all said:

if there are parties responsible then God will do a number on them...i just want the truth

No you don't. The truth is bizarre AF. It's illogical. You won't accept it even when you hear it.

eek

Reply #159 posted 01/20/19 2:23pm

Lovejunky

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Lovejunky said:

Fascinating ..Just came onto my facebook feed...

WOW...



I am conflicted with this video.

Jews have to be buried before sundown.


Figure it out. Explain the same logistics.

Most of the responses onYouTube turned it into a murdered thread. P was not murdered.



Also, if you believe this video, do you believe the one in which she claims Capriccio is P's son?





[Edited 1/20/19 8:27am]

I dont know what to believe...

I was captured by her claims that Princes Official Death Certificate is no where to be found..

I then googled...sure enough we can find WHitneys, Michaels Tom Petty,s ..anyone you can name..

you will find their Official DEATH Certificate..

but Prince ?

We can only find a non certified certificate of Death

WHY ????

“LOVE IS THE MASTERPLAN”
Reply #160 posted 01/20/19 3:02pm

leec1

Lovejunky said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



I am conflicted with this video.

Jews have to be buried before sundown.


Figure it out. Explain the same logistics.

Most of the responses onYouTube turned it into a murdered thread. P was not murdered.



Also, if you believe this video, do you believe the one in which she claims Capriccio is P's son?





[Edited 1/20/19 8:27am]

I dont know what to believe...

I was captured by her claims that Princes Official Death Certificate is no where to be found..

I then googled...sure enough we can find WHitneys, Michaels Tom Petty,s ..anyone you can name..

you will find their Official DEATH Certificate..

but Prince ?

We can only find a non certified certificate of Death

WHY ????

Within the Prince death investigation files released by Carver County: Electronic Document 5 files in Miscellaneous documents is a copy of the medical examiner's death certificate.

Reply #161 posted 01/20/19 3:04pm

leec1

ThatWhiteDude said:

leec1 said:

I don't agree with this assesment on the reason for how thin Prince was before he died. Many addicts lose weight and become very thin.

I am providing the link below to US Library of Medicine article on the side effects of opiods.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18443635

In addition to the above, there are various aspects of his health mentioned within the investigation but none that mention life threatening illness.


Uhm I didn't say he had some underlying illness or something. I just wrote down what my mother said when she saw the pictures after he died. We didn't even know anything about the OD or that he was addicted. The news channels over here still talked about the flu.

No you didn't say he had an illness but it seemed to be implied by the statement you indicated your mother made.

Reply #162 posted 01/20/19 3:32pm

PennyPurple

Lovejunky said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



I am conflicted with this video.

Jews have to be buried before sundown.


Figure it out. Explain the same logistics.

Most of the responses onYouTube turned it into a murdered thread. P was not murdered.



Also, if you believe this video, do you believe the one in which she claims Capriccio is P's son?





[Edited 1/20/19 8:27am]

I dont know what to believe...

I was captured by her claims that Princes Official Death Certificate is no where to be found..

I then googled...sure enough we can find WHitneys, Michaels Tom Petty,s ..anyone you can name..

you will find their Official DEATH Certificate..

but Prince ?

We can only find a non certified certificate of Death

WHY ????

I believe the family has the official death certificate. I think ISLIJAG had stated before due to MN law it won't be made public for 30 years. (?)

Unless there is a leak of the official DC, I probably won't see it in my lifetime.

Reply #163 posted 01/20/19 3:47pm

Lovejunky

leec1 said:

Lovejunky said:

I dont know what to believe...

I was captured by her claims that Princes Official Death Certificate is no where to be found..

I then googled...sure enough we can find WHitneys, Michaels Tom Petty,s ..anyone you can name..

you will find their Official DEATH Certificate..

but Prince ?

We can only find a non certified certificate of Death

WHY ????

Within the Prince death investigation files released by Carver County: Electronic Document 5 files in Miscellaneous documents is a copy of the medical examiner's death certificate.

NO...that is the NON Certified Record of Death...

Death Certificate of Prince (Photo Credit: Midwest Medical Examinerâs office

Official death certificate should look like this..

Image result for death Certificate Minnesota

“LOVE IS THE MASTERPLAN”
Reply #164 posted 01/20/19 5:36pm

leec1

Lovejunky said:

leec1 said:

Within the Prince death investigation files released by Carver County: Electronic Document 5 files in Miscellaneous documents is a copy of the medical examiner's death certificate.

NO...that is the NON Certified Record of Death...

Death Certificate of Prince (Photo Credit: Midwest Medical Examinerâs office

Official death certificate should look like this..

Image result for death Certificate Minnesota

No, the copy in the death investigation file released does not state at the top Non-Certified Record of Death.

It states: Midwest Medical Examiner's office

Release of Public Data

Mn Statue 13.83 Subd 2

On Page 3 of this thread, it shows you where you can download Document 5 from the cloud.

The Certificate of Death you are showing in this message was given to the family.

Reply #165 posted 01/20/19 9:08pm

PurpleDiamonds1

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

 



PurpleDiamonds1 said:


AnnaStesia10 said:
^^^^ True, how he died makes no f'ing sense from the near death incident on the plane one week before he died, his pill usage, the massive amounts of Fentanyl in his body, how he was about to get help the next day for his dependence on pain pills,but then is found in an elevator dead with his clothes on backward, no will, and Kirk, Meron, Phaedra and Tyka aren't speaking and did not help the authorities with his death investigation, no one else in his circle past and current are not speaking either, and now the death investigation is closed with just a determination that it was an accidental overdose of Fentanyl mind you he had MASSIVE amounts of it in his system and doesnt ring alarm bells to anyone. So yeah, his death is shrouded in mystery and fuckery. And yet people want us to shut up and question why we still wanna beat a dead horse and let Prince rest in peace. Prince is gone he doesn't care one bit what we all say and think now. I cannot believe how he went out and how his "friends and family" reacted in the aftermath. It is unreal.

Glad you posted this. Agree with you. His death was no accident and IMO was not his doing. I have been listening to all the Piano and microphone Australia shows....he performed great not like someone in trouble with an out of control drug habit needing rehab. The media lies hurt so much, he deserved better...



You must have not looked at the photos, which clearly showed P was having serious problems.

[Edited 1/19/19 21:56pm]


Do believe Prince was not feeling good for a couple of months and notes from the visit to Dr S in April back this up.
He had no idea why he was feeling the way he was...he did not know those pills were being laced with fentanyl. He went to see Dr S for tests to find out what was going on and he never got the results of those tests.
Reply #166 posted 01/21/19 2:58am

Dimitri10

stpaisios said:

darlingnikkkki said:
Reading these theads is like beating a dead horse, or in this case, a dead Prince. Let him rest in peace already... sad
Conspiracy theories are very favorite bait for majority of ppl... it was there as long as we know about this thing called civilization. Unfortunately, are beloved Prince was addict who gone too far. I read about drug/oploids addiction patients experience, doctors explainations, and i couldnt believe how much symptoms you could trace in Prince life from 2009 onwards. There is a video of Prince during his shows in France, when he answered questions to journalists. In one question, journalist was aksing Prince what keeps him going as a musican, what pleasure he has in doing music after all this years or something like that, and he answered in criptic manner about not being able to sleep, reality is always better than the dream. Well, someones sleep should not be anyone problem, but its not just about sleep. In later interviews in 2012/13/14 he talks about no need for sleep, eat or even drink water. His monk like life was seen as mysticism (and i really believe Prince was a real mystic in our secular-society, rarest form of real genius), but guess what. All experiences i read on topic about oploids/drug addicts are totally similar. They all have phases not needing to eat, drink and getting sleep. In that state, if you are not getting help, you are going trough vey severe forms of hybrid personality disorders. I dont like psychological turn on Prince, its very dangerous zone, but i think he was always in mild schizoid place. So, we need to accept as fans that side of story. Even Prince acknowledged that he needed help, we are sad it was too late. But who knows why is that over in that way? We dont have answers for everything, especcialy when in comes to humans.

yes true, it all caught up with him in the end

"Prince don't know how many hits he got"
Reply #167 posted 01/21/19 11:46am

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame



BTW I forgot to mention this...the video on the other page where she discusses how could they possibly get the purple boxes together so quickly for the memorial on Saturday...well, Prince gave out those boxes at PP for his Piano and Mic Gala so the boxes had already been prepared.

Reply #168 posted 01/21/19 12:14pm

Mumio

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



BTW I forgot to mention this...the video on the other page where she discusses how could they possibly get the purple boxes together so quickly for the memorial on Saturday...well, Prince gave out those boxes at PP for his Piano and Mic Gala so the boxes had already been prepared.


yeahthat

[Edited 1/22/19 0:21am]

Welcome to "the org", Mumio…they can have you, but I'll have your love in the end nod
Reply #169 posted 01/22/19 2:27am

June7

Moderator

moderator

June7 said:

Discuss the controversies, insights, new information and respectful opinions about the death of Prince here. Don't troll or bring hateful discussion here. Be cool - or be gone. - June7

—-

Now, here’s what I’d like to do. It’s going to take some help from those who are properly commenting and engaging in discussion, to help out. I’d like those who enjoy this thread to NOT ENGAGE in those who come here and post the negativity. What I’d like instead, is for you to just report that post to me. Do not engage. I repeat, DO NOT ENGAGE ON THE POST! Just refer the post to me, and I’ll take care of the issue promptly. Do not talk about the post to others, just report it to me and then pretend you never saw them it.

Some of you are equally wrong for participating in the derailing of previous versions of this thread. If you don’t add fuel, there’s less fire. So, to those of you who choose to not listen to this idea - and engage - IN ANY WAY OTHER THAN WHAT I LISTED - then I’ll be talking to you as well, and trust me - it will not be a nice conversation.

This thread has been much nicer than the past ones already - if you enjoy having the place to discuss this topic, I hope I can count on you to follow my instructions.

Now, the anniversary of Alex’s passing is very soon, and I cannot guarantee I will be much help these next few days, but you never know. So, please help me out here.

— Thanks - June7

[Please ... please know this. I am moderating this thread very closely. Action is being taken for the rules as I stated them here, regarding this thread. Don't get caught up in this, you won't like it.]

[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #170 posted 01/22/19 5:10am

SpamelaAnusorn

rednblue said:

SpamelaAnusorn said:

ok I don't know what this means


When it comes to word play, maybe urine over your head? biggrin

Maybe u mom just like pineapple taste

I like it when u DANCE 4 MEN!! Hallerlujah
Reply #171 posted 01/22/19 5:13am

SpamelaAnusorn

XxAxX said:

rednblue said:


When it comes to word play, maybe urine over your head? biggrin



nod maybe ole Spamula simply hasn't ma-turd enough to understand yet

maybe u can learn to read and spell somebody name and now Prince is crying

I like it when u DANCE 4 MEN!! Hallerlujah
Reply #172 posted 01/22/19 8:48am

PURPLEIZED3121

again I bring back my original point - think about the quality of life he would ahve had if he had lived? - it would have been a nightmare.

Also, as we know he lived through his lyrics & spoke to us through his songs....the biggest clues lie in AOA of course. Truly belive he was ready.

Reply #173 posted 01/22/19 8:54am

PURPLEIZED3121

sick of conspiracy theories too. The man was in incredible pain, he grew dependent on meds [did he enjoy the highs? - we can only speculate) , he got others/forced others to get him pills of various kinds, it all got out of hand & he sadly passed. Yes there were 3 or 4 very shady people in his life at the end AND during the investigation [Phaedra, Meron & Kirky] but I maintain they were only covering their asses.

At Moline P had the chance to get help but he chose not to..sad but true. Yes Judith Hill should NEVER have left him, likewise Kirky J..BUT again you can't force yourself on to someone who is in denial or just wont accept help.

Reply #174 posted 01/22/19 10:25am

AnnaStesia10

Amen June7, amen. Thank u!!
"A strong spirit transcends rules." - Prince
Reply #175 posted 01/22/19 10:57am

nelcp777

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

again I bring back my original point - think about the quality of life he would ahve had if he had lived? - it would have been a nightmare.

Also, as we know he lived through his lyrics & spoke to us through his songs....the biggest clues lie in AOA of course. Truly belive he was ready.

Sometimes I think the same. I am stuck on the dr visit on the 20th, when Prince and Dr. S had a lengthy talk about withdrawals. I am curious if reality sat in quick and hard with that conversation. Plus the remark Prince made to Kirk in the Escalade about not being about to beat it (paraphrasing) and needing a drink.

If there is truth to that, that Prince was ready to go, then there can be speculation that Prince knew what was in the pills or just took enough vicodin (Watson) to do the job.

Unfortunately, there is a lot of missing information and CC did not really do a thorough investigation on many leads.

Reply #176 posted 01/22/19 3:43pm

luvsexy4all

nelcp777 said:

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

again I bring back my original point - think about the quality of life he would ahve had if he had lived? - it would have been a nightmare.

Also, as we know he lived through his lyrics & spoke to us through his songs....the biggest clues lie in AOA of course. Truly belive he was ready.

Sometimes I think the same. I am stuck on the dr visit on the 20th, when Prince and Dr. S had a lengthy talk about withdrawals. I am curious if reality sat in quick and hard with that conversation. Plus the remark Prince made to Kirk in the Escalade about not being about to beat it (paraphrasing) and needing a drink.

If there is truth to that, that Prince was ready to go, then there can be speculation that Prince knew what was in the pills or just took enough vicodin (Watson) to do the job.

Unfortunately, there is a lot of missing information and CC did not really do a thorough investigation on many leads.

didnt prince freely go to walgreens to fill his own prescriptions? why would he need kirk to use his name then?

Reply #177 posted 01/22/19 3:55pm

42Kristen

grouphug

Reply #178 posted 01/23/19 3:46am

PURPLEIZED3121

42Kristen said:

grouphug

much needed.

Never in a million years did I thnk it would end this way. Saw him c40 times in concert/aftershows etc. The pain he must have been in in the last 5 years or so beggars belief...but he kept giving.

Reply #179 posted 01/23/19 4:18am

Lovejunky

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

42Kristen said:

grouphug

much needed.

Never in a million years did I thnk it would end this way. Saw him c40 times in concert/aftershows etc. The pain he must have been in in the last 5 years or so beggars belief...but he kept giving.

THAT is what hurts the most...

Just a truly incredible human...

what else to say...?

cry

“LOVE IS THE MASTERPLAN”
Reply #180 posted 01/24/19 2:05pm

WeDaBest

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

So basically it would be soiled where he was found? The bed sheets did not look soiled, and they didn't look like they were changed because of the pill they found in the sheets.

Penny, I recall seeing pics in the original Carver County files of 'soiled' white sheets(yellowish/brown staining) discarded along with Fleet enema bottles in the dumpster out back...there was even talk on previous threads if DNA from those sheets had been tied to PRN. Maybe an armload or two of such material was dumped as part of a general post mortem clean up of the death scene. I think the silence was/is bc people are afraid of being criminally charged with tampering with the scene of a 'crime'...It may take a while but, IMO, someone will eventually talk...

[Edited 1/13/19 14:39pm]

In the Carver County files there was also a picture of clothing in the upstairs bathroom that had been disgarded in the waste bin. Couldnt tell if the clothing was soiled or not, but found it strange that it was in the bathroom garbage bin.

Reply #181 posted 01/24/19 9:09pm

PennyPurple

WeDaBest said:


In the Carver County files there was also a picture of clothing in the upstairs bathroom that had been disgarded in the waste bin. Couldnt tell if the clothing was soiled or not, but found it strange that it was in the bathroom garbage bin.


No photo description available.

Image may contain: people standing

No photo description available.


Image may contain: indoor



From Jay Corn's website.

Reply #182 posted 01/24/19 10:18pm

sonshine

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



BTW I forgot to mention this...the video on the other page where she discusses how could they possibly get the purple boxes together so quickly for the memorial on Saturday...well, Prince gave out those boxes at PP for his Piano and Mic Gala so the boxes had already been prepared.


I was at PP in the Sept prior to his passing for an event and they had the purple boxes then already. They were selling them at the souveneir table with some t-shirts and a few other misc items.
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
Reply #183 posted 01/24/19 10:33pm

sonshine

Lovejunky said:

 



ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:


 



Lovejunky said:


Fascinating ..Just came onto my facebook feed...


WOW...


 





I am conflicted with this video.


Jews have to be buried before sundown.



Figure it out. Explain the same logistics. 

Most of the responses onYouTube turned it into a murdered thread. P was not murdered.


 




Also, if you believe this video, do you believe the one in which she claims Capriccio is P's son?






[Edited 1/20/19 8:27am]



I dont know what to believe...


I was captured by her claims that Princes Official Death Certificate is no where to be found..


I then googled...sure enough we can find WHitneys, Michaels Tom Petty,s ..anyone you can name..


you will find their Official DEATH Certificate..


but Prince ?


We can only find a non certified certificate of Death


 


WHY ????


FYI per MN Dept of Health:
"Anyone can get a noncertified copy of a death record...
You must meet the legal requirements to get a certified death certificate.
You must complete an application to request a certificate. You must show valid identification.You must sign your application. You can get a death certificate only if you have tangible interest."
Also on the application for Certified Death Certificates there are two options from which to choose - with or without cause of death information.
http://www.health.state.mn.us/divs/chs/osr/death.html
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
Reply #184 posted 01/24/19 11:45pm

Lovejunky

sonshine said:

Lovejunky said:

I dont know what to believe...

I was captured by her claims that Princes Official Death Certificate is no where to be found..

I then googled...sure enough we can find WHitneys, Michaels Tom Petty,s ..anyone you can name..

you will find their Official DEATH Certificate..

but Prince ?

We can only find a non certified certificate of Death

WHY ????

FYI per MN Dept of Health: "Anyone can get a noncertified copy of a death record... You must meet the legal requirements to get a certified death certificate. You must complete an application to request a certificate. You must show valid identification.You must sign your application. You can get a death certificate only if you have tangible interest." Also on the application for Certified Death Certificates there are two options from which to choose - with or without cause of death information. http://www.health.state.m...death.html

Yes..I get all that sonshine....

“LOVE IS THE MASTERPLAN”
Reply #185 posted 01/25/19 3:50pm

muchtoofast

PennyPurple said:

 



WeDaBest said:


 



 





In the Carver County files there was also a picture of clothing in the upstairs bathroom that had been disgarded in the waste bin.  Couldnt tell if the clothing was soiled or not, but found it strange that it was in the bathroom garbage bin.  




No photo description available.

Image may contain: people standing

No photo description available.


Image may contain: indoor




From Jay Corn's website.


These weren’t soiled clothes, these were
ugly clothes and he did the right thing and got them as far away from his other clothes as possible.
Reply #186 posted 01/25/19 4:25pm

Lovejunky

muchtoofast said:

PennyPurple said:


No photo description available.

Image may contain: people standing

No photo description available.


Image may contain: indoor



From Jay Corn's website.

These weren’t soiled clothes, these were ugly clothes and he did the right thing and got them as far away from his other clothes as possible.

My thoughts EXACTLY

“LOVE IS THE MASTERPLAN”
Reply #187 posted 01/25/19 5:30pm

PennyPurple

Nobody said these clothes were soiled.


I added the pics of the clothes because a poster referred to them in the post, and the pics show them in the trash can and what outfit it was.


I do agree that the outfit is ugly.

Reply #188 posted 01/25/19 8:37pm

lysamari

Your article is very useful, the content is great, I have read a lot of articles, but for your article, it left me a deep impression, thank you for sharing.

Spam deleted - l'ange bleu - moderator

Reply #189 posted 01/25/19 8:38pm

lysamari

Deleted - l'angebleu - moderator

Reply #190 posted 01/27/19 11:31am

muchtoofast

PennyPurple said:

Nobody said these clothes were soiled.



I added the pics of the clothes because a poster referred to them in the post, and the pics show them in the trash can and what outfit it was.



I do agree that the outfit is ugly. 


WeDaBest couldn’t tell if the clothing was soiled or not, no one is referring to anything you said so get over it.
Reply #191 posted 01/29/19 1:07am

ladygirl99

The question is why this thread, not a sticky but other threads that get fewer views and fewer posts are.

This thread should be a permanent sticky imo as it still gotten over 20000 even at Part 13.

But if this question is answered before I do apologize.

Reply #192 posted 01/29/19 2:14pm

leec1

ladygirl99 said:

The question is why this thread, not a sticky but other threads that get fewer views and fewer posts are.

This thread should be a permanent sticky imo as it still gotten over 20000 even at Part 13.

But if this question is answered before I do apologize.

I don't recall ever seeing a response to the question why isn't this thread a sticky as I do remember this question being asked previously.

Reply #193 posted 02/01/19 11:58am

WeDaBest

muchtoofast said:

PennyPurple said:

Nobody said these clothes were soiled.


I added the pics of the clothes because a poster referred to them in the post, and the pics show them in the trash can and what outfit it was.


I do agree that the outfit is ugly.

WeDaBest couldn’t tell if the clothing was soiled or not, no one is referring to anything you said so get over it.

Yes that was me wondering in response to earlier post about a switch in clothing. Thanks for the pictures Penny... and no the clothing does not look soiled

Reply #194 posted 02/02/19 12:50pm

luvsexy4all

Lovejunky said:

muchtoofast said:

PennyPurple said: These weren’t soiled clothes, these were ugly clothes and he did the right thing and got them as far away from his other clothes as possible.

My thoughts EXACTLY

and NO ONE stole them from the garbage to sell???? for shame

Reply #195 posted 02/04/19 8:04pm

ladygirl99

leec1 said:

ladygirl99 said:

The question is why this thread, not a sticky but other threads that get fewer views and fewer posts are.

This thread should be a permanent sticky imo as it still gotten over 20000 even at Part 13.

But if this question is answered before I do apologize.

I don't recall ever seeing a response to the question why isn't this thread a sticky as I do remember this question being asked previously.

I orgnote June7 about this question. I hope he replies on here or I would received a reply from him.

Reply #196 posted 02/05/19 2:30pm

nelcp777

I read an interesting article on CNN's site about James Brown. There were accusations that JB's management kept him on drugs to control his money and keep him less involved. This got me to thinking about certain people in Prince's camp and his situation.

Reply #197 posted 02/05/19 3:33pm

PennyPurple

nelcp777 said:

I read an interesting article on CNN's site about James Brown. There were accusations that JB's management kept him on drugs to control his money and keep him less involved. This got me to thinking about certain people in Prince's camp and his situation.

Nah, Prince wasn't that way. His camp did it his way or they could hit the highway.


Just because Prince was probably addicted doesn't mean he was stoned out of his mind. He still had his wits about him.


I don't think James Brown's Estate is settled yet, is it?

Reply #198 posted 02/05/19 4:10pm

nelcp777

I don’t think James estate is settled. The article focused on rumors of James death. Just made me think of P a little. I still feel there was some embezzlement going on.

PennyPurple said:

 



nelcp777 said:


I read an interesting article on CNN's site abouti still James Brown. There were accusations that JB's management kept him on drugs to control his money and keep him less involved. This got me to thinking about certain people in Prince's camp and his situation.


 


 



Nah, Prince wasn't that way. His camp did it his way or they could hit the highway. 



Just because Prince was probably addicted doesn't mean he was stoned out of his mind. He still had his wits about him.



I don't think James Brown's Estate is settled yet, is it?

Reply #199 posted 02/05/19 5:43pm

PennyPurple

nelcp777 said:

I don’t think James estate is settled. The article focused on rumors of James death. Just made me think of P a little. I still feel there was some embezzlement going on.

Yeah, I agree with you on that.

Reply #200 posted 02/05/19 6:30pm

purplemist7777

PennyPurple said:

 



nelcp777 said:


I don’t think James estate is settled. The article focused on rumors of James death. Just made me think of P a little. I still feel there was some embezzlement going on

Yeah, I agree with you on that. 


Agree also. Wonder if the Estate attorneys ever tracked down the POA for Phaedra?
Reply #201 posted 02/05/19 7:13pm

nelcp777

PennyPurple said:

nelcp777 said:

I don’t think James estate is settled. The article focused on rumors of James death. Just made me think of P a little. I still feel there was some embezzlement going on.

Yeah, I agree with you on that.

Thanks. I also believe P was figuring it out too. I re-read the DEA files from the FOIA. The pills found in the DEA search warrant were in the green room and Room #10. The ones in room #10 contained half pills and I believe were in the CVS Vitamin C bottles.

Do ya'll think Prince was taking these after he arrived from Moline? Also, in Moline, Prince said he mixed up the pills by taking 2 each. No one ever caught on or questioned the other bottle during Moline.

Any thought Penny on why there was no dialud found in either search?

And who had the herpes?

Reply #202 posted 02/05/19 8:07pm

PennyPurple

nelcp777 said:

PennyPurple said:

Yeah, I agree with you on that.

Thanks. I also believe P was figuring it out too. I re-read the DEA files from the FOIA. The pills found in the DEA search warrant were in the green room and Room #10. The ones in room #10 contained half pills and I believe were in the CVS Vitamin C bottles.

Do ya'll think Prince was taking these after he arrived from Moline? Also, in Moline, Prince said he mixed up the pills by taking 2 each. No one ever caught on or questioned the other bottle during Moline.

Any thought Penny on why there was no dialud found in either search?

And who had the herpes?

I still can't figure out the dialud, it was in his system but I don't think it was found in any of the pills.

They said there were over 200 pills scattered thru PP.


I've heard so many different stories on the Herpes, I don't know what to believe. I've read where it was K's medicine, or K's nephew's medicine and then I read where the script was in P's name. ?


Yes, he said he mixed the pills up and wouldn't do it again. Which makes me wonder if he knew 1 was stronger than the other, and then with the pills in the jewelry box. ?

Reply #203 posted 02/05/19 8:56pm

nelcp777

Very confusing about the pills. I think It is time for me to just let go and leave the Org



PennyPurple said:

 



nelcp777 said:


 



PennyPurple said:


 


Yeah, I agree with you on that. 



Thanks. I also believe P was figuring it out too. I re-read the DEA files from the FOIA. The pills found in the DEA search warrant were in the green room and Room #10. The ones in room #10 contained half pills and I believe were in the CVS Vitamin C bottles. 


 


Do ya'll think Prince was taking these after he arrived from Moline? Also, in Moline, Prince said he mixed up the pills by taking 2 each. No one ever caught on or questioned the other bottle during Moline.


 


Any thought Penny on why there was no dialud found in either search?


 


And who had the herpes?



I still can't figure out the dialud, it was in his system but I don't think it was found in any of the pills. 


They said there were over 200 pills scattered thru PP. 



I've heard so many different stories on the Herpes, I don't know what to believe. I've read where it was K's medicine, or K's nephew's medicine and then I read where the script was in P's name. ?


 
Yes, he said he mixed the pills up and wouldn't do it again. Which makes me wonder if he knew 1 was stronger than the other, and then with the pills in the jewelry box. ?


[Edited 2/5/19 20:57pm]
[Edited 2/6/19 14:02pm]
Reply #204 posted 02/05/19 9:20pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

purplemist7777 said:

PennyPurple said:

Yeah, I agree with you on that.

Agree also. Wonder if the Estate attorneys ever tracked down the POA for Phaedra?



I believe there was mucho speculation from the Estate attorneys that it was forged.

Reply #205 posted 02/11/19 7:04am

nelcp777

I am more inclined to believe the Phaedra was the leak to TMZ. Just my opinion, not factual.

Reply #206 posted 02/11/19 10:35pm

PennyPurple

nelcp777 said:

I am more inclined to believe the Phaedra was the leak to TMZ. Just my opinion, not factual.

Do you mean about Moline?

Reply #207 posted 02/12/19 8:50am

nelcp777

PennyPurple said:

nelcp777 said:

I am more inclined to believe the Phaedra was the leak to TMZ. Just my opinion, not factual.

Do you mean about Moline?

Yes I do. I wonder if there was some form of payment for the information. Perhaps even after Prince's passing.

Reply #208 posted 02/12/19 10:19am

nelcp777

Also, per the seized item log, the herpes meds were in Kirk's name. That does not mean he used them. We know from records that Kirk obtained pills for Prince at a minimum from Dr. S (percocet) and possible Dr. Boo (codeine)

Reply #209 posted 02/12/19 10:42am

PennyPurple

nelcp777 said:

Also, per the seized item log, the herpes meds were in Kirk's name. That does not mean he used them. We know from records that Kirk obtained pills for Prince at a minimum from Dr. S (percocet) and possible Dr. Boo (codeine)

Oh good, I'm glad you found that.

Reply #210 posted 02/13/19 12:38am

muchtoofast

nelcp777 said:

Also, per the seized item log, the herpes meds were in Kirk's name. That does not mean he used them. We know from records that Kirk obtained pills for Prince at a minimum from Dr. S (percocet) and possible Dr. Boo (codeine)


If Kirk has herpes it wouldn’t be a shameful thing to have used herpes drugs :/
Reply #211 posted 02/13/19 11:14am

nelcp777

muchtoofast said:

nelcp777 said:

Also, per the seized item log, the herpes meds were in Kirk's name. That does not mean he used them. We know from records that Kirk obtained pills for Prince at a minimum from Dr. S (percocet) and possible Dr. Boo (codeine)

If Kirk has herpes it wouldn’t be a shameful thing to have used herpes drugs :/

I did not say that nor implied it. The medication can also be used for other skin symptons.

[Edited 2/13/19 11:16am]

Reply #212 posted 02/14/19 10:44am

nelcp777

Does anyone know who Thomas Huesman is from Minnesotta? His name is in Kirk's phone records for April 14th. The shows started at 7 and 10 pm. The last communications were around 2:30.

Reply #213 posted 02/14/19 10:54am

PennyPurple

nelcp777 said:

Does anyone know who Thomas Huesman is from Minnesotta? His name is in Kirk's phone records for April 14th. The shows started at 7 and 10 pm. The last communications were around 2:30.

This is from his profile on linkedin.

Summary

Specialties: Cabinetry, Windows, Doors, Countertops, Hardware
Land Developing, building new construction.

Reply #214 posted 02/14/19 11:22am

nelcp777

PennyPurple said:

nelcp777 said:

Does anyone know who Thomas Huesman is from Minnesotta? His name is in Kirk's phone records for April 14th. The shows started at 7 and 10 pm. The last communications were around 2:30.

This is from his profile on linkedin.

Summary

Specialties: Cabinetry, Windows, Doors, Countertops, Hardware
Land Developing, building new construction.

Thanks.

Reply #215 posted 02/16/19 7:57am

Menes

AnnaStesia10 said:

^^^^ True, how he died makes no f'ing sense from the near death incident on the plane one week before he died, his pill usage, the massive amounts of Fentanyl in his body, how he was about to get help the next day for his dependence on pain pills,but then is found in an elevator dead with his clothes on backward, no will, and Kirk, Meron, Phaedra and Tyka aren't speaking and did not help the authorities with his death investigation, no one else in his circle past and current are not speaking either, and now the death investigation is closed with just a determination that it was an accidental overdose of Fentanyl mind you he had MASSIVE amounts of it in his system and doesnt ring alarm bells to anyone. So yeah, his death is shrouded in mystery and fuckery. And yet people want us to shut up and question why we still wanna beat a dead horse and let Prince rest in peace. Prince is gone he doesn't care one bit what we all say and think now. I cannot believe how he went out and how his "friends and family" reacted in the aftermath. It is unreal.

Speaking of beating a dead horse... back in the saddle!

I have examined this thing to death. A reoccuring engima ,yet many clues to still examine.

1. Page 31 in the NY times report( bullet point 60). Dr. Strobel tells detective that there was hydrocdone in the the urine but not the blood. This is consistent with someone who had a dosage in the last 3-4 days prior to death. This should coincide with the "opiate" found in the analysis from Dr. Schulenberg.

2. She( Dr. Strobel) did not indicate that fentanyl was found in the urine . 80--85% of it is usually excreted through urine. She detected it in the blood,which indicates the time of ingestion per the fentanyl metabolite.

3. On page 32,(bullet point 73) Dr. Strobel indicates that there was no doubt that per the high level of fentanyl in the stomach contents, the fentanyl was orally ingested.

4. So far, we have two opiates to choose from and an interesting choice made by Prince as to when he chose to take either of the two. I might add that these pills did not magically appear on the night of his death. They are there all along, and is consistent with marked indicators for separation. He could have easily reached for more hydrocodone on the eve of his "appointment" if the opiate withdrawal was that bad. There is a reason for the switch and amount that was ingested.

Reply #216 posted 02/16/19 8:16am

Menes

Menes said:

AnnaStesia10 said:

^^^^ True, how he died makes no f'ing sense from the near death incident on the plane one week before he died, his pill usage, the massive amounts of Fentanyl in his body, how he was about to get help the next day for his dependence on pain pills,but then is found in an elevator dead with his clothes on backward, no will, and Kirk, Meron, Phaedra and Tyka aren't speaking and did not help the authorities with his death investigation, no one else in his circle past and current are not speaking either, and now the death investigation is closed with just a determination that it was an accidental overdose of Fentanyl mind you he had MASSIVE amounts of it in his system and doesnt ring alarm bells to anyone. So yeah, his death is shrouded in mystery and fuckery. And yet people want us to shut up and question why we still wanna beat a dead horse and let Prince rest in peace. Prince is gone he doesn't care one bit what we all say and think now. I cannot believe how he went out and how his "friends and family" reacted in the aftermath. It is unreal.

Speaking of beating a dead horse... back in the saddle!

I have examined this thing to death. A reoccuring engima ,yet many clues to still examine.

1. Page 31 in the NY times report( bullet point 60). Dr. Strobel tells detective that there was hydrocdone in the the urine but not the blood. This is consistent with someone who had a dosage in the last 3-4 days prior to death. This should coincide with the "opiate" found in the analysis from Dr. Schulenberg.

2. She( Dr. Strobel) did not indicate that fentanyl was found in the urine . 80--85% of it is usually excreted through urine. She detected it in the blood,which indicates the time of ingestion per the fentanyl metabolite.

3. On page 32,(bullet point 73) Dr. Strobel indicates that there was no doubt that per the high level of fentanyl in the stomach contents, the fentanyl was orally ingested.

4. So far, we have two opiates to choose from and an interesting choice made by Prince as to when he chose to take either of the two. I might add that these pills did not magically appear on the night of his death. They are there all along, and is consistent with marked indicators for separation. He could have easily reached for more hydrocodone on the eve of his "appointment" if the opiate withdrawal was that bad. There is a reason for the switch and amount that was ingested.

On Page 65( bullet point 48). To me there is a clear indication of withdrawal symtpoms from prolonged usage. Specifically , numbness and tingling below knees (which feels like pins and needles) . Similar symptoms reported in both hands and he does not seem to to be waking up as expected. He(Prince) has not had symptoms like this in the past. These are neuro-transmitters on fire because of withdrawals in my opinion. He leaves for a show the very next day according to the report.

Reply #217 posted 02/16/19 8:24am

Menes

Menes said:

Menes said:

Speaking of beating a dead horse... back in the saddle!

I have examined this thing to death. A reoccuring engima ,yet many clues to still examine.

1. Page 31 in the NY times report( bullet point 60). Dr. Strobel tells detective that there was hydrocdone in the the urine but not the blood. This is consistent with someone who had a dosage in the last 3-4 days prior to death. This should coincide with the "opiate" found in the analysis from Dr. Schulenberg.

2. She( Dr. Strobel) did not indicate that fentanyl was found in the urine . 80--85% of it is usually excreted through urine. She detected it in the blood,which indicates the time of ingestion per the fentanyl metabolite.

3. On page 32,(bullet point 73) Dr. Strobel indicates that there was no doubt that per the high level of fentanyl in the stomach contents, the fentanyl was orally ingested.

4. So far, we have two opiates to choose from and an interesting choice made by Prince as to when he chose to take either of the two. I might add that these pills did not magically appear on the night of his death. They are there all along, and is consistent with marked indicators for separation. He could have easily reached for more hydrocodone on the eve of his "appointment" if the opiate withdrawal was that bad. There is a reason for the switch and amount that was ingested.

On Page 65( bullet point 48). To me there is a clear indication of withdrawal symtpoms from prolonged usage. Specifically , numbness and tingling below knees (which feels like pins and needles) . Similar symptoms reported in both hands and he does not seem to to be waking up as expected. He(Prince) has not had symptoms like this in the past. These are neuro-transmitters on fire because of withdrawals in my opinion. He leaves for a show the very next day according to the report.

Now, it gets a bit intersting as he prepares to leave for the show. A request is made to Dr. Schulenberg by Kirk for a percocet prescription ( for a back injury from lifting up equipment). The call was made on 4-14-2016. The percocet appears to be for Prince ,which begs the question ...If Prince has opiates already, what is the need for a percocet prescription? When and where did Kirk pick up that medication? Was Prince indeed in possession of the percocet in Atlanta? If so, did he mix his "pills" with the percocet that caused the O.D.?

Reply #218 posted 02/16/19 8:41am

PennyPurple

Good to have you back Menes!

Reply #219 posted 02/16/19 8:47am

Menes

Menes said:

Menes said:

On Page 65( bullet point 48). To me there is a clear indication of withdrawal symtpoms from prolonged usage. Specifically , numbness and tingling below knees (which feels like pins and needles) . Similar symptoms reported in both hands and he does not seem to to be waking up as expected. He(Prince) has not had symptoms like this in the past. These are neuro-transmitters on fire because of withdrawals in my opinion. He leaves for a show the very next day according to the report.

Now, it gets a bit intersting as he prepares to leave for the show. A request is made to Dr. Schulenberg by Kirk for a percocet prescription ( for a back injury from lifting up equipment). The call was made on 4-14-2016. The percocet appears to be for Prince ,which begs the question ...If Prince has opiates already, what is the need for a percocet prescription? When and where did Kirk pick up that medication? Was Prince indeed in possession of the percocet in Atlanta? If so, did he mix his "pills" with the percocet that caused the O.D.?

Paramedics report shows a few things I overlooked. See Page 91( bullet point 43).

Prince had vomit in his mouth, limbs are stiff( arms bent and unable to straighten) due to rigomortis.

In another report on 10-23-13 patient(Prince) admitted and WBC count was high with "left shift". I had to look that up and found it to be an innumberable amout of reasons why his wbc count was high. However, prevailing wisdom seems to indicate some sort of bacterial infection or stress. The report also indicates that he has not been eating for some time. Refuses treatment and wants to remain as natrual as possible. Please be reminded that 5 hour energy drinks are not as "natural as possible" ,so he must have changed his mind about being "natural"at some point. Make of it what you will but these are clear behaviorial changes to me, or lies.

Reply #220 posted 02/16/19 9:03am

Menes

PennyPurple said:

Good to have you back Menes!

Hey Penny! Good to see you have kept this alive. I was just getting around to the numerous amounts of fleet enemas found in all of the bathrooms. Which to me, spells opiate-induced constipation to the extreme, as opposed to a one and off use of the dreaded anti-shit blockers. eek

Reply #221 posted 02/16/19 9:12am

PennyPurple

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Good to have you back Menes!

Hey Penny! Good to see you have kept this alive. I was just getting around to the numerous amounts of fleet enemas found in all of the bathrooms. Which to me, spells opiate-induced constipation to the extreme, as opposed to a one and off use of the dreaded anti-shit blockers. eek

Opiates lock ya up for sure. BUT they do have meds for that specific problem of the opiates blockages.

Reply #222 posted 02/16/19 9:38am

Menes

Menes said:

Menes said:

Now, it gets a bit intersting as he prepares to leave for the show. A request is made to Dr. Schulenberg by Kirk for a percocet prescription ( for a back injury from lifting up equipment). The call was made on 4-14-2016. The percocet appears to be for Prince ,which begs the question ...If Prince has opiates already, what is the need for a percocet prescription? When and where did Kirk pick up that medication? Was Prince indeed in possession of the percocet in Atlanta? If so, did he mix his "pills" with the percocet that caused the O.D.?

Paramedics report shows a few things I overlooked. See Page 91( bullet point 43).

Prince had vomit in his mouth, limbs are stiff( arms bent and unable to straighten) due to rigomortis.

In another report on 10-23-13 patient(Prince) admitted and WBC count was high with "left shift". I had to look that up and found it to be an innumberable amout of reasons why his wbc count was high. However, prevailing wisdom seems to indicate some sort of bacterial infection or stress. The report also indicates that he has not been eating for some time. Refuses treatment and wants to remain as natrual as possible. Please be reminded that 5 hour energy drinks are not as "natural as possible" ,so he must have changed his mind about being "natural"at some point. Make of it what you will but these are clear behaviorial changes to me, or lies.

Although synthetic fentanyl has been mixed with numoerous amounts of other agents, as of this date, the DEA has not been able to match the composition of the fentanyl pills laced with lidocaine, nor tie it to any distribution network/ manufacturers such as ( Mexican Cartels, China, etc.) Indeed, a rare combination. Nevermind that lidocaine in fact decreases the metabolism rate/effects of fentanyl which to me is pretty damn genius.

Conclusion: Prince hid his decades long usage/addiction pretty well, dosed accordingly, but at some point, got tired and eventually seeded control to the drugs. In a fleeting moment of impulse,(which by all accounts he could have used hydrocodone for this one night), He chose a copious amount of something else.

For me, I swing hard right towards suicide. However, there is a slim thought that he did unintentionally confuse the hydrocodone pills with the deadly fentanyl pills since the markings were somewhat indifferent. I surely could counter that with "Why separate anything"?

[Edited 2/16/19 9:48am]

Reply #223 posted 02/16/19 12:44pm

luvsexy4all

but why ..after the plane incident... would he go and take more.... again????

Reply #224 posted 02/16/19 2:42pm

nelcp777

Did Prince consume any Percocets? I may be wrong, but I thought those pills were accounted for and Kirk told emergency officials Percocet cos Kirk was unaware of the pills in the bayer and Alene bottles. Eventually Prince confesses to the Watson pills cos the doc calls bs on the Percocet story.
Menes, do you think Prince already had the Watson pills before Atlanta or he got them in Atlanta?



Menes said:

 



Menes said:


 



Menes said:


 


Speaking of beating a dead horse... back in the saddle!

I have examined this thing to death. A reoccuring engima ,yet many clues to still examine.

1. Page 31 in the NY times report( bullet point 60). Dr. Strobel tells detective that there was hydrocdone in the the urine but not the blood. This is consistent with someone who had a dosage in the last 3-4 days prior to death. This should coincide with the "opiate" found in the analysis from Dr. Schulenberg. 

2. She( Dr. Strobel) did not indicate that fentanyl was found in the urine . 80--85% of it is usually excreted through urine. She detected it in the blood,which indicates the time of ingestion per the fentanyl metabolite. 

3. On page 32,(bullet point 73) Dr. Strobel indicates that there was no doubt that per the high level of fentanyl in the stomach contents, the fentanyl was orally ingested.

4. So far, we have two opiates to choose from and an interesting choice made by Prince as to when he chose to take either of the two. I might add that these pills did not magically appear on the night of his death. They are there all along, and is consistent with marked indicators for separation. He could have easily reached for more hydrocodone on the eve of his "appointment" if the opiate withdrawal was that bad. There is a reason for the switch and amount that was ingested.


 


 



On Page 65( bullet point 48). To me there is a clear indication of withdrawal symtpoms from prolonged usage. Specifically , numbness and tingling below knees (which feels like pins and needles) . Similar symptoms reported in both hands and he does not seem to to be waking up as expected. He(Prince) has not had symptoms like this in the past. These are neuro-transmitters on fire because of withdrawals in my opinion. He leaves for a show the very next day according to the report. 



Now, it gets a bit intersting as he prepares to leave for the show. A request is made to Dr. Schulenberg by Kirk for a percocet prescription ( for a back injury from lifting up equipment). The call was made on 4-14-2016. The percocet appears to be for Prince ,which begs the question ...If Prince has opiates already, what is the need for a percocet prescription? When and where did Kirk pick up that medication? Was Prince indeed in possession of the percocet in Atlanta? If so, did he mix his "pills" with the percocet that caused the O.D.? 

Reply #225 posted 02/16/19 3:22pm

Bodhitheblackdog

PennyPurple said:

Good to have you back Menes!

yes yes yes

It's been tooooo long!

Reply #226 posted 02/16/19 3:23pm

Menes

luvsexy4all said:

but why ..after the plane incident... would he go and take more.... again????

Your guess would be as acceptable as any. I have my own speculation which may amount to tits on a bull.

Reply #227 posted 02/16/19 3:25pm

Bodhitheblackdog

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

Hey Penny! Good to see you have kept this alive. I was just getting around to the numerous amounts of fleet enemas found in all of the bathrooms. Which to me, spells opiate-induced constipation to the extreme, as opposed to a one and off use of the dreaded anti-shit blockers. eek

Opiates lock ya up for sure. BUT they do have meds for that specific problem of the opiates blockages.

not generally available to people who are in denial about their addiction, are secretive and controlling and aren't really candid and honest with the medical people they do consult...sarcasm here.

Reply #228 posted 02/16/19 3:47pm

PennyPurple

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

Opiates lock ya up for sure. BUT they do have meds for that specific problem of the opiates blockages.

not generally available to people who are in denial about their addiction, are secretive and controlling and aren't really candid and honest with the medical people they do consult...sarcasm here.

Yeah I know but they would've helped him so much, ... if only he would've asked for help.

Reply #229 posted 02/16/19 3:58pm

Menes

nelcp777 said:

Did Prince consume any Percocets? I may be wrong, but I thought those pills were accounted for and Kirk told emergency officials Percocet cos Kirk was unaware of the pills in the bayer and Alene bottles. Eventually Prince confesses to the Watson pills cos the doc calls bs on the Percocet story. Menes, do you think Prince already had the Watson pills before Atlanta or he got them in Atlanta? Menes said:

Now, it gets a bit intersting as he prepares to leave for the show. A request is made to Dr. Schulenberg by Kirk for a percocet prescription ( for a back injury from lifting up equipment). The call was made on 4-14-2016. The percocet appears to be for Prince ,which begs the question ...If Prince has opiates already, what is the need for a percocet prescription? When and where did Kirk pick up that medication? Was Prince indeed in possession of the percocet in Atlanta? If so, did he mix his "pills" with the percocet that caused the O.D.?

Nelcp777,

This is where is gets a bit murky. The documents do not specifically state whether Kirk gave the percocet to Prince .

The doctor who admonished Prince for insulting her intelligence did so because of the amount of narcan that was needed to revive him . That did not square well with just taking 1-2 percocet pills. She knew he was lying. Kirk also informed the staff that he thought it was just the percocets so we can assume that he may have given Prince the percocet.

As to the second question, I do believe that Prince was in possession of illicit substances prior to to departing from Atlanta .On April 7th when Prince went to see Dr. Schulenberg , he complained of numbness, tingling in his hands and was vomiting the night before. Prince attributed this all to some "soup" he had eaten. When Dr. Schulenberg asked Prince what medications was he taking for the numbness in his hands , Prince stated that he could not remember what it was.

Now, on 4-19, Kirk called Dr.Schulenberg because he was concerned that Prince was using opiates. Prince ( while at the visit) was asking Dr. Schulenberg about opiate withdrawal symptoms while at the same time explaining to Dr. Schulenberg that all he took was some tylenol because he felt "antsy".

In short , if he only copped the watson 853's when he got to Atlanta, that was a very short period of time to have such withdrawal symptoms.

What we have looked at in this forum is the pill that were found in the black bag that he took on the trip. It should tells us more than likely what pill he took or mixed. My guess is that it is the oxycodone pill.This is the same pill in the black bag that was on the hospital surveillance video in Moline and later found on Prince's bed on 4-21 @ PP. That shold square that up.

Now, he either took a shit load of the oxycodone to OD like that , or, he did in fact mix the pills,(combination of percocet and oxycodone). I lean towards the latter. There is no fentanyl to mention at this point, which clearly shows at the very least, some idea of what was what.


[Edited 2/16/19 16:05pm]

Reply #230 posted 02/16/19 4:03pm

Menes

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

Good to have you back Menes!

yes yes yes

It's been tooooo long!

Holaaaaaaa amor! We are back in it. Harder than ever.

Reply #231 posted 02/16/19 4:34pm

Menes

Menes said:

nelcp777 said:

Did Prince consume any Percocets? I may be wrong, but I thought those pills were accounted for and Kirk told emergency officials Percocet cos Kirk was unaware of the pills in the bayer and Alene bottles. Eventually Prince confesses to the Watson pills cos the doc calls bs on the Percocet story. Menes, do you think Prince already had the Watson pills before Atlanta or he got them in Atlanta? Menes said:

Nelcp777,

This is where is gets a bit murky. The documents do not specifically state whether Kirk gave the percocet to Prince .

The doctor who admonished Prince for insulting her intelligence did so because of the amount of narcan that was needed to revive him . That did not square well with just taking 1-2 percocet pills. She knew he was lying. Kirk also informed the staff that he thought it was just the percocets so we can assume that he may have given Prince the percocet.

As to the second question, I do believe that Prince was in possession of illicit substances prior to to departing from Atlanta .On April 7th when Prince went to see Dr. Schulenberg , he complained of numbness, tingling in his hands and was vomiting the night before. Prince attributed this all to some "soup" he had eaten. When Dr. Schulenberg asked Prince what medications was he taking for the numbness in his hands , Prince stated that he could not remember what it was.

Now, on 4-19, Kirk called Dr.Schulenberg because he was concerned that Prince was using opiates. Prince ( while at the visit) was asking Dr. Schulenberg about opiate withdrawal symptoms while at the same time explaining to Dr. Schulenberg that all he took was some tylenol because he felt "antsy".

In short , if he only copped the watson 853's when he got to Atlanta, that was a very short period of time to have such withdrawal symptoms.

What we have looked at in this forum is the pill that were found in the black bag that he took on the trip. It should tells us more than likely what pill he took or mixed. My guess is that it is the oxycodone pill.This is the same pill in the black bag that was on the hospital surveillance video in Moline and later found on Prince's bed on 4-21 @ PP. That shold square that up.

Now, he either took a shit load of the oxycodone to OD like that , or, he did in fact mix the pills,(combination of percocet and oxycodone). I lean towards the latter. There is no fentanyl to mention at this point, which clearly shows at the very least, some idea of what was what.


[Edited 2/16/19 16:05pm]

Just in case ... the bag on the bed( the same as the one seen on the video in Moline) still had some pills in it.

Now , if we put on our thinking caps for just a minute... that would mean that Prince is aware of the pills in that bag, on his bed, that very night! He did not reach for those pills, but rather, opted for something else in another bottle.

The post mortem analysis clearly states that there was oxycodone (hydrocodone?) in the urine only and not the blood. This meant that it had been at least 3-4 days since he last ingested those. A certain "trigger" caused him to reach for something far more intense and in copious amounts.

Remember ,they are for the most part, separated via different bottles.

Now, the burning question could be this: Did he have the oxycodone all along but picked up/gained possession of the fentanyl laced pills in Atlanta? My opinion is no, but it is something to think about.

[Edited 2/16/19 16:35pm]

Reply #232 posted 02/16/19 4:42pm

nelcp777

Menes,
Thanks for your insight.
I apologize in advance for my ignorance or slowness. I have done some casual research about drugs. Most sites state fentanyl stays in the body up to 5 days if ingested orally. Sine the pills are fake, the consistency in composition will be varied. I have read most makers use cement mixers to create the pill mixture. Sorry, I digress.
I thought the withdrawals may have come from dialed. Now, I am not sure. If the withdrawals were from fentanyl in early April, then P procured the pills earlier. This may explain the half pills.
I also read that Prince had fentanyl in his bloodstream and stomach. The latter means his body did not have enough time to process the fentanyl. The bottles looked almost empty in the photos. If I recall, at the hospital, the bottle was described as full. That of course is subjective.
Rigor can start from 2 to 6 hours depending on temp, age and weight.
It is frustrating to figure out. The fentanyl was located in the green room with the exception of the jewelry box in the hat room.
No logic to storage or separation.



Menes said:

 



nelcp777 said:


Did Prince consume any Percocets? I may be wrong, but I thought those pills were accounted for and Kirk told emergency officials Percocet cos Kirk was unaware of the pills in the bayer and Alene bottles. Eventually Prince confesses to the Watson pills cos the doc calls bs on the Percocet story. Menes, do you think Prince already had the Watson pills before Atlanta or he got them in Atlanta? Menes said:

 


Now, it gets a bit intersting as he prepares to leave for the show. A request is made to Dr. Schulenberg by Kirk for a percocet prescription ( for a back injury from lifting up equipment). The call was made on 4-14-2016. The percocet appears to be for Prince ,which begs the question ...If Prince has opiates already, what is the need for a percocet prescription? When and where did Kirk pick up that medication? Was Prince indeed in possession of the percocet in Atlanta? If so, did he mix his "pills" with the percocet that caused the O.D.? 




Nelcp777,

This is where is gets a bit murky. The documents do not specifically state whether Kirk gave the percocet to Prince .

The doctor who admonished Prince for insulting her intelligence did so because of the amount of narcan that was needed to revive him . That did not square well with just taking 1-2 percocet pills. She knew he was lying. Kirk also informed the staff that he thought it was just the percocets so we can assume that he may have given Prince the percocet.

As to the second question, I do believe that Prince was in possession of illicit substances prior to to departing from Atlanta .On April 7th when Prince went to see Dr. Schulenberg , he complained of numbness, tingling in his hands and was vomiting the night before. Prince attributed this all to some "soup" he had eaten. When Dr. Schulenberg asked Prince what medications was he taking for the numbness in his hands , Prince stated that he could not remember what it was.

Now, on 4-19, Kirk called Dr.Schulenberg because he was concerned that Prince was using opiates. Prince ( while at the visit) was asking Dr. Schulenberg about opiate withdrawal symptoms while at the same time explaining to Dr. Schulenberg that all he took was some tylenol because he felt "antsy".

In short , if he only copped the watson 853's when he got to Atlanta, that was a very short period of time to have such withdrawal symptoms. 

What we have looked at in this forum is the pill that were found in the black bag that he took on the trip. It should tells us more than likely what pill he took or mixed. My guess is that it is the oxycodone pill.This is the same pill in the black bag that was on the hospital surveillance video in Moline and later found on Prince's bed on 4-21 @ PP. That shold square that up.

Now, he either took a shit load of the oxycodone to OD like that , or, he did in fact mix the pills,(combination of percocet and oxycodone). I lean towards the latter. There is no fentanyl to mention at this point, which clearly shows at the very least, some idea of what was what. 


[Edited 2/16/19 16:05pm]

Reply #233 posted 02/16/19 5:10pm

Menes

nelcp777 said:

Menes, Thanks for your insight. I apologize in advance for my ignorance or slowness. I have done some casual research about drugs. Most sites state fentanyl stays in the body up to 5 days if ingested orally. Sine the pills are fake, the consistency in composition will be varied. I have read most makers use cement mixers to create the pill mixture. Sorry, I digress. I thought the withdrawals may have come from dialed. Now, I am not sure. If the withdrawals were from fentanyl in early April, then P procured the pills earlier. This may explain the half pills. I also read that Prince had fentanyl in his bloodstream and stomach. The latter means his body did not have enough time to process the fentanyl. The bottles looked almost empty in the photos. If I recall, at the hospital, the bottle was described as full. That of course is subjective. Rigor can start from 2 to 6 hours depending on temp, age and weight. It is frustrating to figure out. The fentanyl was located in the green room with the exception of the jewelry box in the hat room. No logic to storage or separation. Menes said:

Nelcp777,

This is where is gets a bit murky. The documents do not specifically state whether Kirk gave the percocet to Prince .

The doctor who admonished Prince for insulting her intelligence did so because of the amount of narcan that was needed to revive him . That did not square well with just taking 1-2 percocet pills. She knew he was lying. Kirk also informed the staff that he thought it was just the percocets so we can assume that he may have given Prince the percocet.

As to the second question, I do believe that Prince was in possession of illicit substances prior to to departing from Atlanta .On April 7th when Prince went to see Dr. Schulenberg , he complained of numbness, tingling in his hands and was vomiting the night before. Prince attributed this all to some "soup" he had eaten. When Dr. Schulenberg asked Prince what medications was he taking for the numbness in his hands , Prince stated that he could not remember what it was.

Now, on 4-19, Kirk called Dr.Schulenberg because he was concerned that Prince was using opiates. Prince ( while at the visit) was asking Dr. Schulenberg about opiate withdrawal symptoms while at the same time explaining to Dr. Schulenberg that all he took was some tylenol because he felt "antsy".

In short , if he only copped the watson 853's when he got to Atlanta, that was a very short period of time to have such withdrawal symptoms.

What we have looked at in this forum is the pill that were found in the black bag that he took on the trip. It should tells us more than likely what pill he took or mixed. My guess is that it is the oxycodone pill.This is the same pill in the black bag that was on the hospital surveillance video in Moline and later found on Prince's bed on 4-21 @ PP. That shold square that up.

Now, he either took a shit load of the oxycodone to OD like that , or, he did in fact mix the pills,(combination of percocet and oxycodone). I lean towards the latter. There is no fentanyl to mention at this point, which clearly shows at the very least, some idea of what was what.


[Edited 2/16/19 16:05pm]

Nelcp777,

A few small details I shall share.

Carver county item # 40... (64.5) watson 853's. The contents of the bayer bottle located near Prince's bed.They were tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Carver county item # 41... (15) white oblong pils located in tissue near jewelry box . One pill was tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Carver county item #112...(49) whole and 3 half pills located in Prince's suitcase in his bedroom with ID (P. bravestrong) . One pill was tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Carver county item #115...(27) white oblong pills located in cvs bottle in black suitcase in Prince's bedroom with the Id (P. bravestrong). One pill was tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Majority of the pills seemed to have contained fentanyl and lidocaine even though only one of each was tested. The scientist who did the testing explained how she concluded such.

Here's a monkey wrench: Why are these pills (with the fentanyl in it) even in the suitcases or black bag?

[Edited 2/16/19 17:11pm]

[Edited 2/16/19 17:12pm]

Reply #234 posted 02/16/19 5:34pm

Menes

Menes said:

nelcp777 said:

Menes, Thanks for your insight. I apologize in advance for my ignorance or slowness. I have done some casual research about drugs. Most sites state fentanyl stays in the body up to 5 days if ingested orally. Sine the pills are fake, the consistency in composition will be varied. I have read most makers use cement mixers to create the pill mixture. Sorry, I digress. I thought the withdrawals may have come from dialed. Now, I am not sure. If the withdrawals were from fentanyl in early April, then P procured the pills earlier. This may explain the half pills. I also read that Prince had fentanyl in his bloodstream and stomach. The latter means his body did not have enough time to process the fentanyl. The bottles looked almost empty in the photos. If I recall, at the hospital, the bottle was described as full. That of course is subjective. Rigor can start from 2 to 6 hours depending on temp, age and weight. It is frustrating to figure out. The fentanyl was located in the green room with the exception of the jewelry box in the hat room. No logic to storage or separation. Menes said:

Nelcp777,

A few small details I shall share.

Carver county item # 40... (64.5) watson 853's. The contents of the bayer bottle located near Prince's bed.They were tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Carver county item # 41... (15) white oblong pils located in tissue near jewelry box . One pill was tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Carver county item #112...(49) whole and 3 half pills located in Prince's suitcase in his bedroom with ID (P. bravestrong) . One pill was tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Carver county item #115...(27) white oblong pills located in cvs bottle in black suitcase in Prince's bedroom with the Id (P. bravestrong). One pill was tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Majority of the pills seemed to have contained fentanyl and lidocaine even though only one of each was tested. The scientist who did the testing explained how she concluded such.

Here's a monkey wrench: Why are these pills (with the fentanyl in it) even in the suitcases or black bag?

[Edited 2/16/19 17:11pm]

[Edited 2/16/19 17:12pm]

Monkey wrench #2 ... In addition to monkey wrench #1... I noticed that all of the fentanyl /lidocaine pills were in the suitcase but not the black bag which was seen on the video in Moline carried by Kirk.

The black bag which coincides with Carver county item #63 (and was found on Prince's bed), was a yellow pill and was tested. The pill only contained oxycodone. As per my earlier post, it appears that fentanyl was not used during Atlanta.

Food for thought...

Why are all these pills in these traveling bags? Why did they remain in these bags after he got back from Moline an entire week? Did he not unpack anything? What state of mind could he have been in to leave the pills in these bags when he surely knew that there was a possibility that he could have been busted with them? No attempt to hide the pills at all? Thoughts anyone?

[Edited 2/16/19 17:42pm]

Reply #235 posted 02/16/19 6:11pm

Bodhitheblackdog

Menes said:

Menes said:

Nelcp777,

A few small details I shall share.

Carver county item # 40... (64.5) watson 853's. The contents of the bayer bottle located near Prince's bed.They were tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Carver county item # 41... (15) white oblong pils located in tissue near jewelry box . One pill was tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Carver county item #112...(49) whole and 3 half pills located in Prince's suitcase in his bedroom with ID (P. bravestrong) . One pill was tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Carver county item #115...(27) white oblong pills located in cvs bottle in black suitcase in Prince's bedroom with the Id (P. bravestrong). One pill was tested and contained fentanyl and lidocaine.

Majority of the pills seemed to have contained fentanyl and lidocaine even though only one of each was tested. The scientist who did the testing explained how she concluded such.

Here's a monkey wrench: Why are these pills (with the fentanyl in it) even in the suitcases or black bag?

[Edited 2/16/19 17:11pm]

[Edited 2/16/19 17:12pm]

Monkey wrench #2 ... In addition to monkey wrench #1... I noticed that all of the fentanyl /lidocaine pills were in the suitcase but not the black bag which was seen on the video in Moline carried by Kirk.

The black bag which coincides with Carver county item #63 (and was found on Prince's bed), was a yellow pill and was tested. The pill only contained oxycodone. As per my earlier post, it appears that fentanyl was not used during Atlanta.

Food for thought...

Why are all these pills in these traveling bags? Why did they remain in these bags after he got back from Moline an entire week? Did he not unpack anything? What state of mind could he have been in to leave the pills in these bags when he surely knew that there was a possibility that he could have been busted with them? No attempt to hide the pills at all? Thoughts anyone?

[Edited 2/16/19 17:42pm]

1) re no attempt to hide pills: He was PRINCE, he lived in a bubble of control and privacy (he thought...the mind states of the employees/hangers on tell a different tale) bordering on the absurd. It made no difference to him if the pills were in his travel bag, tangled up in his sheets, a jewelry box, in someone else's name, the laundry room...whatever. The only thing that mattered was that he could access them with relative ease.

He never feared getting popped IMO...he was too deep into his addiction to think about that. Acute constipation, tingling in his extrematies, vomiting (the never-ending 'flu') were his preoccupation at the end...as well as saying goodby with the P&M tours.....being tidy, organized, mindful was not on the agenda. He was DEATHLY ill from his addiction.

2) re the preponderance of Fentanyl and lidocaine speaks to me of a custom order (s) , long time use, a sophisticated attempt to regulate metabolism to enable greater consumption without losing consciousness or at least to preserve the ability to talk, sing, play the piano....

Menes: Welcome back, bro...I'm feeling it's time for someone in the 'inner circle' to talk...needed much more than a Prince twitter account.

Reply #236 posted 02/16/19 7:01pm

Menes

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Menes said:

Monkey wrench #2 ... In addition to monkey wrench #1... I noticed that all of the fentanyl /lidocaine pills were in the suitcase but not the black bag which was seen on the video in Moline carried by Kirk.

The black bag which coincides with Carver county item #63 (and was found on Prince's bed), was a yellow pill and was tested. The pill only contained oxycodone. As per my earlier post, it appears that fentanyl was not used during Atlanta.

Food for thought...

Why are all these pills in these traveling bags? Why did they remain in these bags after he got back from Moline an entire week? Did he not unpack anything? What state of mind could he have been in to leave the pills in these bags when he surely knew that there was a possibility that he could have been busted with them? No attempt to hide the pills at all? Thoughts anyone?

[Edited 2/16/19 17:42pm]

1) re no attempt to hide pills: He was PRINCE, he lived in a bubble of control and privacy (he thought...the mind states of the employees/hangers on tell a different tale) bordering on the absurd. It made no difference to him if the pills were in his travel bag, tangled up in his sheets, a jewelry box, in someone else's name, the laundry room...whatever. The only thing that mattered was that he could access them with relative ease.

He never feared getting popped IMO...he was too deep into his addiction to think about that. Acute constipation, tingling in his extrematies, vomiting (the never-ending 'flu') were his preoccupation at the end...as well as saying goodby with the P&M tours.....being tidy, organized, mindful was not on the agenda. He was DEATHLY ill from his addiction.

2) re the preponderance of Fentanyl and lidocaine speaks to me of a custom order (s) , long time use, a sophisticated attempt to regulate metabolism to enable greater consumption without losing consciousness or at least to preserve the ability to talk, sing, play the piano....

Menes: Welcome back, bro...I'm feeling it's time for someone in the 'inner circle' to talk...needed much more than a Prince twitter account.

It amazes me how many people can't see that what you posted above is a profound assessment of the situation .

1. If you tell someone that his extremities were tingling because this is a tell tale sign of withdrawals, they counter with : It's from him playing so long and his hip pain radiated thru his fingers.
2. If you tell someone that Prince was not eating, lost too much weight and was vomiting because of opiate use/withdrawals,they counter with : He never really ate that much/he was always "small framed".
3. If you ask someone how many people do they know with enemas all over the house in conjunction with a shit load of pills all over the house , they counter with : Prince was balancing habits and is a known vegan detox guru.
4. If you ask someone why Prince felt that he needed to lie to any physician who clearly had scientific analsysis and the expertise to know what he was doing, they counter with : He was a private man.
5. If you ask someone why would Prince slam so much junk (7) days after a near death experience, they counter with : It was an accident.
6. If you ask someone what was accidental about the first near death experience , they counter with :someone must've slipped him something else (at the direction of Smiling Judas).
7. If you ask someone if they thought Prince committed suicide, they counter with : Prince was too spiritual for that. The list goes on.

A common practice for those in denial is to make the fundamental mistake of believing that a vast amount of evidence is in fact false . Ask the loved ones of those who were addicted and are now gone.

Reply #237 posted 02/16/19 7:49pm

Bodhitheblackdog

Menes said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

1) re no attempt to hide pills: He was PRINCE, he lived in a bubble of control and privacy (he thought...the mind states of the employees/hangers on tell a different tale) bordering on the absurd. It made no difference to him if the pills were in his travel bag, tangled up in his sheets, a jewelry box, in someone else's name, the laundry room...whatever. The only thing that mattered was that he could access them with relative ease.

He never feared getting popped IMO...he was too deep into his addiction to think about that. Acute constipation, tingling in his extrematies, vomiting (the never-ending 'flu') were his preoccupation at the end...as well as saying goodby with the P&M tours.....being tidy, organized, mindful was not on the agenda. He was DEATHLY ill from his addiction.

2) re the preponderance of Fentanyl and lidocaine speaks to me of a custom order (s) , long time use, a sophisticated attempt to regulate metabolism to enable greater consumption without losing consciousness or at least to preserve the ability to talk, sing, play the piano....

Menes: Welcome back, bro...I'm feeling it's time for someone in the 'inner circle' to talk...needed much more than a Prince twitter account.

It amazes me how many people can't see that what you posted above is a profound assessment of the situation .

1. If you tell someone that his extremities were tingling because this is a tell tale sign of withdrawals, they counter with : It's from him playing so long and his hip pain radiated thru his fingers.
2. If you tell someone that Prince was not eating, lost too much weight and was vomiting because of opiate use/withdrawals,they counter with : He never really ate that much/he was always "small framed".
3. If you ask someone how many people do they know with enemas all over the house in conjunction with a shit load of pills all over the house , they counter with : Prince was balancing habits and is a known vegan detox guru.
4. If you ask someone why Prince felt that he needed to lie to any physician who clearly had scientific analsysis and the expertise to know what he was doing, they counter with : He was a private man.
5. If you ask someone why would Prince slam so much junk (7) days after a near death experience, they counter with : It was an accident.
6. If you ask someone what was accidental about the first near death experience , they counter with :someone must've slipped him something else (at the direction of Smiling Judas).
7. If you ask someone if they thought Prince committed suicide, they counter with : Prince was too spiritual for that. The list goes on.

A common practice for those in denial is to make the fundamental mistake of believing that a vast amount of evidence is in fact false . Ask the loved ones of those who were addicted and are now gone.

I know I've said it many times on this thread, but I'll say it again because it's such a valuable human teaching and truth:

DENIAL IS THE STRONGEST HUMAN EMOTION.

[Edited 2/16/19 19:53pm]

Reply #238 posted 02/17/19 3:33am

roxy831

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Menes said:

It amazes me how many people can't see that what you posted above is a profound assessment of the situation .

1. If you tell someone that his extremities were tingling because this is a tell tale sign of withdrawals, they counter with : It's from him playing so long and his hip pain radiated thru his fingers.
2. If you tell someone that Prince was not eating, lost too much weight and was vomiting because of opiate use/withdrawals,they counter with : He never really ate that much/he was always "small framed".
3. If you ask someone how many people do they know with enemas all over the house in conjunction with a shit load of pills all over the house , they counter with : Prince was balancing habits and is a known vegan detox guru.
4. If you ask someone why Prince felt that he needed to lie to any physician who clearly had scientific analsysis and the expertise to know what he was doing, they counter with : He was a private man.
5. If you ask someone why would Prince slam so much junk (7) days after a near death experience, they counter with : It was an accident.
6. If you ask someone what was accidental about the first near death experience , they counter with :someone must've slipped him something else (at the direction of Smiling Judas).
7. If you ask someone if they thought Prince committed suicide, they counter with : Prince was too spiritual for that. The list goes on.

A common practice for those in denial is to make the fundamental mistake of believing that a vast amount of evidence is in fact false . Ask the loved ones of those who were addicted and are now gone.

I know I've said it many times on this thread, but I'll say it again because it's such a valuable human teaching and truth:

DENIAL IS THE STRONGEST HUMAN EMOTION.

[Edited 2/16/19 19:53pm]

Thank you. That is all I will say.

Welcome home class. We've come a long way. - RIP Prince
Reply #239 posted 02/17/19 11:33am

luvsexy4all

kirk has the answers to the pill fiascos and is not being "forced" to reveal

Reply #240 posted 02/18/19 2:39am

Dimitri10

luvsexy4all said:

kirk has the answers to the pill fiascos and is not being "forced" to reveal

I reakon he has revealed to authorities what went down to clear his name

"Prince don't know how many hits he got"
Reply #241 posted 02/18/19 4:55am

nelcp777

Dimitri10 said:

 



luvsexy4all said:


kirk has the answers to the pill fiascos and is not being "forced" to reveal



 


I reakon he has revealed to authorities what went down to clear his name


When did that happen?
Reply #242 posted 02/18/19 6:57am

PennyPurple

Dimitri10 said:

luvsexy4all said:

kirk has the answers to the pill fiascos and is not being "forced" to reveal

I reakon he has revealed to authorities what went down to clear his name

No he hasn't. He only gave them that initial interview. He lawyered up and hasn't spoke with them since. Meron either. They tried to make contact with Phaedra too, and it was a no go.

Reply #243 posted 02/18/19 10:49am

Bodhitheblackdog

PennyPurple said:

Dimitri10 said:

I reakon he has revealed to authorities what went down to clear his name

No he hasn't. He only gave them that initial interview. He lawyered up and hasn't spoke with them since. Meron either. They tried to make contact with Phaedra too, and it was a no go.

Even though I have long known this and have seen this info posted many times on this thread, it's STUNNING to read and absorb the words once again...they speak volumes. Thanks for sharing again, Penny.

Reply #244 posted 02/18/19 11:48am

PennyPurple

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

No he hasn't. He only gave them that initial interview. He lawyered up and hasn't spoke with them since. Meron either. They tried to make contact with Phaedra too, and it was a no go.

Even though I have long known this and have seen this info posted many times on this thread, it's STUNNING to read and absorb the words once again...they speak volumes. Thanks for sharing again, Penny.

It's shocking to me too. sad

Reply #245 posted 02/18/19 1:18pm

nelcp777

PennyPurple said:

 



Bodhitheblackdog said:


 



PennyPurple said:


 


No he hasn't. He only gave them that initial interview. He lawyered up and hasn't spoke with them since. Meron either. They tried to make contact with Phaedra too, and it was a no go. 



Even though  I have long known this and have seen this info posted many times on this thread, it's STUNNING to read and absorb the words once again...they speak volumes. Thanks for sharing again, Penny.



It's shocking to me too.  sad


And sad.
Reply #246 posted 02/18/19 1:24pm

leec1

nelcp777 said:

PennyPurple said:

It's shocking to me too. sad

And sad.

It is definitely sad. However, it was never shocking to me. Perhaps I am just jaded.

I never expected that his "close associates": Kirk, etc. would provide any information because they were complicit. I would surmise Kirk, Meron may have arranged or picked up drugs for him as they were responsible for handling most day to day matters for P.

Reply #247 posted 02/18/19 1:58pm

nelcp777

Do you think perhaps P got the counterfeit hydrocone when he was in San Fransisco?

Reply #248 posted 02/18/19 2:01pm

leec1

nelcp777 said:

Do you think perhaps P got the counterfeit hydrocone when he was in San Fransisco?

I think P. bought drugs from multiple sources. I think he had a local source in Minn. and he also bought drugs at concert venues.

Reply #249 posted 02/18/19 5:15pm

Menes

nelcp777 said:

PennyPurple said:

It's shocking to me too. sad

And sad.

I'm gonna swing the pendulum the other way.

I think Prince used Kirk as a legitimate cover ( having Dr.Schulenberg write a script for Percocet) in the event anything was stated about opiate use ( see Kirks questioning of Prince at Moline Hospital). This would be consistent with what ex-managers have stated that Prince would have them try to do. I believe that Prince did not want to be tied to anything that could link him to using any form of drugs, ililcit or not.

In Moline, he (Kirk)repeatedly asked him where did he get the other drugs ( opiates) and when Prince responds that it was in his bag, it appears Kirk did not know Prince was in possession of said substances besides the percocet. What Kirk inadvertently admitted to the doctors in Moline is knowledge about the percocet since there was a script in his name .He (kirk ) did lie to the detective about getting a script for Prince. He had also apologized to Dr. Schulenberg for requesting that he write a script for the (15) percocet pills. Dr.Schulenberg knew it was for Prince but elected to put it in Kirk's name.

I would assume the if Kirk was giving Prince these drugs, Prince would have at least stated something to the effect of " you gave them to me /got them for me" when Kirk was drilling him for information. .

Let's also remember how defiant and adamant Prince was when he was speaking to Judith Hill about what they had put into his body. He went into a spiritual diatribe to excuse the fact that he needed to know what they were putting in his body.

I think Prince procured these drugs thru a local source unknown to any associate. This was a shit load of narcotics for one person and one would need a very reliable and confidential source to procure such amounts. This is a very very clever person.

[Edited 2/18/19 17:18pm]

Reply #250 posted 02/18/19 5:29pm

PennyPurple

That's very true Menes. I still think if KJ wanted to help solve the mystery he could've at least answered more of their questions.

Menes said:

I'm gonna swing the pendulum the other way.

I think Prince used Kirk as a legitimate cover ( having Dr.Schulenberg write a script for Percocet) in the event anything was stated about opiate use ( see Kirks questioning of Prince at Moline Hospital). This would be consistent with what ex-managers have stated that Prince would have them try to do. I believe that Prince did not want to be tied to anything that could link him to using any form of drugs, ililcit or not.

In Moline, he (Kirk)repeatedly asked him where did he get the other drugs ( opiates) and when Prince responds that it was in his bag, it appears Kirk did not know Prince was in possession of said substances besides the percocet. What Kirk inadvertently admitted to the doctors in Moline is knowledge about the percocet since there was a script in his name .He (kirk ) did lie to the detective about getting a script for Prince. He had also apologized to Dr. Schulenberg for requesting that he write a script for the (15) percocet pills. Dr.Schulenberg knew it was for Prince but elected to put it in Kirk's name.

I would assume the if Kirk was giving Prince these drugs, Prince would have at least stated something to the effect of " you gave them to me /got them for me" when Kirk was drilling him for information. .

Let's also remember how defiant and adamant Prince was when he was speaking to Judith Hill about what they had put into his body. He went into a spiritual diatribe to excuse the fact that he needed to know what they were putting in his body.

I think Prince procured these drugs thru a local source unknown to any associate. This was a shit load of narcotics for one person and one would need a very reliable and confidential source to procure such amounts. This is a very very clever person.

[Edited 2/18/19 17:18pm]

Reply #251 posted 02/18/19 5:41pm

Menes

Menes said:

nelcp777 said:

PennyPurple said: And sad.

I'm gonna swing the pendulum the other way.

I think Prince used Kirk as a legitimate cover ( having Dr.Schulenberg write a script for Percocet) in the event anything was stated about opiate use ( see Kirks questioning of Prince at Moline Hospital). This would be consistent with what ex-managers have stated that Prince would have them try to do. I believe that Prince did not want to be tied to anything that could link him to using any form of drugs, ililcit or not.

In Moline, he (Kirk)repeatedly asked him where did he get the other drugs ( opiates) and when Prince responds that it was in his bag, it appears Kirk did not know Prince was in possession of said substances besides the percocet. What Kirk inadvertently admitted to the doctors in Moline is knowledge about the percocet since there was a script in his name .He (kirk ) did lie to the detective about getting a script for Prince. He had also apologized to Dr. Schulenberg for requesting that he write a script for the (15) percocet pills. Dr.Schulenberg knew it was for Prince but elected to put it in Kirk's name.

I would assume the if Kirk was giving Prince these drugs, Prince would have at least stated something to the effect of " you gave them to me /got them for me" when Kirk was drilling him for information. .

Let's also remember how defiant and adamant Prince was when he was speaking to Judith Hill about what they had put into his body. He went into a spiritual diatribe to excuse the fact that he needed to know what they were putting in his body.

I think Prince procured these drugs thru a local source unknown to any associate. This was a shit load of narcotics for one person and one would need a very reliable and confidential source to procure such amounts. This is a very very clever person.

[Edited 2/18/19 17:18pm]

In addition , let's remember that the percocet bottle /pills disappeared into the ether at Moline or at PP . Kirk mentions "percocets" but not one detective followed up on how many were still left , or where the bottle was. My guess is that Kirk dispatched of that evidence if fairly quick order.

Was it percocet( oxycodone) that was found in Prince's system when Dr. Schulenberg did his analysis after Moline? I believe the percocets ( in combination with something else was what he took in Moline).

[Edited 2/18/19 17:49pm]

Reply #252 posted 02/18/19 5:46pm

PennyPurple

Menes said:

Menes said:

I'm gonna swing the pendulum the other way.

I think Prince used Kirk as a legitimate cover ( having Dr.Schulenberg write a script for Percocet) in the event anything was stated about opiate use ( see Kirks questioning of Prince at Moline Hospital). This would be consistent with what ex-managers have stated that Prince would have them try to do. I believe that Prince did not want to be tied to anything that could link him to using any form of drugs, ililcit or not.

In Moline, he (Kirk)repeatedly asked him where did he get the other drugs ( opiates) and when Prince responds that it was in his bag, it appears Kirk did not know Prince was in possession of said substances besides the percocet. What Kirk inadvertently admitted to the doctors in Moline is knowledge about the percocet since there was a script in his name .He (kirk ) did lie to the detective about getting a script for Prince. He had also apologized to Dr. Schulenberg for requesting that he write a script for the (15) percocet pills. Dr.Schulenberg knew it was for Prince but elected to put it in Kirk's name.

I would assume the if Kirk was giving Prince these drugs, Prince would have at least stated something to the effect of " you gave them to me /got them for me" when Kirk was drilling him for information. .

Let's also remember how defiant and adamant Prince was when he was speaking to Judith Hill about what they had put into his body. He went into a spiritual diatribe to excuse the fact that he needed to know what they were putting in his body.

I think Prince procured these drugs thru a local source unknown to any associate. This was a shit load of narcotics for one person and one would need a very reliable and confidential source to procure such amounts. This is a very very clever person.

[Edited 2/18/19 17:18pm]

In addition , let's remember that the percocet bottle /pills disappeared into the ether at Moline or at PP . Kirk mentions "percocets" but not one detective followed up on how many were still left , or where the bottle was. My guess is that Kirk dispatched of that evidence if fairly quick order.

Was it percocet( oxycodone) that was found in Prince's system when Dr. Schulenberg did his analysis after Moline? I believe the percocets ( in combination with something else was what he took in Moline).

I'll have to go back and check. I think that the UA showed Dr. S that there were opiates in his urine, the blood test had not come back at that time, and Dr. S never got the blood results because the Coroners office, had them sent over there instead of to Dr. S.

Reply #253 posted 02/18/19 6:02pm

Menes

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

In addition , let's remember that the percocet bottle /pills disappeared into the ether at Moline or at PP . Kirk mentions "percocets" but not one detective followed up on how many were still left , or where the bottle was. My guess is that Kirk dispatched of that evidence if fairly quick order.

Was it percocet( oxycodone) that was found in Prince's system when Dr. Schulenberg did his analysis after Moline? I believe the percocets ( in combination with something else was what he took in Moline).

I'll have to go back and check. I think that the UA showed Dr. S that there were opiates in his urine, the blood test had not come back at that time, and Dr. S never got the blood results because the Coroners office, had them sent over there instead of to Dr. S.

The analysis Dr. Schulenberg gave Prince came back positive on 4-25-16 for Hydrocodone253ng/ml and Hydromorphone 87ng/ml.

Reply #254 posted 02/18/19 6:28pm

Menes

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

I'll have to go back and check. I think that the UA showed Dr. S that there were opiates in his urine, the blood test had not come back at that time, and Dr. S never got the blood results because the Coroners office, had them sent over there instead of to Dr. S.

The analysis Dr. Schulenberg gave Prince came back positive on 4-25-16 for Hydrocodone253ng/ml and Hydromorphone 87ng/ml.

Someone on this forum mentioned and understood what mixed drug intoxication meant, and what the numbers I just wrote mean. cool


Place into a conversion table somewhere on our friend google , then find out the recommended dosage for each. Are they high? Low? Normal? Near fatal?One should do this before getting on to the fentanyl amount? How about if you mixed the two drugs that resulted in such numbers? What would that change?

Is this before/ after the Moline show friends. Just saying.

Reply #255 posted 02/18/19 7:31pm

Mumio

Menes said:


.....snipped.....

I think Prince procured these drugs thru a local source unknown to any associate. This was a shit load of narcotics for one person and one would need a very reliable and confidential source to procure such amounts. This is a very very clever person.

[Edited 2/18/19 17:18pm]



I've noticed that a lot of people think this but only when it's convenient to do so. They'd rather think he didn't know his way around a computer or the internet lol lol

Welcome to "the org", Mumio…they can have you, but I'll have your love in the end nod
Reply #256 posted 02/19/19 2:15pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

Menes said:

Menes said:

I'm gonna swing the pendulum the other way.

I think Prince used Kirk as a legitimate cover ( having Dr.Schulenberg write a script for Percocet) in the event anything was stated about opiate use ( see Kirks questioning of Prince at Moline Hospital). This would be consistent with what ex-managers have stated that Prince would have them try to do. I believe that Prince did not want to be tied to anything that could link him to using any form of drugs, ililcit or not.

In Moline, he (Kirk)repeatedly asked him where did he get the other drugs ( opiates) and when Prince responds that it was in his bag, it appears Kirk did not know Prince was in possession of said substances besides the percocet. What Kirk inadvertently admitted to the doctors in Moline is knowledge about the percocet since there was a script in his name .He (kirk ) did lie to the detective about getting a script for Prince. He had also apologized to Dr. Schulenberg for requesting that he write a script for the (15) percocet pills. Dr.Schulenberg knew it was for Prince but elected to put it in Kirk's name.

I would assume the if Kirk was giving Prince these drugs, Prince would have at least stated something to the effect of " you gave them to me /got them for me" when Kirk was drilling him for information. .

Let's also remember how defiant and adamant Prince was when he was speaking to Judith Hill about what they had put into his body. He went into a spiritual diatribe to excuse the fact that he needed to know what they were putting in his body.

I think Prince procured these drugs thru a local source unknown to any associate. This was a shit load of narcotics for one person and one would need a very reliable and confidential source to procure such amounts. This is a very very clever person.

In addition , let's remember that the percocet bottle /pills disappeared into the ether at Moline or at PP . Kirk mentions "percocets" but not one detective followed up on how many were still left , or where the bottle was. My guess is that Kirk dispatched of that evidence if fairly quick order.

Was it percocet( oxycodone) that was found in Prince's system when Dr. Schulenberg did his analysis after Moline? I believe the percocets ( in combination with something else was what he took in Moline).

[Edited 2/18/19 17:49pm]



The police did in fact find the script in Kirk's name with 10 pills.

The test results came back as (oxy) percocets.

The police also found one oxy in P's black bag.

If you remember Dr. S prescribed 15 (oxy) perc's on the date of the Atlanta concert so 4 were missing.

Reply #257 posted 02/19/19 2:19pm

leec1

Mumio said:

Menes said:


.....snipped.....

I think Prince procured these drugs thru a local source unknown to any associate. This was a shit load of narcotics for one person and one would need a very reliable and confidential source to procure such amounts. This is a very very clever person.

[Edited 2/18/19 17:18pm]



I've noticed that a lot of people think this but only when it's convenient to do so. They'd rather think he didn't know his way around a computer or the internet lol lol

I don't doubt that P. was clever. I also agree he was able to operate a computer.

However, I also think that he bought drugs in cash and this was on purpose so there would be no paper trail.

Reply #258 posted 02/19/19 3:55pm

Bodhitheblackdog

leec1 said:

Mumio said:



I've noticed that a lot of people think this but only when it's convenient to do so. They'd rather think he didn't know his way around a computer or the internet lol lol

I don't doubt that P. was clever. I also agree he was able to operate a computer.

However, I also think that he bought drugs in cash and this was on purpose so there would be no paper trail.

not a put-down, just confused: I thought everyone paid cash (or traded sex or a mutually agreed upon something of value) for drugs. Do some people really write checks or use a credit card?

Reply #259 posted 02/19/19 4:11pm

PennyPurple

Reply #260 posted 02/19/19 4:15pm

PennyPurple

^^ Wow go to the link and see the whole book. eek Looks like the comic guy has seen the pics.

Reply #261 posted 02/19/19 4:17pm

leec1

Bodhitheblackdog said:

 



leec1 said:


 



Mumio said:


 




I've noticed that a lot of people think this but only when it's convenient to do so. They'd rather think he didn't know his way around a computer or the internet lol lol


 


 



 


I don't doubt that P. was clever.  I also agree he was able to operate a computer. 


 


However, I also think that he bought drugs in cash and this was on purpose so there would be no paper trail.



not a put-down, just confused: I thought everyone paid cash (or traded sex or a mutually agreed upon something of value) for drugs. Do some people really write checks or use a credit card?


Drugs bought on the dark web aren't bought with cash
Reply #262 posted 02/19/19 4:17pm

XxAxX

PennyPurple said:

Good to have you back Menes!



second that motion wave hi Menes

Reply #263 posted 02/19/19 4:20pm

PennyPurple

1550602170104-prince16

Reply #264 posted 02/19/19 4:23pm

Menes

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Menes said:

In addition , let's remember that the percocet bottle /pills disappeared into the ether at Moline or at PP . Kirk mentions "percocets" but not one detective followed up on how many were still left , or where the bottle was. My guess is that Kirk dispatched of that evidence if fairly quick order.

Was it percocet( oxycodone) that was found in Prince's system when Dr. Schulenberg did his analysis after Moline? I believe the percocets ( in combination with something else was what he took in Moline).

[Edited 2/18/19 17:49pm]



The police did in fact find the script in Kirk's name with 10 pills.

The test results came back as (oxy) percocets.

The police also found one oxy in P's black bag.

If you remember Dr. S prescribed 15 (oxy) perc's on the date of the Atlanta concert so 4 were missing.

The test results showed two things that came back on 4-25 -16 with their respective numbers in ng/ml. Which report are you reading? I'm reading it right now. This was discussed quite a bit ago in earlier threads as well.

I did pose the question as to what the quantative amounts of each drug excreted would mean but no one answered.

Reply #265 posted 02/19/19 4:28pm

Menes

leec1 said:

Mumio said:



I've noticed that a lot of people think this but only when it's convenient to do so. They'd rather think he didn't know his way around a computer or the internet lol lol

I don't doubt that P. was clever. I also agree he was able to operate a computer.

However, I also think that he bought drugs in cash and this was on purpose so there would be no paper trail.

I agree with this. This is a cash transaction in my opinion. Deleted files on computers aren't really deleted in the raw sense of the word. I thought there was a scrub done on his mac? From what I remember, they looked at all queries from as far back as '15 to about the last week prior to his death?

Reply #266 posted 02/19/19 4:30pm

Menes

XxAxX said:

PennyPurple said:

Good to have you back Menes!



second that motion wave hi Menes

hi, Xx!

Reply #267 posted 02/19/19 4:37pm

Mumio

PennyPurple said:

^^ Wow go to the link and see the whole book. eek Looks like the comic guy has seen the pics.



I checked it out....and was impressed by what he's done and said here. Thanks Penny smile

Welcome to "the org", Mumio…they can have you, but I'll have your love in the end nod
Reply #268 posted 02/19/19 4:38pm

Mumio

leec1 said:

Drugs bought on the dark web aren't bought with cash



yeahthat

Welcome to "the org", Mumio…they can have you, but I'll have your love in the end nod
Reply #269 posted 02/19/19 4:52pm

PennyPurple

Mumio said:

PennyPurple said:

^^ Wow go to the link and see the whole book. eek Looks like the comic guy has seen the pics.



I checked it out....and was impressed by what he's done and said here. Thanks Penny smile

I get the drift but still thought it kinda strange and really sad in a way.

Reply #270 posted 02/19/19 5:22pm

Mumio

PennyPurple said:

Mumio said:



I checked it out....and was impressed by what he's done and said here. Thanks Penny smile

I get the drift but still thought it kinda strange and really sad in a way.



nod

Welcome to "the org", Mumio…they can have you, but I'll have your love in the end nod
Reply #271 posted 02/19/19 5:58pm

Dimitri10

PennyPurple said:

Dimitri10 said:

I reakon he has revealed to authorities what went down to clear his name

No he hasn't. He only gave them that initial interview. He lawyered up and hasn't spoke with them since. Meron either. They tried to make contact with Phaedra too, and it was a no go.

Yeah thats what "we know"

"Prince don't know how many hits he got"
Reply #272 posted 02/19/19 6:17pm

PennyPurple

Dimitri10 said:

PennyPurple said:

No he hasn't. He only gave them that initial interview. He lawyered up and hasn't spoke with them since. Meron either. They tried to make contact with Phaedra too, and it was a no go.

Yeah thats what "we know"

We sure do, from Metz, himself..

Reply #273 posted 02/19/19 6:26pm

Dimitri10

PennyPurple said:

Dimitri10 said:

Yeah thats what "we know"

We sure do, from Metz, himself..

And you believe that?

"Prince don't know how many hits he got"
Reply #274 posted 02/19/19 6:42pm

PennyPurple

Dimitri10 said:

PennyPurple said:

We sure do, from Metz, himself..

And you believe that?

Yes I do. KJ, Phaedra, Meron. MIA

Reply #275 posted 02/19/19 6:48pm

nelcp777

So then, if the CVS bottles were older than Atlanta, then that implies to me that Prince had been using fentanyl for a longer period than thought. Perhaps the reason there was not any fentanyl in the blood test on the 20th was because Prince went back to dialud and took the last of it since it was not found in the initial CC search?

Residents of Chanhassen had begun talking of suicide right after P passed. I would imagine a local source would have been revealed, but I could be wrong. The dark web makes a great, intriguing source, but the financial records were looked at. They were not released per the withheld list of documents. At some point, wouldn't an account be needed for Bitcoin?

I mean shit, Patrick Cousins took money from Prince and the SA caught onto it, not Prince.

I see why Kirk lawyered up along with Phaedra. Kirk has a vault too, and KAJ productions is getting paid. Phaedra got her cut, but not her waiver.

The bag that contained the CVS bottles, I wonder when was the last time Prince used that bag for travel. Hell, if he went to Atlanta for 1 night, why would he need so many bottles?

The DEA never releases the shipping info to the Country Inn. Prince did spend a lot of time in LA, perhaps that was his source?

Maybe around 2014 - 2015 he went from dialud and vicodin to fentanyl? Perhaps that explains the rapid change in appearance? Thoughts anyone?

Reply #276 posted 02/19/19 7:20pm

Menes

nelcp777 said:

So then, if the CVS bottles were older than Atlanta, then that implies to me that Prince had been using fentanyl for a longer period than thought. Perhaps the reason there was not any fentanyl in the blood test on the 20th was because Prince went back to dialud and took the last of it since it was not found in the initial CC search?

Residents of Chanhassen had begun talking of suicide right after P passed. I would imagine a local source would have been revealed, but I could be wrong. The dark web makes a great, intriguing source, but the financial records were looked at. They were not released per the withheld list of documents. At some point, wouldn't an account be needed for Bitcoin?

I mean shit, Patrick Cousins took money from Prince and the SA caught onto it, not Prince.

I see why Kirk lawyered up along with Phaedra. Kirk has a vault too, and KAJ productions is getting paid. Phaedra got her cut, but not her waiver.

The bag that contained the CVS bottles, I wonder when was the last time Prince used that bag for travel. Hell, if he went to Atlanta for 1 night, why would he need so many bottles?

The DEA never releases the shipping info to the Country Inn. Prince did spend a lot of time in LA, perhaps that was his source?

Maybe around 2014 - 2015 he went from dialud and vicodin to fentanyl? Perhaps that explains the rapid change in appearance? Thoughts anyone?

1. I believe Prince was dosing accordingly. That is not to say that he was using fentanyl for longer or shorter periods than suggested , only that he used it according to mood and trigger.

2. Fentanyl was not found in the test on the 20th, but the amount of hydrocodone and hydromorphone is something to further discuss. A trade off of sorts. What this really tells me is that he never stopped doing anything after Moline .

3. A local source can be just as clandestine as a lab in China. With such large amounts found, and more pointedly, a consistent chemical composition of each drug analyzed, this was not a random event that materialized overnight. It seems rather planned out to me.

4. Dark web still has its trails. Too many hoops for Prince, who by all accounts, would rather have things done for him once he decides on what he wants.

5. If my name was Kirk, I would have done exactly the same thing in retaining the services of counsel. LE is notorious for using anything you say against you . Smart move.

6. The bag ( as in the black bag) was not filled with pills, I don't think. It was the suitcase(s) that had the majority of pills ( specifically the fentanyl mixed with lidocaine). I think the bag had one remaining loose yellow pill in it. We should confirm that.

7. As for sourcing, it could be L.A., or, it could have been the town over . It's the $64,000 dollar question.

8. As for apperance, I think one should expect to see drastic changes in weight, apperance, mood swings, etc. as the addiction progresses.

* If you figure out the fatal baseline for hydrocodone and hydromorphone,( as in how much would be considered fatal in ng/ml , that might give us some insight into the very night prior to his death. According to the report, those were the two drugs that were found in his sytem when the he took the test on the 20th. Results were published on the 25th.

The report states the following :

"In observing the lab orders from Prince's visit with Dr. Schulenberg on 4-20-16( the night prior to his death), the test results showed Prince tested positive for opiates, both Hydrocodone (253 ng/ml) and hydromoprhone (87ng/ml). Detective Nelson contacted North Memorial to inquire about the blood sample taken from Prince on 4-20-16".

[Edited 2/19/19 19:22pm]

Reply #277 posted 02/19/19 7:32pm

rednblue

Menes said:

nelcp777 said:

So then, if the CVS bottles were older than Atlanta, then that implies to me that Prince had been using fentanyl for a longer period than thought. Perhaps the reason there was not any fentanyl in the blood test on the 20th was because Prince went back to dialud and took the last of it since it was not found in the initial CC search?

Residents of Chanhassen had begun talking of suicide right after P passed. I would imagine a local source would have been revealed, but I could be wrong. The dark web makes a great, intriguing source, but the financial records were looked at. They were not released per the withheld list of documents. At some point, wouldn't an account be needed for Bitcoin?

I mean shit, Patrick Cousins took money from Prince and the SA caught onto it, not Prince.

I see why Kirk lawyered up along with Phaedra. Kirk has a vault too, and KAJ productions is getting paid. Phaedra got her cut, but not her waiver.

The bag that contained the CVS bottles, I wonder when was the last time Prince used that bag for travel. Hell, if he went to Atlanta for 1 night, why would he need so many bottles?

The DEA never releases the shipping info to the Country Inn. Prince did spend a lot of time in LA, perhaps that was his source?

Maybe around 2014 - 2015 he went from dialud and vicodin to fentanyl? Perhaps that explains the rapid change in appearance? Thoughts anyone?

1. I believe Prince was dosing accordingly. That is not to say that he was using fentanyl for longer or shorter periods than suggested , only that he used it according to mood and trigger.

2. Fentanyl was not found in the test on the 20th, but the amount of hydrocodone and hydromorphone is something to further discuss. A trade off of sorts. What this really tells me is that he never stopped doing anything after Moline .

3. A local source can be just as clandestine as a lab in China. With such large amounts found, and more pointedly, a consistent chemical composition of each drug analyzed, this was not a random event that materialized overnight. It seems rather planned out to me.

4. Dark web still has its trails. Too many hoops for Prince, who by all accounts, would rather have things done for him once he decides on what he wants.

5. If my name was Kirk, I would have done exactly the same thing in retaining the services of counsel. LE is notorious for using anything you say against you . Smart move.

6. The bag ( as in the black bag) was not filled with pills, I don't think. It was the suitcase(s) that had the majority of pills ( specifically the fentanyl mixed with lidocaine). I think the bag had one remaining loose yellow pill in it. We should confirm that.

7. As for sourcing, it could be L.A., or, it could have been the town over . It's the $64,000 dollar question.

8. As for apperance, I think one should expect to see drastic changes in weight, apperance, mood swings, etc. as the addiction progresses.

* If you figure out the fatal baseline for hydrocodone and hydromorphone,( as in how much would be considered fatal in ng/ml , that might give us some insight into the very night prior to his death. According to the report, those were the two drugs that were found in his sytem when the he took the test on the 20th. Results were published on the 25th.

The report states the following :

"In observing the lab orders from Prince's visit with Dr. Schulenberg on 4-20-16( the night prior to his death), the test results showed Prince tested positive for opiates, both Hydrocodone (253 ng/ml) and hydromoprhone (87ng/ml). Detective Nelson contacted North Memorial to inquire about the blood sample taken from Prince on 4-20-16".

[Edited 2/19/19 19:22pm]


Thank you!

Reply #278 posted 02/19/19 7:32pm

Bodhitheblackdog

PennyPurple said:

^^ Wow go to the link and see the whole book. eek Looks like the comic guy has seen the pics.

OMG, I was just about to post this, Penny...blew my mind....so on point... neutral

Reply #279 posted 02/19/19 7:35pm

PennyPurple

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

^^ Wow go to the link and see the whole book. eek Looks like the comic guy has seen the pics.

OMG, I was just about to post this, Penny...blew my mind....so on point... neutral

Yeah kinda sums up how we all feel and felt. Sad. Even to this day we aren't the only ones dealing with it, like we think. He touched a lot of people for sure!

Reply #280 posted 02/19/19 7:37pm

rednblue

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

^^ Wow go to the link and see the whole book. eek Looks like the comic guy has seen the pics.

OMG, I was just about to post this, Penny...blew my mind....so on point... neutral


Meant a lot to see that. Thank you for posting the link!

Reply #281 posted 02/19/19 7:39pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

Menes said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



The police did in fact find the script in Kirk's name with 10 pills.

The test results came back as (oxy) percocets.

The police also found one oxy in P's black bag.

If you remember Dr. S prescribed 15 (oxy) perc's on the date of the Atlanta concert so 4 were missing.

The test results showed two things that came back on 4-25 -16 with their respective numbers in ng/ml. Which report are you reading? I'm reading it right now. This was discussed quite a bit ago in earlier threads as well.

I did pose the question as to what the quantative amounts of each drug excreted would mean but no one answered.



You can find the information on the script that tested positive for oxy in the Carver County Investigative File #5, Report #2, page 66, #172.

Reply #282 posted 02/19/19 7:51pm

Menes

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Menes said:

The test results showed two things that came back on 4-25 -16 with their respective numbers in ng/ml. Which report are you reading? I'm reading it right now. This was discussed quite a bit ago in earlier threads as well.

I did pose the question as to what the quantative amounts of each drug excreted would mean but no one answered.



You can find the information on the script that tested positive for oxy in the Carver County Investigative File #5, Report #2, page 66, #172.

Did you see the report on the ng/ml amounts for the test from North Memorial from Dr.Sculenberg's notes by Detective Nelson? Are we saying the same thing??

Reply #283 posted 02/19/19 8:00pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

Menes said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



You can find the information on the script that tested positive for oxy in the Carver County Investigative File #5, Report #2, page 66, #172.

Did you see the report on the ng/ml amounts for the test from North Memorial from Dr.Sculenberg's notes by Detective Nelson? Are we saying the same thing??



Earlier you stated the 15 perc's prescribed by Dr. S disappeared when in fact the script

written for Kirk was found at PP and tested for oxy (perc's).

I would have to go back and look for the test from North Memorial.

I do know the Coroner stated a cancer patient with a fentanyl patch would test 3-4 mcg/l and Prince tested 67.8 mcg/l

Reply #284 posted 02/19/19 8:09pm

Menes

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Menes said:

Did you see the report on the ng/ml amounts for the test from North Memorial from Dr.Sculenberg's notes by Detective Nelson? Are we saying the same thing??



Earlier you stated the 15 perc's prescribed by Dr. S disappeared when in fact the script

written for Kirk was found at PP and tested for oxy (perc's).

I would have to go back and look for the test from North Memorial.

I do know the Coroner stated a cancer patient with a fentanyl patch would test 3-4 mcg/l and Prince tested 67.8 mcg/l

I didn't see that is was found at PP . I did see where Dr. Schulenberg told the detectives that he had written a script for Prince in Kirks name and that is how they found out initially that Kirk was lying.

Did they find the bottle after or before the interview? Don't recall the detective questioning Kirk about the bottle tha was found with his name on that specific script . Did they do that?

You didn't read the North Memorial results? Earlier, you said it was just Percocet. What test was that from? What day? When were the results?

As for the fentanyl ...yes, I believe that is what the coroner stated, but we are not talking about fentanyl. This is the test that did not show any fentanyl and would have been administered the previous day. It's in the notes from Detective Nelson who was reading Dr. Schulenberg's notes from his test on 4-20.

[Edited 2/19/19 20:15pm]

Reply #285 posted 02/19/19 8:11pm

Bodhitheblackdog

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

Menes said:

Did you see the report on the ng/ml amounts for the test from North Memorial from Dr.Sculenberg's notes by Detective Nelson? Are we saying the same thing??



Earlier you stated the 15 perc's prescribed by Dr. S disappeared when in fact the script

written for Kirk was found at PP and tested for oxy (perc's).

I would have to go back and look for the test from North Memorial.

I do know the Coroner stated a cancer patient with a fentanyl patch would test 3-4 mcg/l and Prince tested 67.8 mcg/l

every time I look at these numbers only one conclusion comes to mind.

Reply #286 posted 02/19/19 8:11pm

rednblue

rednblue said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

OMG, I was just about to post this, Penny...blew my mind....so on point... neutral


Meant a lot to see that. Thank you for posting the link!


The multipart comic also gets at concerns I've long had with fans judging family and friends. That is, family and friends of a person who is unable (or who has decided that it is no longer for the best) to preserve his sobriety and/or life.

The artist lost his dad and his brother.

Prince was sick with something "all too familiar."

sad

Reply #287 posted 02/19/19 8:32pm

Menes

Bodhitheblackdog said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



Earlier you stated the 15 perc's prescribed by Dr. S disappeared when in fact the script

written for Kirk was found at PP and tested for oxy (perc's).

I would have to go back and look for the test from North Memorial.

I do know the Coroner stated a cancer patient with a fentanyl patch would test 3-4 mcg/l and Prince tested 67.8 mcg/l

every time I look at these numbers only one conclusion comes to mind.

At the very least, he must have had some idea of what he was doing regarding dosing. Shocking he didn't reach for those deadly pills during that 7 day period after Moline.

Reply #288 posted 02/19/19 8:39pm

Menes

Ok, I hope I'm reading this wrong and have miscalculated.

This is from Wallage HR, Palmentier JP. Hydromorphone related fatalities . J anal toxicology 2006;30(3) 202-209. Compare this to what was reported found in Prince's system. Is it a bit much or nothing at all?

If the report and the numbers by Detective Nelson are correct ( in ng/ml) then Prince was a walking dead before he took the fentanyl. I made sure it was in ng/ml and did the conversion but this can't be real. I need to review this thing, seriously.

Hydromorphone-related fatalities in ontario. - NCBIhttps://www.ncbi.nlm....d/16803655

[Edited 2/19/19 20:44pm]

(Hydromorphone concentrations above 75 ng/ml are considered lethal.10)

[Edited 2/19/19 20:46pm]

Reply #289 posted 02/20/19 3:02am

funksterr

Bodhitheblackdog said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



Earlier you stated the 15 perc's prescribed by Dr. S disappeared when in fact the script

written for Kirk was found at PP and tested for oxy (perc's).

I would have to go back and look for the test from North Memorial.

I do know the Coroner stated a cancer patient with a fentanyl patch would test 3-4 mcg/l and Prince tested 67.8 mcg/l

every time I look at these numbers only one conclusion comes to mind.

Yes and no.... He wouldn't just commit you know. There are rules to his thinking. He thinks of himself as a massive f-up and kind of not really being worth a blank (I know, strange but true), but the one thing he feels gives him value is keeping his word. He promised he'd stay alive three more years in 2014, "but that's it", so it seems like he owed more time on that commitment. So a log on the accidental death fire.

Also... there was no will. It was an important topic for him. He had strong beliefs about what should happen, however.. if he was going to hurt himself then that understanding was off the table and he would have had no way of executing it. That's his thinking when he reached out to that guy on the idotbox and Tidal. And really a bunch of other people too: who can inherit his fortune and legacy? Who can manage his business in his absence? Thing is though... he's big on testing the worthiness of people. He'll ask you to do wrong things for him, and on one hand appreciate you for it, but on the other you are marked in his mind as untrustable and not really having his best interests at heart. Sometimes he'd drop people cold right there on the spot for failing his worthness test. Again he knew what he wanted to occur, but the person he trusted said no, knowing it would keep Prince alive longer searching for another solution. Or to put it another way: the topic was so important to Prince, that there is just no way he'd do anything on purpose before resolving it. The topic was an imprtant tool to keeping him here. Another log on the accidental death fire.

With that said if he really did donate 10's of millions, then that would be consistent with him attempting to resolve the block on the will situation, in the only way available to him, in an attempt to pass away entering heaven without unresolved debts here on Earth (another important topic and part of the reasoning behind reaching out to 'old friends', bio, PR2, etc). But that money, was not actually his (according to him) and he was holding out on it for a friend, who wouldn't accept it if Prince was going to hurt himself. (strange but true, I know). This holding out situation over these 10's of millions had been going on for roughly a decade I think. If that really did occur, it's a log on the 'suez-sumn' fire because that action would have cleared a major hurdle in his mind. It's also why he probably is stuck between here and the here-after, but that's another topic for another time but the short of it: he cheated the rules by not paying anything to the person he owed. Until it's resolved he probably exists in spirit form in that box they built for him in Paisley. Trapped in a personal, um, hello he might have intended to escape.

What he did not want to do is leave his relations (outside of Tyka) a single penny. He was knowledgeable enough to ensure that would not happen. The fact there was a path for family at all to inherit so much as a single penny is another log on the 'accidental death' fire. He didn't want that. However he was advised not to go out like a certain superstar, who was a descendant of slavery but left more to the system and nothing for his siblings. Maybe Prince decided he could accept family would receive money, but it's not like him to do anything he feels strongly against... another log on the "accidental death" fire.

Regarding his family and employees, He said these words exactly "they don't love me. I don't trust them". I believe that's his motivation for not entering legit rehab sooner. He was afraid and didn't want to go through it without the proper support. To the extent they learned anything about his situation in those final years, it was likely because he wanted to establish a legitimate rapport with them about his circumstances and maybe enter life-saving rehab. So... a log on the 'natural causes' fire.

He also told me at that time (2013), about albums: "I'll produce one on you and you produce one on me. After that I'm going to kill myself". Point blank. My response was not pretty, but the way he is, is that he feels loved when you cuss and fuss over his refusal to properly care for himself. All that happened instead (3EG,AOA, etc) is largely a troll job, on his part, of my rejection of his offer, but it worked emough to keep him alive, which was my only goal, so I'm proud to have made a difference. How many other people just rolled with to be down with him though? He's telling me so he's telling them too. In some cases they are the go between, because I had taken to not talking to him directly too often anymore because he was not consistently honest about his darker intentions, imo, and the resulting stress and worry was affecting my personal life.

What bothers me about Jolene, and I could be misremembering the one report I read about the situation, but I don't recall anyone telling him they loved him at the hospital. It means everything to him to hear that, and in the past when it seems like we are losing him to whatever was troubling him, "I love you" lifted the clouds and gave him the strength to battle back from whatever he'd gotten himself into. He could really kick up a fuss about passing away prematurely, but in the end he's just too proud to admit he wants to hear that you love him. All that he said in the hospital room in just consistent with the type of conversational redirecting he does when.. in the end he just wants you to panic for his life and tell him you love him. He won't break right away. He'll tease it out a bit to make you think something else worked out instead of those three words, but that is what he's gunning for: someone who matters, to value him enough to say "I love you".

One more thing, I saw in this thread someone said he didn't care about being caught with pills at Paisley. No he did. I forget how I knew about his pills in tissue boxes, but I brought it up in 2013/2014. I mentioned that I was 'too much of a fan' to work at Paisley and that i would, I dunno, collect his tissues as momentos if I worked there. That was shade/subtweet/code etc. directed at his HABITS and where I was fairly certain he was stashing them, based on something he'd said the week previous. I was trying to get him to leave me alone about some other stuff (no one really needs to know taht but he can be really annoying), and it worked. He was spooked by the fact that I knew his pill location and decided to get his house in order.

Oh and one more thing... I am Prince. I told ya the truth is bizarre and you won't believe it. biggrin

I'll post about that another time, because it's at the heart of why he did what he did and what happened. I didn't know for certain when he first passed away. And I didn't feel comfortable that someone hadn't murdered him, so I wanted the police investigation to play out. But the information as it was coming out from the beginning tells me I know the truth in a way that not too many others can speak too.

Reply #290 posted 02/20/19 4:59am

nelcp777

Menes said:

 



Bodhitheblackdog said:


 



ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:


 




Earlier you stated the 15 perc's prescribed by Dr. S disappeared when in fact the script


written for Kirk was found at PP and tested for oxy (perc's).


 


I would have to go back and look for the test from North Memorial.

I do know the Coroner stated a cancer patient with a fentanyl patch would test 3-4 mcg/l and Prince tested 67.8 mcg/l



every time I look at these numbers only one conclusion comes to mind.



At the very least,  he must have had some idea of what he was doing regarding dosing. Shocking he didn't reach for those deadly pills during that 7 day period after Moline. 


I think the dr visit on th 20thmay have changed any hope he had of beating this under the radar. Also, U4700 causes hallucinations which ,ay explain the clothing being on backwards.
Reply #291 posted 02/20/19 5:48am

rednblue

funksterr said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

every time I look at these numbers only one conclusion comes to mind.

Yes and no.... He wouldn't just commit you know. There are rules to his thinking. He thinks of himself as a massive f-up and kind of not really being worth a blank (I know, strange but true), but the one thing he feels gives him value is keeping his word. He promised he'd stay alive three more years in 2014, "but that's it", so it seems like he owed more time on that commitment. So a log on the accidental death fire.

Also... there was no will. It was an important topic for him. He had strong beliefs about what should happen, however.. if he was going to hurt himself then that understanding was off the table and he would have had no way of executing it. That's his thinking when he reached out to that guy on the idotbox and Tidal. And really a bunch of other people too: who can inherit his fortune and legacy? Who can manage his business in his absence? Thing is though... he's big on testing the worthiness of people. He'll ask you to do wrong things for him, and on one hand appreciate you for it, but on the other you are marked in his mind as untrustable and not really having his best interests at heart. Sometimes he'd drop people cold right there on the spot for failing his worthness test. Again he knew what he wanted to occur, but the person he trusted said no, knowing it would keep Prince alive longer searching for another solution. Or to put it another way: the topic was so important to Prince, that there is just no way he'd do anything on purpose before resolving it. The topic was an imprtant tool to keeping him here. Another log on the accidental death fire.

With that said if he really did donate 10's of millions, then that would be consistent with him attempting to resolve the block on the will situation, in the only way available to him, in an attempt to pass away entering heaven without unresolved debts here on Earth (another important topic and part of the reasoning behind reaching out to 'old friends', bio, PR2, etc). But that money, was not actually his (according to him) and he was holding out on it for a friend, who wouldn't accept it if Prince was going to hurt himself. (strange but true, I know). This holding out situation over these 10's of millions had been going on for roughly a decade I think. If that really did occur, it's a log on the 'suez-sumn' fire because that action would have cleared a major hurdle in his mind. It's also why he probably is stuck between here and the here-after, but that's another topic for another time but the short of it: he cheated the rules by not paying anything to the person he owed. Until it's resolved he probably exists in spirit form in that box they built for him in Paisley. Trapped in a personal, um, hello he might have intended to escape.

What he did not want to do is leave his relations (outside of Tyka) a single penny. He was knowledgeable enough to ensure that would not happen. The fact there was a path for family at all to inherit so much as a single penny is another log on the 'accidental death' fire. He didn't want that. However he was advised not to go out like a certain superstar, who was a descendant of slavery but left more to the system and nothing for his siblings. Maybe Prince decided he could accept family would receive money, but it's not like him to do anything he feels strongly against... another log on the "accidental death" fire.

Regarding his family and employees, He said these words exactly "they don't love me. I don't trust them". I believe that's his motivation for not entering legit rehab sooner. He was afraid and didn't want to go through it without the proper support. To the extent they learned anything about his situation in those final years, it was likely because he wanted to establish a legitimate rapport with them about his circumstances and maybe enter life-saving rehab. So... a log on the 'natural causes' fire.

He also told me at that time (2013), about albums: "I'll produce one on you and you produce one on me. After that I'm going to kill myself". Point blank. My response was not pretty, but the way he is, is that he feels loved when you cuss and fuss over his refusal to properly care for himself. All that happened instead (3EG,AOA, etc) is largely a troll job, on his part, of my rejection of his offer, but it worked emough to keep him alive, which was my only goal, so I'm proud to have made a difference. How many other people just rolled with to be down with him though? He's telling me so he's telling them too. In some cases they are the go between, because I had taken to not talking to him directly too often anymore because he was not consistently honest about his darker intentions, imo, and the resulting stress and worry was affecting my personal life.

What bothers me about Jolene, and I could be misremembering the one report I read about the situation, but I don't recall anyone telling him they loved him at the hospital. It means everything to him to hear that, and in the past when it seems like we are losing him to whatever was troubling him, "I love you" lifted the clouds and gave him the strength to battle back from whatever he'd gotten himself into. He could really kick up a fuss about passing away prematurely, but in the end he's just too proud to admit he wants to hear that you love him. All that he said in the hospital room in just consistent with the type of conversational redirecting he does when.. in the end he just wants you to panic for his life and tell him you love him. He won't break right away. He'll tease it out a bit to make you think something else worked out instead of those three words, but that is what he's gunning for: someone who matters, to value him enough to say "I love you".

One more thing, I saw in this thread someone said he didn't care about being caught with pills at Paisley. No he did. I forget how I knew about his pills in tissue boxes, but I brought it up in 2013/2014. I mentioned that I was 'too much of a fan' to work at Paisley and that i would, I dunno, collect his tissues as momentos if I worked there. That was shade/subtweet/code etc. directed at his HABITS and where I was fairly certain he was stashing them, based on something he'd said the week previous. I was trying to get him to leave me alone about some other stuff (no one really needs to know taht but he can be really annoying), and it worked. He was spooked by the fact that I knew his pill location and decided to get his house in order.

Oh and one more thing... I am Prince. I told ya the truth is bizarre and you won't believe it. biggrin

I'll post about that another time, because it's at the heart of why he did what he did and what happened. I didn't know for certain when he first passed away. And I didn't feel comfortable that someone hadn't murdered him, so I wanted the police investigation to play out. But the information as it was coming out from the beginning tells me I know the truth in a way that not too many others can speak too.


Thank you, funksterr.

Can be hell to try to help someone, or try do the right thing (which can mean trying to choose between painful, difficult options) in complex situations like your story. So sorry to hear it. As another orger said, your story hurts the heart.

We as fans don't know the detailed stories of individual relationships with Prince. Wish folks would lighten up on the blanket condemnations of friends/family members/loved ones. Every person isn't the same as every other person.

---

"He thinks of himself as a massive f-up and kind of not really being worth a blank..." sad

If you're up for answering a question...

Why?

Reply #292 posted 02/20/19 6:25am

XxAxX

^ that. wish he'd know how much his fans loved him.

Reply #293 posted 02/20/19 7:24am

1Sasha

Bodhitheblackdog said:

June7 said:

Discuss the controversies, insights, new information and respectful opinions about the death of Prince here. Don't troll or bring hateful discussion here. Be cool - or be gone. - June7

well, well, well...hope everyone is going to have a peaceful, loving, insightful, compassionate 2019...sure do miss that man...

I finally came back on here full-time and see this thread. Thank you for reinstating the discussion.

Reply #294 posted 02/20/19 8:13am

PennyPurple

Wow! Thank you funksterr, your posts helps out greatly. With this post it is starting to come to light.

funksterr said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

every time I look at these numbers only one conclusion comes to mind.

Yes and no.... He wouldn't just commit you know. There are rules to his thinking. He thinks of himself as a massive f-up and kind of not really being worth a blank (I know, strange but true), but the one thing he feels gives him value is keeping his word. He promised he'd stay alive three more years in 2014, "but that's it", so it seems like he owed more time on that commitment. So a log on the accidental death fire.

Also... there was no will. It was an important topic for him. He had strong beliefs about what should happen, however.. if he was going to hurt himself then that understanding was off the table and he would have had no way of executing it. That's his thinking when he reached out to that guy on the idotbox and Tidal. And really a bunch of other people too: who can inherit his fortune and legacy? Who can manage his business in his absence? Thing is though... he's big on testing the worthiness of people. He'll ask you to do wrong things for him, and on one hand appreciate you for it, but on the other you are marked in his mind as untrustable and not really having his best interests at heart. Sometimes he'd drop people cold right there on the spot for failing his worthness test. Again he knew what he wanted to occur, but the person he trusted said no, knowing it would keep Prince alive longer searching for another solution. Or to put it another way: the topic was so important to Prince, that there is just no way he'd do anything on purpose before resolving it. The topic was an imprtant tool to keeping him here. Another log on the accidental death fire.

With that said if he really did donate 10's of millions, then that would be consistent with him attempting to resolve the block on the will situation, in the only way available to him, in an attempt to pass away entering heaven without unresolved debts here on Earth (another important topic and part of the reasoning behind reaching out to 'old friends', bio, PR2, etc). But that money, was not actually his (according to him) and he was holding out on it for a friend, who wouldn't accept it if Prince was going to hurt himself. (strange but true, I know). This holding out situation over these 10's of millions had been going on for roughly a decade I think. If that really did occur, it's a log on the 'suez-sumn' fire because that action would have cleared a major hurdle in his mind. It's also why he probably is stuck between here and the here-after, but that's another topic for another time but the short of it: he cheated the rules by not paying anything to the person he owed. Until it's resolved he probably exists in spirit form in that box they built for him in Paisley. Trapped in a personal, um, hello he might have intended to escape.

What he did not want to do is leave his relations (outside of Tyka) a single penny. He was knowledgeable enough to ensure that would not happen. The fact there was a path for family at all to inherit so much as a single penny is another log on the 'accidental death' fire. He didn't want that. However he was advised not to go out like a certain superstar, who was a descendant of slavery but left more to the system and nothing for his siblings. Maybe Prince decided he could accept family would receive money, but it's not like him to do anything he feels strongly against... another log on the "accidental death" fire.

Regarding his family and employees, He said these words exactly "they don't love me. I don't trust them". I believe that's his motivation for not entering legit rehab sooner. He was afraid and didn't want to go through it without the proper support. To the extent they learned anything about his situation in those final years, it was likely because he wanted to establish a legitimate rapport with them about his circumstances and maybe enter life-saving rehab. So... a log on the 'natural causes' fire.

He also told me at that time (2013), about albums: "I'll produce one on you and you produce one on me. After that I'm going to kill myself". Point blank. My response was not pretty, but the way he is, is that he feels loved when you cuss and fuss over his refusal to properly care for himself. All that happened instead (3EG,AOA, etc) is largely a troll job, on his part, of my rejection of his offer, but it worked emough to keep him alive, which was my only goal, so I'm proud to have made a difference. How many other people just rolled with to be down with him though? He's telling me so he's telling them too. In some cases they are the go between, because I had taken to not talking to him directly too often anymore because he was not consistently honest about his darker intentions, imo, and the resulting stress and worry was affecting my personal life.

What bothers me about Jolene, and I could be misremembering the one report I read about the situation, but I don't recall anyone telling him they loved him at the hospital. It means everything to him to hear that, and in the past when it seems like we are losing him to whatever was troubling him, "I love you" lifted the clouds and gave him the strength to battle back from whatever he'd gotten himself into. He could really kick up a fuss about passing away prematurely, but in the end he's just too proud to admit he wants to hear that you love him. All that he said in the hospital room in just consistent with the type of conversational redirecting he does when.. in the end he just wants you to panic for his life and tell him you love him. He won't break right away. He'll tease it out a bit to make you think something else worked out instead of those three words, but that is what he's gunning for: someone who matters, to value him enough to say "I love you".

One more thing, I saw in this thread someone said he didn't care about being caught with pills at Paisley. No he did. I forget how I knew about his pills in tissue boxes, but I brought it up in 2013/2014. I mentioned that I was 'too much of a fan' to work at Paisley and that i would, I dunno, collect his tissues as momentos if I worked there. That was shade/subtweet/code etc. directed at his HABITS and where I was fairly certain he was stashing them, based on something he'd said the week previous. I was trying to get him to leave me alone about some other stuff (no one really needs to know taht but he can be really annoying), and it worked. He was spooked by the fact that I knew his pill location and decided to get his house in order.

Oh and one more thing... I am Prince. I told ya the truth is bizarre and you won't believe it. biggrin

I'll post about that another time, because it's at the heart of why he did what he did and what happened. I didn't know for certain when he first passed away. And I didn't feel comfortable that someone hadn't murdered him, so I wanted the police investigation to play out. But the information as it was coming out from the beginning tells me I know the truth in a way that not too many others can speak too.

Reply #295 posted 02/20/19 8:55am

Astasheiks

funksterr said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

every time I look at these numbers only one conclusion comes to mind.

Yes and no.... He wouldn't just commit you know. There are rules to his thinking. He thinks of himself as a massive f-up and kind of not really being worth a blank (I know, strange but true), but the one thing he feels gives him value is keeping his word. He promised he'd stay alive three more years in 2014, "but that's it", so it seems like he owed more time on that commitment. So a log on the accidental death fire.

Also... there was no will. It was an important topic for him. He had strong beliefs about what should happen, however.. if he was going to hurt himself then that understanding was off the table and he would have had no way of executing it. That's his thinking when he reached out to that guy on the idotbox and Tidal. And really a bunch of other people too: who can inherit his fortune and legacy? Who can manage his business in his absence? Thing is though... he's big on testing the worthiness of people. He'll ask you to do wrong things for him, and on one hand appreciate you for it, but on the other you are marked in his mind as untrustable and not really having his best interests at heart. Sometimes he'd drop people cold right there on the spot for failing his worthness test. Again he knew what he wanted to occur, but the person he trusted said no, knowing it would keep Prince alive longer searching for another solution. Or to put it another way: the topic was so important to Prince, that there is just no way he'd do anything on purpose before resolving it. The topic was an imprtant tool to keeping him here. Another log on the accidental death fire.

With that said if he really did donate 10's of millions, then that would be consistent with him attempting to resolve the block on the will situation, in the only way available to him, in an attempt to pass away entering heaven without unresolved debts here on Earth (another important topic and part of the reasoning behind reaching out to 'old friends', bio, PR2, etc). But that money, was not actually his (according to him) and he was holding out on it for a friend, who wouldn't accept it if Prince was going to hurt himself. (strange but true, I know). This holding out situation over these 10's of millions had been going on for roughly a decade I think. If that really did occur, it's a log on the 'suez-sumn' fire because that action would have cleared a major hurdle in his mind. It's also why he probably is stuck between here and the here-after, but that's another topic for another time but the short of it: he cheated the rules by not paying anything to the person he owed. Until it's resolved he probably exists in spirit form in that box they built for him in Paisley. Trapped in a personal, um, hello he might have intended to escape.

What he did not want to do is leave his relations (outside of Tyka) a single penny. He was knowledgeable enough to ensure that would not happen. The fact there was a path for family at all to inherit so much as a single penny is another log on the 'accidental death' fire. He didn't want that. However he was advised not to go out like a certain superstar, who was a descendant of slavery but left more to the system and nothing for his siblings. Maybe Prince decided he could accept family would receive money, but it's not like him to do anything he feels strongly against... another log on the "accidental death" fire.

Regarding his family and employees, He said these words exactly "they don't love me. I don't trust them". I believe that's his motivation for not entering legit rehab sooner. He was afraid and didn't want to go through it without the proper support. To the extent they learned anything about his situation in those final years, it was likely because he wanted to establish a legitimate rapport with them about his circumstances and maybe enter life-saving rehab. So... a log on the 'natural causes' fire.

He also told me at that time (2013), about albums: "I'll produce one on you and you produce one on me. After that I'm going to kill myself". Point blank. My response was not pretty, but the way he is, is that he feels loved when you cuss and fuss over his refusal to properly care for himself. All that happened instead (3EG,AOA, etc) is largely a troll job, on his part, of my rejection of his offer, but it worked emough to keep him alive, which was my only goal, so I'm proud to have made a difference. How many other people just rolled with to be down with him though? He's telling me so he's telling them too. In some cases they are the go between, because I had taken to not talking to him directly too often anymore because he was not consistently honest about his darker intentions, imo, and the resulting stress and worry was affecting my personal life.

What bothers me about Jolene, and I could be misremembering the one report I read about the situation, but I don't recall anyone telling him they loved him at the hospital. It means everything to him to hear that, and in the past when it seems like we are losing him to whatever was troubling him, "I love you" lifted the clouds and gave him the strength to battle back from whatever he'd gotten himself into. He could really kick up a fuss about passing away prematurely, but in the end he's just too proud to admit he wants to hear that you love him. All that he said in the hospital room in just consistent with the type of conversational redirecting he does when.. in the end he just wants you to panic for his life and tell him you love him. He won't break right away. He'll tease it out a bit to make you think something else worked out instead of those three words, but that is what he's gunning for: someone who matters, to value him enough to say "I love you".

One more thing, I saw in this thread someone said he didn't care about being caught with pills at Paisley. No he did. I forget how I knew about his pills in tissue boxes, but I brought it up in 2013/2014. I mentioned that I was 'too much of a fan' to work at Paisley and that i would, I dunno, collect his tissues as momentos if I worked there. That was shade/subtweet/code etc. directed at his HABITS and where I was fairly certain he was stashing them, based on something he'd said the week previous. I was trying to get him to leave me alone about some other stuff (no one really needs to know taht but he can be really annoying), and it worked. He was spooked by the fact that I knew his pill location and decided to get his house in order.

Oh and one more thing... I am Prince. I told ya the truth is bizarre and you won't believe it. biggrin

I'll post about that another time, because it's at the heart of why he did what he did and what happened. I didn't know for certain when he first passed away. And I didn't feel comfortable that someone hadn't murdered him, so I wanted the police investigation to play out. But the information as it was coming out from the beginning tells me I know the truth in a way that not too many others can speak too.

"There are rules to his thinking. He thinks of himself as a massive f-up and kind of not really being worth a blank" How could he think of himself as a massive f-up??? eek confused

And that last paragraph....Sounds like what u are saying is u don't think this was no accident or u know this was no accident... I'm I understanding u right?

[Edited 2/20/19 9:24am]

Reply #296 posted 02/20/19 9:39am

luvsexy4all

here we go.......people who claim to know the truth.... ..and sit on it...not that it should be revealed for OUR benefit

Reply #297 posted 02/20/19 10:22am

1Sasha

nelcp777 said:

So then, if the CVS bottles were older than Atlanta, then that implies to me that Prince had been using fentanyl for a longer period than thought. Perhaps the reason there was not any fentanyl in the blood test on the 20th was because Prince went back to dialud and took the last of it since it was not found in the initial CC search?

Residents of Chanhassen had begun talking of suicide right after P passed. I would imagine a local source would have been revealed, but I could be wrong. The dark web makes a great, intriguing source, but the financial records were looked at. They were not released per the withheld list of documents. At some point, wouldn't an account be needed for Bitcoin?

I mean shit, Patrick Cousins took money from Prince and the SA caught onto it, not Prince.

I see why Kirk lawyered up along with Phaedra. Kirk has a vault too, and KAJ productions is getting paid. Phaedra got her cut, but not her waiver.

The bag that contained the CVS bottles, I wonder when was the last time Prince used that bag for travel. Hell, if he went to Atlanta for 1 night, why would he need so many bottles?

The DEA never releases the shipping info to the Country Inn. Prince did spend a lot of time in LA, perhaps that was his source?

Maybe around 2014 - 2015 he went from dialud and vicodin to fentanyl? Perhaps that explains the rapid change in appearance? Thoughts anyone?

My sister lived in Eden Prairie at the time. She said the chatter went from an accident in the first days to suicide within weeks.

Reply #298 posted 02/20/19 12:53pm

Astasheiks

Yikes! eek confused sad neutral

I don't guess there is a Orthopedic Surgeon on org or somebody close to that medical discipline on the org. Because I would like to ask even if P had gone to that rehab place in CA, he still was going to be in hip pain and still would need some relief. So a great a Orthopedic Surgeon could have did hip replacement or double hip replacement but he didn't want to do that because of being tied up with Larry Graham and them JW's because they are not to take blood transfusions so he would still be in a mess!?!?!?!?! mad razz sad

Or did that Dr. in CA or somewhere else had a remedy for the continue pain without the hip surgery?

Opinions???

[Edited 2/20/19 13:03pm]

Reply #299 posted 02/20/19 1:15pm

PennyPurple

Astasheiks said:

Yikes! eek confused sad neutral

I don't guess there is a Orthopedic Surgeon on org or somebody close to that medical discipline on the org. Because I would like to ask even if P had gone to that rehab place in CA, he still was going to be in hip pain and still would need some relief. So a great a Orthopedic Surgeon could have did hip replacement or double hip replacement but he didn't want to do that because of being tied up with Larry Graham and them JW's because they are not to take blood transfusions so he would still be in a mess!?!?!?!?! mad razz sad

Or did that Dr. in CA or somewhere else had a remedy for the continue pain without the hip surgery?

Opinions???

[Edited 2/20/19 13:03pm]

He had the hip surgery.

Reply #300 posted 02/20/19 2:31pm

PennyPurple

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

^^ Wow go to the link and see the whole book. eek Looks like the comic guy has seen the pics.

OMG, I was just about to post this, Penny...blew my mind....so on point... neutral

Evidently the org's facebook page liked my link too..... lol

Reply #301 posted 02/20/19 2:45pm

Astasheiks

PennyPurple said:

Astasheiks said:

Yikes! eek confused sad neutral

I don't guess there is a Orthopedic Surgeon on org or somebody close to that medical discipline on the org. Because I would like to ask even if P had gone to that rehab place in CA, he still was going to be in hip pain and still would need some relief. So a great a Orthopedic Surgeon could have did hip replacement or double hip replacement but he didn't want to do that because of being tied up with Larry Graham and them JW's because they are not to take blood transfusions so he would still be in a mess!?!?!?!?! mad razz sad

Or did that Dr. in CA or somewhere else had a remedy for the continue pain without the hip surgery?

Opinions???

[Edited 2/20/19 13:03pm]

He had the hip surgery.

I thought that was just on one hip?

Reply #302 posted 02/20/19 7:49pm

nelcp777

1Sasha said:

nelcp777 said:

So then, if the CVS bottles were older than Atlanta, then that implies to me that Prince had been using fentanyl for a longer period than thought. Perhaps the reason there was not any fentanyl in the blood test on the 20th was because Prince went back to dialud and took the last of it since it was not found in the initial CC search?

Residents of Chanhassen had begun talking of suicide right after P passed. I would imagine a local source would have been revealed, but I could be wrong. The dark web makes a great, intriguing source, but the financial records were looked at. They were not released per the withheld list of documents. At some point, wouldn't an account be needed for Bitcoin?

I mean shit, Patrick Cousins took money from Prince and the SA caught onto it, not Prince.

I see why Kirk lawyered up along with Phaedra. Kirk has a vault too, and KAJ productions is getting paid. Phaedra got her cut, but not her waiver.

The bag that contained the CVS bottles, I wonder when was the last time Prince used that bag for travel. Hell, if he went to Atlanta for 1 night, why would he need so many bottles?

The DEA never releases the shipping info to the Country Inn. Prince did spend a lot of time in LA, perhaps that was his source?

Maybe around 2014 - 2015 he went from dialud and vicodin to fentanyl? Perhaps that explains the rapid change in appearance? Thoughts anyone?

My sister lived in Eden Prairie at the time. She said the chatter went from an accident in the first days to suicide within weeks.

I heard similar comments here on the Org about the rumors from accident to suicide.

Reply #303 posted 02/20/19 8:46pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

nelcp777 said:

1Sasha said:

My sister lived in Eden Prairie at the time. She said the chatter went from an accident in the first days to suicide within weeks.

I heard similar comments here on the Org about the rumors from accident to suicide.



P had 15 perc's from Dr. S the day he left for Atlanta, and 11 were found at PP.

He also had the 10 Tylenol codeine from Kirk's dentist (which were found in the PP dumpster.)


Initially, P told the ER doc he took 3 perc's and 1 "mystery pill" from the Bayer bottle.

P later told the ER doc he took 2 perc's, and 2 "mystery pills."

The question becomes why would P take the "mystery pills" instead of taking a legitimate script for perc's?

Also, I cant find the blood results from Dr. S. Does anyone know if they were released?



[Edited 2/20/19 20:46pm]

Reply #304 posted 02/21/19 5:41am

nelcp777

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

 



nelcp777 said:


 



1Sasha said:


 


My sister lived in Eden Prairie at the time.  She said the chatter went from an accident in the first days to suicide within weeks.



I heard similar comments here on the Org about the rumors from accident to suicide.





P had 15 perc's from Dr. S the day he left for Atlanta, and 11 were found at PP.


He also had the 10 Tylenol codeine from Kirk's dentist (which were found in the PP dumpster.)


Initially, P told the ER doc he took 3 perc's and 1 "mystery pill" from the Bayer bottle.

P later told the ER doc he took 2 perc's, and 2 "mystery pills."

The question becomes why would P take the "mystery pills" instead of taking a legitimate script for perc's?

Also, I cant find the blood results from Dr. S. Does anyone know if they were released?



[Edited 2/20/19 20:46pm]


Perhaps P knew that the mystery pill was fentanyl. If P was at the fentanyl level, Peres would not suffice. Also, some speculate Moline was his first attempt. I will have to look for the results later today
Reply #305 posted 02/21/19 10:50am

Astasheiks

nelcp777 said:

1Sasha said:

My sister lived in Eden Prairie at the time. She said the chatter went from an accident in the first days to suicide within weeks.

I heard similar comments here on the Org about the rumors from accident to suicide.

eek sad

Reply #306 posted 02/21/19 10:52am

Astasheiks

nelcp777 said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



P had 15 perc's from Dr. S the day he left for Atlanta, and 11 were found at PP.

He also had the 10 Tylenol codeine from Kirk's dentist (which were found in the PP dumpster.)


Initially, P told the ER doc he took 3 perc's and 1 "mystery pill" from the Bayer bottle.

P later told the ER doc he took 2 perc's, and 2 "mystery pills."

The question becomes why would P take the "mystery pills" instead of taking a legitimate script for perc's?

Also, I cant find the blood results from Dr. S. Does anyone know if they were released?



[Edited 2/20/19 20:46pm]

Perhaps P knew that the mystery pill was fentanyl. If P was at the fentanyl level, Peres would not suffice. Also, some speculate Moline was his first attempt. I will have to look for the results later today

Lawd Jesus, imagine if he knew and did this on purpose... Would that lead him to meeting Spooky Electric for real?

Reply #307 posted 02/21/19 11:04am

nelcp777

Astasheiks said:

nelcp777 said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said: Perhaps P knew that the mystery pill was fentanyl. If P was at the fentanyl level, Peres would not suffice. Also, some speculate Moline was his first attempt. I will have to look for the results later today

Lawd Jesus, imagine if he knew and did this on purpose... Would that lead him to meeting Spooky Electric for real?

I am not saying his death was intentional. But, by telling Kirk it was a mystery pill, that helped Prince control had bad his addiction had escalated. Now this is pure speculation on my end. This whole time I was under the thought process that Prince got the pills in Atlanta. The suitcase that contained the CVS bottles makes me think he had them from another time and place.

Where? That is the million dollar question.

From other people in his inner circle, Prince used/asked them to procure pills from him. The same with Kirk. That leads me to believe that Prince had to really know and "trust" the source for Prince to get them directly. The only option is online, and have them delivered to the Country Inn. Delievering them to Paisley would raise a flag or provide a direct link. Also, there were multiple addresses that Prince "owned" - houses, warehouses. He could have used them.

We, as fans, do not have a lot of information on Prince and his "daily" routine.

There is a lot of speculation tha the pills were custom made. For a custom order, is there a minimum quantity? Prince did not have a credit card, at least per his inner circle, so how was this order paid for? Digital currency? Cash?

I also tend to think about Prince's residency in LA. Maybe that was the start to a new supplier. The options seem to be abundant.

Reply #308 posted 02/21/19 11:22am

Astasheiks

I hear what ya saying. Furthermore, anybody calling a pill a "Mystery Pill" to me is crazy! A pill that who knows what the hell is in it, sounds dangerous as hell. And having them delivered to the Country Inn seems like that could be a Red Flag also...hhhhmmm?

Reply #309 posted 02/21/19 11:30am

deerpath

For those tracking the Purdue Pharma story, here is a link. Though people were already dying from overdoses of this prescribed medicine, Prince's death brought national attention to the way these drugs were prescribed and used. https://www.statnews.com/...eposition/

"Hold on to your souls y'all. We got a long way to go. Thank you! We love y'all!"
Reply #310 posted 02/21/19 12:18pm

AnnastesiaP

I thought the JJ thread was the thread that never ends. This thread is like a textbook. Part THIRTEEN? Ya’ll really think he was murdered? Where should I start reading?
Reply #311 posted 02/21/19 12:32pm

nelcp777

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



P had 15 perc's from Dr. S the day he left for Atlanta, and 11 were found at PP.

He also had the 10 Tylenol codeine from Kirk's dentist (which were found in the PP dumpster.)


Initially, P told the ER doc he took 3 perc's and 1 "mystery pill" from the Bayer bottle.

P later told the ER doc he took 2 perc's, and 2 "mystery pills."

The question becomes why would P take the "mystery pills" instead of taking a legitimate script for perc's?

Also, I cant find the blood results from Dr. S. Does anyone know if they were released?



[Edited 2/20/19 20:46pm]

The results from 4-20 from Dr. S are:

Hydrocodone 253 ngl/ml

Hydroporphone 87 ng/ml

This is from the Investigative Report #2 file, page 56, section 107. Going on in Section 108, Dr. Strobel tested the above sample for fentanyl and the test failed to show any fentanyl in Prince's system.

Also, per the Investigative Report #2 file, 8 percocets and 4 half percocet pills were found in the Ondansetron HC prescription bottle. This is page 45, section 44. The percect prescription was in Kirk's name and was for 15 pills.

Edited to add, another percocet pill was found loosely in the black bag and tested positive as oxycodone. Investigate Report #2,m page 67, 3rd paragraph.

[Edited 2/21/19 12:42pm]

Reply #312 posted 02/21/19 1:15pm

nelcp777

I was scrubbing the Investigative Report #2, page 84, section 274. Kirk said he cleared out the studio. This is Manuela's interview. She goes on to say that Kirk recalled there was something in Prince's travel bag in the aspirin bottle, but that Kirk had checked the bag while he was cleaning up and didn't see it.

Kirk went on to say that he(Kirk) didn't believe there was anything left for Prince to get and that Kirk cleaned out PP.

So, per Manuela, Kirk accessed the travel bag. This had to happen either before the doctor's appointment or after cos Prince told him, "I can't kick this, I need a drink". That was the night before P died.

Reply #313 posted 02/21/19 1:18pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

nelcp777 said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



P had 15 perc's from Dr. S the day he left for Atlanta, and 11 were found at PP.

He also had the 10 Tylenol codeine from Kirk's dentist (which were found in the PP dumpster.)


Initially, P told the ER doc he took 3 perc's and 1 "mystery pill" from the Bayer bottle.

P later told the ER doc he took 2 perc's, and 2 "mystery pills."

The question becomes why would P take the "mystery pills" instead of taking a legitimate script for perc's?

Also, I cant find the blood results from Dr. S. Does anyone know if they were released?



The results from 4-20 from Dr. S are:

Hydrocodone 253 ngl/ml

Hydroporphone 87 ng/ml

This is from the Investigative Report #2 file, page 56, section 107. Going on in Section 108, Dr. Strobel tested the above sample for fentanyl and the test failed to show any fentanyl in Prince's system.

Also, per the Investigative Report #2 file, 8 percocets and 4 half percocet pills were found in the Ondansetron HC prescription bottle. This is page 45, section 44. The percect prescription was in Kirk's name and was for 15 pills.

Edited to add, another percocet pill was found loosely in the black bag and tested positive as oxycodone. Investigate Report #2,m page 67, 3rd paragraph.

I am confused because in another area of the report they said they found 10 oxy in the bottle and one loose in the black bag?

Did they release the actual written blood test results? I cant remember.

Reply #314 posted 02/21/19 1:22pm

muchtoofast

nelcp777 said:

I was scrubbing the Investigative Report #2, page 84, section 274. Kirk said he cleared out the studio. This is Manuela's interview. She goes on to say that Kirk recalled there was something in Prince's travel bag in the aspirin bottle, but that Kirk had checked the bag while he was cleaning up and didn't see it. 


Kirk went on to say that he(Kirk) didn't believe there was anything left for Prince to get and that Kirk cleaned out PP.


So, per Manuela, Kirk accessed the travel bag. This had to happen either before the doctor's appointment or after cos Prince told him, "I can't kick this, I need a drink". That was the night before P died. 


 


Do you have a link to that? I have files but page 84 is all about Dr S so I must not have what you have. Thank you.
Reply #315 posted 02/21/19 3:47pm

nelcp777

muchtoofast said:

nelcp777 said:

I was scrubbing the Investigative Report #2, page 84, section 274. Kirk said he cleared out the studio. This is Manuela's interview. She goes on to say that Kirk recalled there was something in Prince's travel bag in the aspirin bottle, but that Kirk had checked the bag while he was cleaning up and didn't see it.

Kirk went on to say that he(Kirk) didn't believe there was anything left for Prince to get and that Kirk cleaned out PP.

So, per Manuela, Kirk accessed the travel bag. This had to happen either before the doctor's appointment or after cos Prince told him, "I can't kick this, I need a drink". That was the night before P died.

Do you have a link to that? I have files but page 84 is all about Dr S so I must not have what you have. Thank you.

I just checked and I am looking at it now. From the Electronics Record #5, Investigative Report #2, page 84. The title of the page is Carver County Sherrif's Office Follow Up Report. Page 84 starts with section 271 and ends with 277. Sections 271 - 275 deal with the conversation with Manuela and Sections 276-277 address the Shaun Powell issue of being a security guard and finding Prince.

Reply #316 posted 02/21/19 3:52pm

nelcp777

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

nelcp777 said:

The results from 4-20 from Dr. S are:

Hydrocodone 253 ngl/ml

Hydroporphone 87 ng/ml

This is from the Investigative Report #2 file, page 56, section 107. Going on in Section 108, Dr. Strobel tested the above sample for fentanyl and the test failed to show any fentanyl in Prince's system.

Also, per the Investigative Report #2 file, 8 percocets and 4 half percocet pills were found in the Ondansetron HC prescription bottle. This is page 45, section 44. The percect prescription was in Kirk's name and was for 15 pills.

Edited to add, another percocet pill was found loosely in the black bag and tested positive as oxycodone. Investigate Report #2,m page 67, 3rd paragraph.

I am confused because in another area of the report they said they found 10 oxy in the bottle and one loose in the black bag?

Did they release the actual written blood test results? I cant remember.

The initial interview with Dr S did not provide the blood results. The blood results were revealed when CC pulled Prince's records. This is mentioned on Page 56 of Investigative Report #2.

If you add the 8 full pulls and the 4 half pills, that is 10, plus the 1 loose in the bag, that should be 11. In essence, they did find 10 in the bottle, just not full.

I am tired, but I tripled checked prior to my post and definitetly after. I do not want to give out incorrect information.

Reply #317 posted 02/21/19 6:29pm

Menes

nelcp777 said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



P had 15 perc's from Dr. S the day he left for Atlanta, and 11 were found at PP.

He also had the 10 Tylenol codeine from Kirk's dentist (which were found in the PP dumpster.)


Initially, P told the ER doc he took 3 perc's and 1 "mystery pill" from the Bayer bottle.

P later told the ER doc he took 2 perc's, and 2 "mystery pills."

The question becomes why would P take the "mystery pills" instead of taking a legitimate script for perc's?

Also, I cant find the blood results from Dr. S. Does anyone know if they were released?



[Edited 2/20/19 20:46pm]

The results from 4-20 from Dr. S are:

Hydrocodone 253 ngl/ml

Hydroporphone 87 ng/ml

This is from the Investigative Report #2 file, page 56, section 107. Going on in Section 108, Dr. Strobel tested the above sample for fentanyl and the test failed to show any fentanyl in Prince's system.

Also, per the Investigative Report #2 file, 8 percocets and 4 half percocet pills were found in the Ondansetron HC prescription bottle. This is page 45, section 44. The percect prescription was in Kirk's name and was for 15 pills.

Edited to add, another percocet pill was found loosely in the black bag and tested positive as oxycodone. Investigate Report #2,m page 67, 3rd paragraph.

[Edited 2/21/19 12:42pm]

And if you're calculating anything with basic conversion tables, Prince was a walking dead man with at least 3-4 times the amount of hydrocodone above what is scientifically accepted as fatal levels of hydrocodone ! Hydrocodone is typically excreted within a 3-4 day window (per its half life) after last usage (contingent upon factors such as metabolism rate, weight and so on.

That test was done on the 20th. That should put us @ around a six-day window from Moline to the time he took the test that revealed the consumption of such a large dose. Give or take 3-4 days for excretion, Prince hammered those pills down between the 16th and the 20th. Riding a bike and having a PP get together ,was nothing more than a quasi attempt to throw the masses into a state of confused bliss. Those who swallowed up the lie, could never believe it was intentional because he planted the seed that said it can't be so.

Prince, by all accounts, should have been dead (3) separate times, within a (7) day period.

Imagine if the medical examiner had all of that information coupled with his own words to Judith, Meron, etc.,? Maybe she did but reserved the right to stick to a strict legal interpretation that is governed by that laws of her state.

Reply #318 posted 02/21/19 6:36pm

PennyPurple

Menes said:

nelcp777 said:

The results from 4-20 from Dr. S are:

Hydrocodone 253 ngl/ml

Hydroporphone 87 ng/ml

This is from the Investigative Report #2 file, page 56, section 107. Going on in Section 108, Dr. Strobel tested the above sample for fentanyl and the test failed to show any fentanyl in Prince's system.

Also, per the Investigative Report #2 file, 8 percocets and 4 half percocet pills were found in the Ondansetron HC prescription bottle. This is page 45, section 44. The percect prescription was in Kirk's name and was for 15 pills.

Edited to add, another percocet pill was found loosely in the black bag and tested positive as oxycodone. Investigate Report #2,m page 67, 3rd paragraph.

[Edited 2/21/19 12:42pm]

And if you're calculating anything with basic conversion tables, Prince was a walking dead man with at least 3-4 times the amount of hydrocodone above what is scientifically accepted as fatal levels of hydrocodone ! Hydrocodone is typically excreted within a 3-4 day window (per its half life) after last usage (contingent upon factors such as metabolism rate, weight and so on.

That test was done on the 20th. That should put us @ around a six-day window from Moline to the time he took the test that revealed the consumption of such a large dose. Give or take 3-4 days for excretion, Prince hammered those pills down between the 16th and the 20th. Riding a bike and having a PP get together ,was nothing more than a quasi attempt to throw the masses into a state of confused bliss. Those who swallowed up the lie, could never believe it was intentional because he planted the seed that said it can't be so.

Prince, by all accounts, should have been dead (3) separate times, within a (7) day period.

Imagine if the medical examiner had all of that information coupled with his own words to Judith, Meron, etc.,? Maybe she did but reserved the right to stick to a strict legal interpretation that is governed by that laws of her state.

The Narcan in Moline would've wiped the narcs out of him wouldn't it? So it seems that as soon as he got back home, he was on them again?

Reply #319 posted 02/21/19 6:53pm

Menes

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

And if you're calculating anything with basic conversion tables, Prince was a walking dead man with at least 3-4 times the amount of hydrocodone above what is scientifically accepted as fatal levels of hydrocodone ! Hydrocodone is typically excreted within a 3-4 day window (per its half life) after last usage (contingent upon factors such as metabolism rate, weight and so on.

That test was done on the 20th. That should put us @ around a six-day window from Moline to the time he took the test that revealed the consumption of such a large dose. Give or take 3-4 days for excretion, Prince hammered those pills down between the 16th and the 20th. Riding a bike and having a PP get together ,was nothing more than a quasi attempt to throw the masses into a state of confused bliss. Those who swallowed up the lie, could never believe it was intentional because he planted the seed that said it can't be so.

Prince, by all accounts, should have been dead (3) separate times, within a (7) day period.

Imagine if the medical examiner had all of that information coupled with his own words to Judith, Meron, etc.,? Maybe she did but reserved the right to stick to a strict legal interpretation that is governed by that laws of her state.

The Narcan in Moline would've wiped the narcs out of him wouldn't it? So it seems that as soon as he got back home, he was on them again?

I believe the action of narcan is directly related to a reversal of the action of said opioid on the receptor itself. Narcan will last about 30-90 minutes. The amount of drugs in ones system, may outlast the time period for narcan to effectlvely reverse the opioid binding to the receptor. Some may have immediate withdrawals , some may not.

Either way, the urge to use will return . Therein lies the problem of effectively treating an overdose with narcan. It's merely a life saving drug, but does nothing for addiction long term.

Reply #320 posted 02/21/19 6:57pm

PennyPurple

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

The Narcan in Moline would've wiped the narcs out of him wouldn't it? So it seems that as soon as he got back home, he was on them again?

I believe the action of narcan is directly related to a reversal of the action of said opioid on the receptor itself. Narcan will last about 30-90 minutes. The amount of drugs in ones system, may outlast the time period for narcan to effectlvely reverse the opioid binding to the receptor. Some may have immediate withdrawals , some may not.

Either way, the urge to use will return . Therein lies the problem of effectively treating an overdose with narcan. It's merely a life saving drug, but does nothing for addiction long term.

Right. So the amount in his urine, you are thinking it was deadly even without the fentanyl?

Reply #321 posted 02/21/19 7:04pm

Menes

nelcp777 said:

I was scrubbing the Investigative Report #2, page 84, section 274. Kirk said he cleared out the studio. This is Manuela's interview. She goes on to say that Kirk recalled there was something in Prince's travel bag in the aspirin bottle, but that Kirk had checked the bag while he was cleaning up and didn't see it.

Kirk went on to say that he(Kirk) didn't believe there was anything left for Prince to get and that Kirk cleaned out PP.

So, per Manuela, Kirk accessed the travel bag. This had to happen either before the doctor's appointment or after cos Prince told him, "I can't kick this, I need a drink". That was the night before P died.

Nelcp777,

If I'm not mistaken, the only reason the detective knew that the percocets in the bottle were for Prince is because Dr. Schulenberg's notes and interview told them so. I don't remember Kirk volunteering that information , nor do I recall a follow up interview questioning Kirk about why he had done that. Dr.Schulenberg stated the reason he did it.

Also, when the doctor in Moline was given the pills that were in the bag by Kirk, I think a visual test was done when they sent it out for confirmation, but the actual chemical composition test to state unequivocally that it was "x" ,was not revealed. At least that is what I thought they said in the report.I will have to double back and check that.

Reply #322 posted 02/21/19 7:26pm

Menes

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

I believe the action of narcan is directly related to a reversal of the action of said opioid on the receptor itself. Narcan will last about 30-90 minutes. The amount of drugs in ones system, may outlast the time period for narcan to effectlvely reverse the opioid binding to the receptor. Some may have immediate withdrawals , some may not.

Either way, the urge to use will return . Therein lies the problem of effectively treating an overdose with narcan. It's merely a life saving drug, but does nothing for addiction long term.

Right. So the amount in his urine, you are thinking it was deadly even without the fentanyl?

If you mean the hydrocodone, Yes, 100 percent it was deadly. 3-4 times above what is considered fatal by all accounts. His tolerance level was astonishingly high. We can summise that Prince had developed a chronic pattern of using copious amounts in one setting. You have to understand that he went to that test as a dead man walking on the 20th. Unless I am getting my dates mixed up, this is the day prior to his death and is with Kirk getting things "sorted" out.

Now, what's so fu*** is that Kirk stated that when he (Prince) took the prescribed medication to calm him down ( from the script written by Dr. Schulenberg), it appears that the initial consumption of illicit substances are now beginning to wear off. This would explain his antsy behavior during his time with Kirk. Apparently, the prescribed medication did nothing for Prince. I will have to check the exact time frame but it's before 2000 hours( 8pm) that night. Btw, Dr. Schulenberg knew Prince had been going thru withdrawals from something even prior to the test and this is evidenced by Dr. Schulenberg's words and what he prescribed for Prince.

Now we have more of a pattern of use,and how often he would have had to use ( x amount of days/hours or so before the next time) in order to remain in a state of comfort.

I didn't even get into the other drug ( and the amount) that was in his system ( hydromorphone). Its overkill. If this is an accident, he sure as hell repeated this accidental use of copious amounts of opioids thrice in one week.

[Edited 2/21/19 19:27pm]

Reply #323 posted 02/21/19 8:31pm

Bodhitheblackdog

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Right. So the amount in his urine, you are thinking it was deadly even without the fentanyl?

If you mean the hydrocodone, Yes, 100 percent it was deadly. 3-4 times above what is considered fatal by all accounts. His tolerance level was astonishingly high. We can summise that Prince had developed a chronic pattern of using copious amounts in one setting. You have to understand that he went to that test as a dead man walking on the 20th. Unless I am getting my dates mixed up, this is the day prior to his death and is with Kirk getting things "sorted" out.

Now, what's so fu*** is that Kirk stated that when he (Prince) took the prescribed medication to calm him down ( from the script written by Dr. Schulenberg), it appears that the initial consumption of illicit substances are now beginning to wear off. This would explain his antsy behavior during his time with Kirk. Apparently, the prescribed medication did nothing for Prince. I will have to check the exact time frame but it's before 2000 hours( 8pm) that night. Btw, Dr. Schulenberg knew Prince had been going thru withdrawals from something even prior to the test and this is evidenced by Dr. Schulenberg's words and what he prescribed for Prince.

Now we have more of a pattern of use,and how often he would have had to use ( x amount of days/hours or so before the next time) in order to remain in a state of comfort.

I didn't even get into the other drug ( and the amount) that was in his system ( hydromorphone). Its overkill. If this is an accident, he sure as hell repeated this accidental use of copious amounts of opioids thrice in one week.

[Edited 2/21/19 19:27pm]

Menes: your picture, painted with a scientific brush, is pulling into focus. It wasn't an accident or a bad batch or murder...it was just the way he rolled towards the end. I think he either ran out of time, or it was an act of desperation because he BELIEVED there was no way out (not believing in rehab) ...no way to get clean and keep HIS version of HIS dignity intact.

It is so ironic to me because it was his laser-focused vision of himself that was the very heart of his genius...but it was so rigid it didn't allow for human fraility: taking a bad path or being scared or ashamed.

Us regular folks deal with this all the time but I don't think Prince did; I think Prince only moved forward.

Thanks for all your contributions and observations.

Reply #324 posted 02/21/19 9:54pm

Menes

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Menes said:

If you mean the hydrocodone, Yes, 100 percent it was deadly. 3-4 times above what is considered fatal by all accounts. His tolerance level was astonishingly high. We can summise that Prince had developed a chronic pattern of using copious amounts in one setting. You have to understand that he went to that test as a dead man walking on the 20th. Unless I am getting my dates mixed up, this is the day prior to his death and is with Kirk getting things "sorted" out.

Now, what's so fu*** is that Kirk stated that when he (Prince) took the prescribed medication to calm him down ( from the script written by Dr. Schulenberg), it appears that the initial consumption of illicit substances are now beginning to wear off. This would explain his antsy behavior during his time with Kirk. Apparently, the prescribed medication did nothing for Prince. I will have to check the exact time frame but it's before 2000 hours( 8pm) that night. Btw, Dr. Schulenberg knew Prince had been going thru withdrawals from something even prior to the test and this is evidenced by Dr. Schulenberg's words and what he prescribed for Prince.

Now we have more of a pattern of use,and how often he would have had to use ( x amount of days/hours or so before the next time) in order to remain in a state of comfort.

I didn't even get into the other drug ( and the amount) that was in his system ( hydromorphone). Its overkill. If this is an accident, he sure as hell repeated this accidental use of copious amounts of opioids thrice in one week.

[Edited 2/21/19 19:27pm]

Menes: your picture, painted with a scientific brush, is pulling into focus. It wasn't an accident or a bad batch or murder...it was just the way he rolled towards the end. I think he either ran out of time, or it was an act of desperation because he BELIEVED there was no way out (not believing in rehab) ...no way to get clean and keep HIS version of HIS dignity intact.

It is so ironic to me because it was his laser-focused vision of himself that was the very heart of his genius...but it was so rigid it didn't allow for human fraility: taking a bad path or being scared or ashamed.

Us regular folks deal with this all the time but I don't think Prince did; I think Prince only moved forward.

Thanks for all your contributions and observations.

Hey Bod! How are ya? Thanks to you , Penny and the gang that kept this alive, WE are going to get to the bottom of this.

You are correct in saying it was the way he rolled towards the end. He rolled hard. Extreme, is all I can say. This was a rather hopeless picture once addiction to such powerful substances entered into his life. Which me brings to another rambling post...

I saw something here about Prince ( "the massive fuck up") wanting to be loved and something or the other about Prince being lifted out of the clouds if he heard the words "I love you" (paraphrasing here). As if this was going to stop his addiction? Jesus H.

I have no plausible excuse for these kinds of statements ( I totally don't), but moreso, I dont understand why statements like these aren't called out as bordering on the absurd. It's the type of statement that can give a loved one false hope.

This is addiction. This is a disease. How many times has love cured HIV/AIDS? How about cancer? The common cold? Love is not, nor will ever be the answer to curing addiction. It's not even the precursor to the supposed "cure". I would rather count to (1) billion , (10) times over, than to count on love as a cure for addiction.

What science has continued to do,is research the proper chemical composition that the brain will be able to use in order to modify the way a receptor behaves after it is no longer being bombarded with opioids, or any other addictive substances. Even then, a simple trigger can reverse that entire process and the hamster will start spinning in that dreaded wheel again. That spirirt/love business might be all well and good, but the brain is controlled by science ( chemical processes) and information. Nothing more, nothing less.

Do we not know what monkeys and rats in labs do when addicted to substances a lot less potent than opioids (cocaine)? At some point , low hanging instinctual fruit such as hunger , thirst, sex, play, companionship is replaced with the onslaught of one thought- that of when the drug will be administered. This perpetual thought process feeds transmitters and synapses that inevitably leads to death.

These lab animals have no say so in this, nor they do they have the intellectual capacity to understand addiction. Yet, they behave in a very simliar way as we do when a particular region of the brain is affected .

Hello? Prince's brain is no different with regards to addiction. This is not about sprituality, trust, money, wills, fans, albums, music, sex, betrayal or any other excuses we can think of. This is a brain that is now wired far differently from that of a brain not suffering from addiction. Whomever Prince was prior to his addiction, is certainly not the same person who died because of it. The only thing that mattered to Prince ( and to addicts in general) was/is the time of day'/night that one can feed the addiction. Nothing else mattered/matters.

[Edited 2/21/19 21:56pm]

Reply #325 posted 02/21/19 10:00pm

Menes

If anyone has the time and can let me know which of the pills was the crushed up or half pill in the tissue next to the bed, I would appreciate that very much. Also, were all of the half pills the fentanyl pills ? 'Till tomorrow.

Reply #326 posted 02/22/19 4:50am

1Sasha

I think he decided to die, and it was only the last time that worked. My questions have been: who procured for him, what was the involvement of Kirk and Meron in his final months in sustaining his behavior, what happened to his money - who controlled it and where did it go, why was he left alone that last night, and what precipitated the call to Kornfeld's office - if they didn't call months earlier, why now? Would "they" need to keep him alive for any purpose? For a long time I felt there was a terminal or incurable disease he was suffering from, because of the dramatic change in his appearance. Since we don't have the autopsy report, we cannot know if there was an underlying medical condition. But nothing adds up here. Nothing.

Reply #327 posted 02/22/19 6:42am

rednblue

Menes said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Menes: your picture, painted with a scientific brush, is pulling into focus. It wasn't an accident or a bad batch or murder...it was just the way he rolled towards the end. I think he either ran out of time, or it was an act of desperation because he BELIEVED there was no way out (not believing in rehab) ...no way to get clean and keep HIS version of HIS dignity intact.

It is so ironic to me because it was his laser-focused vision of himself that was the very heart of his genius...but it was so rigid it didn't allow for human fraility: taking a bad path or being scared or ashamed.

Us regular folks deal with this all the time but I don't think Prince did; I think Prince only moved forward.

Thanks for all your contributions and observations.

Hey Bod! How are ya? Thanks to you , Penny and the gang that kept this alive, WE are going to get to the bottom of this.

You are correct in saying it was the way he rolled towards the end. He rolled hard. Extreme, is all I can say. This was a rather hopeless picture once addiction to such powerful substances entered into his life. Which me brings to another rambling post...

I saw something here about Prince ( "the massive fuck up") wanting to be loved and something or the other about Prince being lifted out of the clouds if he heard the words "I love you" (paraphrasing here). As if this was going to stop his addiction? Jesus H.

I have no plausible excuse for these kinds of statements ( I totally don't), but moreso, I dont understand why statements like these aren't called out as bordering on the absurd. It's the type of statement that can give a loved one false hope.

This is addiction. This is a disease. How many times has love cured HIV/AIDS? How about cancer? The common cold? Love is not, nor will ever be the answer to curing addiction. It's not even the precursor to the supposed "cure". I would rather count to (1) billion , (10) times over, than to count on love as a cure for addiction.

What science has continued to do,is research the proper chemical composition that the brain will be able to use in order to modify the way a receptor behaves after it is no longer being bombarded with opioids, or any other addictive substances. Even then, a simple trigger can reverse that entire process and the hamster will start spinning in that dreaded wheel again. That spirirt/love business might be all well and good, but the brain is controlled by science ( chemical processes) and information. Nothing more, nothing less.

Do we not know what monkeys and rats in labs do when addicted to substances a lot less potent than opioids (cocaine)? At some point , low hanging instinctual fruit such as hunger , thirst, sex, play, companionship is replaced with the onslaught of one thought- that of when the drug will be administered. This perpetual thought process feeds transmitters and synapses that inevitably leads to death.

These lab animals have no say so in this, nor they do they have the intellectual capacity to understand addiction. Yet, they behave in a very simliar way as we do when a particular region of the brain is affected .

Hello? Prince's brain is no different with regards to addiction. This is not about sprituality, trust, money, wills, fans, albums, music, sex, betrayal or any other excuses we can think of. This is a brain that is now wired far differently from that of a brain not suffering from addiction. Whomever Prince was prior to his addiction, is certainly not the same person who died because of it. The only thing that mattered to Prince ( and to addicts in general) was/is the time of day'/night that one can feed the addiction. Nothing else mattered/matters.

[Edited 2/21/19 21:56pm]


FWIW, I didn't get that out of what funksterr said. That is, that someone could stop an addiction by simply waving the wand of "I love you" words.

I strongly agree that genetic predisposition and the power of addiction's biology are HUGELY trivialized, and that is a HUGE problem.

In fact, I think that is, perhaps ironically, one of the environmental forces that promotes danger in ways such as pushing people with this medical condition to hide.

At least in the U.S. where I am, most of the biggest causes of suffering and disease are conditions that are significantly affected by genetics, biology and environment.

Yet addiction, and psychiatric conditions that often but by no means always accompany it, seem almost singled out for relative chastising of the sufferer and family/friends/loved ones.

Whatever the condition, people are people, and rarely to never is the condition managed perfectly rightly, or completely wrongly, by people involved. There are infintite individual stories in between these things. Can praise and criticism be warranted within these individual stories? Sure. And the SAME is true for the other conditions referred to above.

Addiction can affect the brain in a way nothing short of extreme. Underestimating that is a huge problem. At the same time, each story plays out differently, and loved ones, work or other things in life often do matter to an addicted person. I don't think it's true that "nothing else matters" to "addicts in general." But again, underestimating the power of the medical condition is enormously destructive. IMO, that this condition can affect the lives of people who often DO care for things like work and loved ones is, in itself, a striking illustration of its power.

I have a theory that a reason behind many with medical conditions gravitating to support groups is that they provide something unique and powerful. The people there know how powerful the condition is, how hard it is, first hand. People who don't have first hand knowledge, yet go ahead and trivialize, are everywhere out there. Most people in these groups also strongly believe in doing what a person has to do to support health.


Reply #328 posted 02/22/19 8:07am

Astasheiks

Menes said:

nelcp777 said:

The results from 4-20 from Dr. S are:

Hydrocodone 253 ngl/ml

Hydroporphone 87 ng/ml

This is from the Investigative Report #2 file, page 56, section 107. Going on in Section 108, Dr. Strobel tested the above sample for fentanyl and the test failed to show any fentanyl in Prince's system.

Also, per the Investigative Report #2 file, 8 percocets and 4 half percocet pills were found in the Ondansetron HC prescription bottle. This is page 45, section 44. The percect prescription was in Kirk's name and was for 15 pills.

Edited to add, another percocet pill was found loosely in the black bag and tested positive as oxycodone. Investigate Report #2,m page 67, 3rd paragraph.

[Edited 2/21/19 12:42pm]

And if you're calculating anything with basic conversion tables, Prince was a walking dead man with at least 3-4 times the amount of hydrocodone above what is scientifically accepted as fatal levels of hydrocodone ! Hydrocodone is typically excreted within a 3-4 day window (per its half life) after last usage (contingent upon factors such as metabolism rate, weight and so on.

That test was done on the 20th. That should put us @ around a six-day window from Moline to the time he took the test that revealed the consumption of such a large dose. Give or take 3-4 days for excretion, Prince hammered those pills down between the 16th and the 20th. Riding a bike and having a PP get together ,was nothing more than a quasi attempt to throw the masses into a state of confused bliss. Those who swallowed up the lie, could never believe it was intentional because he planted the seed that said it can't be so.

Prince, by all accounts, should have been dead (3) separate times, within a (7) day period.

Imagine if the medical examiner had all of that information coupled with his own words to Judith, Meron, etc.,? Maybe she did but reserved the right to stick to a strict legal interpretation that is governed by that laws of her state.

Wow! eek Wow, Just Wow!

Reply #329 posted 02/23/19 6:58am

leec1

Menes said:

If anyone has the time and can let me know which of the pills was the crushed up or half pill in the tissue next to the bed, I would appreciate that very much. Also, were all of the half pills the fentanyl pills ? 'Till tomorrow.

Hi Menes:

Good to see you are back.

I checked Investigation Report No. 1 (Pages 14-15) and it didn't show a pill in tissue next to the bed.

There were pills mentioned found in tissue paper in the jewelry box. Would this be the pills you are referring to?

Reply #330 posted 02/23/19 9:06am

Bodhitheblackdog

leec1 said:

Menes said:

If anyone has the time and can let me know which of the pills was the crushed up or half pill in the tissue next to the bed, I would appreciate that very much. Also, were all of the half pills the fentanyl pills ? 'Till tomorrow.

Hi Menes:

Good to see you are back.

I checked Investigation Report No. 1 (Pages 14-15) and it didn't show a pill in tissue next to the bed.

There were pills mentioned found in tissue paper in the jewelry box. Would this be the pills you are referring to?

and, to stir the pot, there was a pill tangled up in his bedding sad

Reply #331 posted 02/23/19 11:06am

Menes

leec1 said:

Menes said:

If anyone has the time and can let me know which of the pills was the crushed up or half pill in the tissue next to the bed, I would appreciate that very much. Also, were all of the half pills the fentanyl pills ? 'Till tomorrow.

Hi Menes:

Good to see you are back.

I checked Investigation Report No. 1 (Pages 14-15) and it didn't show a pill in tissue next to the bed.

There were pills mentioned found in tissue paper in the jewelry box. Would this be the pills you are referring to?

Thanks for the welcome.

I think those are the same pills that were next to bed in his bedroom (possibly in jewelry box next to the bed)? I don't recall where they were exactly. What are those pills in the tissue in the jewelry box ( vicodin, fentanyl)?

Concerning the fentanyl pills w/lidocaine, were some of them halved or were all of them whole?

This will give us a very good idea of dosing as well as whether or not there was an escalation within those 7 days. He should not have been functional at all during those 7 days with such amounts of combined loads right after an overdose. . He should have been out of it. For all practical purposes, dead. Which brings me to the path of trying to make some sense of it all.

I am on to the metabolic rates of each . As I've posted before, there is great suspicion that this was not a random buy, nor a one and off. It seems very calculated.



Reply #332 posted 02/23/19 12:08pm

Menes

Just a quick note.

The amount of hydromorphone (dialudid) reported to be in Prince' system from the test on 4-20 was 87 ng/ml? That is well within range of what is considered capable of producing a fatal concentration. In addition, Hydrocodone, ( vicodin?) is the mixed combination used with the dialudid. I don't see anything that would show the use of percocet (oxycodone-acetaminophen?) although there seems to be pills missing.He must have taken those between the 14th and the 17th and excreted it before the 20th. *More than likely in Atlanta or thereabouts.



The purpose of this study was to identify those cases that would provide the most probative information in hydromorphone-related fatalities, particularly at concentrations less than 100 ng/mL [the lowest reported concentration in a hy- dromorphone-attributed fatality (7)]. The case history and analytical findings for each case were reviewed. Exclusion of cases from the more in depth assessment included the pres- ence of a toxic or fatal drug concentration other than hydro- morphone, collection of a blood sample that was not from an intact blood vessel, cases where histories were incomplete, or if traces (between 7 and 15 ng/mL) of hydromorphone were detected. The number of cases that were excluded was 218.


Results

Between 1985 and 2003, hydromorphone was detected in 251 coroner's death investigation cases (Figure 1). Hydromorphone-positive cases increased in prevalence over the time frame studied and peaked in the final year examined with 63 cases in 2003. There were three years occurring at the beginning of the period studied (1986-1988) where hydro- morphone was not identified in any of the samples analyzed during those years.

Cases (n = 4) where full toxicology drug screening was performed and hydromorphone was the sole drug detected ranged in concentration from 77 to 2684 ng/mL (TableI). Table II lists cases (n = 6) where hydromorphone

and ethanol were the only drugs detected. The hydromorphone concentrations ranged from 65 to 163 ng/mL, whereas blood and urine ethanol concentrations ranged from 0.020 to 0.284 g/100 mLand 0.144to 0.369 g/100 mL, respectively.Cases (n = 22) wheredrugs other than hydromorphone would, in isolation, be considered therapeutic or incidental findings are presented in TableIII. In these cases, the hydromorphone concentrations ranged from 21 to 441 ng/mL.


There's more information but my guess is that fatalities can, and do occur ,at 87ng/ml .

Reply #333 posted 02/23/19 12:09pm

PennyPurple

Image may contain: indoor


No photo description available.


Image may contain: indoor

Reply #334 posted 02/23/19 12:11pm

leec1

Menes said:

leec1 said:

Hi Menes:

Good to see you are back.

I checked Investigation Report No. 1 (Pages 14-15) and it didn't show a pill in tissue next to the bed.

There were pills mentioned found in tissue paper in the jewelry box. Would this be the pills you are referring to?

Thanks for the welcome.

I think those are the same pills that were next to bed in his bedroom (possibly in jewelry box next to the bed)? I don't recall where they were exactly. What are those pills in the tissue in the jewelry box ( vicodin, fentanyl)?

Concerning the fentanyl pills w/lidocaine, were some of them halved or were all of them whole?

This will give us a very good idea of dosing as well as whether or not there was an escalation within those 7 days. He should not have been functional at all during those 7 days with such amounts of combined loads right after an overdose. . He should have been out of it. For all practical purposes, dead. Which brings me to the path of trying to make some sense of it all.

I am on to the metabolic rates of each . As I've posted before, there is great suspicion that this was not a random buy, nor a one and off. It seems very calculated.



I checked the evidence log in Investigation Report No. 1 and then the test results in Investigation Report No. 2 and I find the following.

A. Pills on the nightstand in Bayer bottle totalling 64 1/2 pills stamped Watson 853- these are the pills that are fentanyl and lidocaine that were sent to the DEA to see if they could determine if they had seen similar pills with this composition. The DEA stated they didn't see this pill composition previously but that didn't seem to odd to them because they have experience of finding pills that have been mixed with whatever is available.

B. Pills found in the second floor dressing room in white tissue paper in the jewelry box totalling 15 pills stamped Watson 853- these pills were fentanyl when tested

Reply #335 posted 02/23/19 12:17pm

PennyPurple

Image may contain: one or more people and people sitting


No photo description available.

Image may contain: indoor

Reply #336 posted 02/23/19 12:23pm

PennyPurple

No photo description available.

Reply #337 posted 02/23/19 12:24pm

Menes

leec1 said:

Menes said:

Thanks for the welcome.

I think those are the same pills that were next to bed in his bedroom (possibly in jewelry box next to the bed)? I don't recall where they were exactly. What are those pills in the tissue in the jewelry box ( vicodin, fentanyl)?

Concerning the fentanyl pills w/lidocaine, were some of them halved or were all of them whole?

This will give us a very good idea of dosing as well as whether or not there was an escalation within those 7 days. He should not have been functional at all during those 7 days with such amounts of combined loads right after an overdose. . He should have been out of it. For all practical purposes, dead. Which brings me to the path of trying to make some sense of it all.

I am on to the metabolic rates of each . As I've posted before, there is great suspicion that this was not a random buy, nor a one and off. It seems very calculated.



I checked the evidence log in Investigation Report No. 1 and then the test results in Investigation Report No. 2 and I find the following.

A. Pills on the nightstand in Bayer bottle totalling 64 1/2 pills stamped Watson 853- these are the pills that are fentanyl and lidocaine that were sent to the DEA to see if they could determine if they had seen similar pills with this composition. The DEA stated they didn't see this pill composition previously but that didn't seem to odd to them because they have experience of finding pills that have been mixed with whatever is available.

B. Pills found in the second floor dressing room in white tissue paper in the jewelry box totalling 15 pills stamped Watson 853- these pills were fentanyl when tested

Were any of the fentanyl pills halved? If not, which pills were halved? Dialudid pills maybe?

Reply #338 posted 02/23/19 12:25pm

Menes

PennyPurple said:

48389850_469889503538843_5575815380770750464_n.jpg?_nc_cat=108&_nc_oc=AQlb_FSDJlbCPr1t57uT4skUIHmppR9UKcyDBnU2NNL0jzUu3VLwunaTpQ5aUTtY9lwarOIH4ofCQxxSqJPtU4hE&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-1.xx&oh=b134d408c14e65ee26dfda1c3ff26638&oe=5CEFAEBD

Hi Penny, I assume these are you personal notes? Can you tell me which pills were halved? Thanks.

[Edited 2/23/19 12:32pm]

Reply #339 posted 02/23/19 12:28pm

PennyPurple

No, these are the detective notes, I'll try to find the 1/2 pills though.

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

No photo description available.

Hi Peny, I assume these are you personal notes? Can you tell me which pills were halved? Thanks.

Reply #340 posted 02/23/19 12:29pm

leec1

Menes said:

leec1 said:

I checked the evidence log in Investigation Report No. 1 and then the test results in Investigation Report No. 2 and I find the following.

A. Pills on the nightstand in Bayer bottle totalling 64 1/2 pills stamped Watson 853- these are the pills that are fentanyl and lidocaine that were sent to the DEA to see if they could determine if they had seen similar pills with this composition. The DEA stated they didn't see this pill composition previously but that didn't seem to odd to them because they have experience of finding pills that have been mixed with whatever is available.

B. Pills found in the second floor dressing room in white tissue paper in the jewelry box totalling 15 pills stamped Watson 853- these pills were fentanyl when tested

Were any of the fentanyl pills halved? If not, which pills were halved? Dialudid pills maybe?

The pills in the Bayer bottle were halved which tested to be fentanyl and lidocaine.

Reply #341 posted 02/23/19 12:35pm

Menes

leec1 said:

Menes said:

Were any of the fentanyl pills halved? If not, which pills were halved? Dialudid pills maybe?

The pills in the Bayer bottle were halved which tested to be fentanyl and lidocaine.

Good work, Leec1. So we can assume that he is dosing( at the very least with the fentanyl) and not being indiscriminate about it. Did you find out if any other pill was halved?

Reply #342 posted 02/23/19 12:36pm

PennyPurple

Aleve bottle 20 1/2 marked Watson 853

Bayer Bottle 64 1/4 marked Watson 853

15 whole pills in jewelry box marked Watson 853

Reply #343 posted 02/23/19 12:37pm

Menes

PennyPurple said:

No, these are the detective notes, I'll try to find the 1/2 pills though.

Menes said:

Hi Peny, I assume these are you personal notes? Can you tell me which pills were halved? Thanks.

Oh, sorry. Thought those were yours. I think Leec1 answered the question. Would still like to know if they were any other half pill that were not fentanyl/lidocaine. This wlil be a very important clue.

Reply #344 posted 02/23/19 12:40pm

PennyPurple

No photo description available.

Reply #345 posted 02/23/19 12:46pm

Menes

PennyPurple said:

Aleve bottle 20 1/2 marked Watson 853

Bayer Bottle 64 1/4 marked Watson 853

15 whole pills in jewelry box marked Watson 853

So, the bayer bottle ( fenatanyl /lidocaine) is halved.

The 15 pills ( fentanyl only, or fentanyl/lidocaine) were halved?

And the pills in the Aleve contain what ? Are they half as well?

[Edited 2/23/19 12:47pm]

Reply #346 posted 02/23/19 12:49pm

PennyPurple

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

Aleve bottle 20 1/2 marked Watson 853

Bayer Bottle 64 1/4 marked Watson 853

15 whole pills in jewelry box marked Watson 853

So, the bayer bottle ( fenatanyl /lidocaine) is halved.

The 15 pills ( fentanyl only, or fentanyl/lidocaine) were halved?

And the pills in the Aleve contain what ? Are they half as well?

[Edited 2/23/19 12:47pm]

No the jewelry box 15 were whole

Aleve bottle 20 whole pills & 1/2 of a pill

Bayer 64 whole pills and 1/4 of a pill

[Edited 2/23/19 12:51pm]

Reply #347 posted 02/23/19 12:52pm

Menes

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

So, the bayer bottle ( fenatanyl /lidocaine) is halved.

The 15 pills ( fentanyl only, or fentanyl/lidocaine) were halved?

And the pills in the Aleve contain what ? Are they half as well?

[Edited 2/23/19 12:47pm]

No the jewelry box 15 were whole

Aleve bottle 20 & 1/2

Bayer 64 and 1/4

So the aleve is all fent, correct? Were there any other pills beside the fentanyl/lidocaine pills that were half? Thanks for helping out.

Reply #348 posted 02/23/19 12:54pm

PennyPurple

Menes said:

PennyPurple said:

No the jewelry box 15 were whole

Aleve bottle 20 & 1/2

Bayer 64 and 1/4

So the aleve is all fent, correct? Were there any other pills beside the fentanyl/lidocaine pills that were half? Thanks for helping out.

I'll have to go thru all that again, it will take some time I will probably have time tonight.

Reply #349 posted 02/23/19 1:01pm

Menes

PennyPurple said:

Menes said:

So the aleve is all fent, correct? Were there any other pills beside the fentanyl/lidocaine pills that were half? Thanks for helping out.

I'll have to go thru all that again, it will take some time I will probably have time tonight.

Take your time. No rush at all. We are going to figure this out. Lots to work with.

Reply #350 posted 02/23/19 1:06pm

leec1

Menes said:

leec1 said:

The pills in the Bayer bottle were halved which tested to be fentanyl and lidocaine.

Good work, Leec1. So we can assume that he is dosing( at the very least with the fentanyl) and not being indiscriminate about it. Did you find out if any other pill was halved?

The pills in the Aleve bottle on the night stand totaling 20 pills were also halved. The pills were marked as Watson 853 but they tested to be fentanyl.

Reply #351 posted 02/23/19 1:21pm

Menes

leec1 said:

Menes said:

Good work, Leec1. So we can assume that he is dosing( at the very least with the fentanyl) and not being indiscriminate about it. Did you find out if any other pill was halved?

The pills in the Aleve bottle on the night stand totaling 20 pills were also halved. The pills were marked as Watson 853 but they tested to be fentanyl.

Well, well, well. One thing left. Any other pill in that house was found to be half of itself? Very very important if you can find that.

Reply #352 posted 02/23/19 1:28pm

Bodhitheblackdog

leec1 said:

Menes said:

Good work, Leec1. So we can assume that he is dosing( at the very least with the fentanyl) and not being indiscriminate about it. Did you find out if any other pill was halved?

The pills in the Aleve bottle on the night stand totaling 20 pills were also halved. The pills were marked as Watson 853 but they tested to be fentanyl.

ON FIRE!!! grouphug

Reply #353 posted 02/23/19 1:45pm

leec1

Menes said:

leec1 said:

The pills in the Aleve bottle on the night stand totaling 20 pills were also halved. The pills were marked as Watson 853 but they tested to be fentanyl.

Well, well, well. One thing left. Any other pill in that house was found to be half of itself? Very very important if you can find that.

The only other halved pills I saw were 3 halved pills located in Room 6 in the black suitcase. There were 49 whole pills and 3 halved pills in this black suitcase and they were marked Watson 853.

I also just noticed that in the handwritten notes of the detective when they collected evidence that the pills in the Bayer bottle were described as 1/4 pills. However in the typewritten Investigation Files Reports Nos. 1 and 2 the pills in the Bayer bottle are described as 1/2 pills.

Reply #354 posted 02/23/19 2:26pm

Menes

leec1 said:

Menes said:

Well, well, well. One thing left. Any other pill in that house was found to be half of itself? Very very important if you can find that.

The only other halved pills I saw were 3 halved pills located in Room 6 in the black suitcase. There were 49 whole pills and 3 halved pills in this black suitcase and they were marked Watson 853.

I also just noticed that in the handwritten notes of the detective when they collected evidence that the pills in the Bayer bottle were described as 1/4 pills. However in the typewritten Investigation Files Reports Nos. 1 and 2 the pills in the Bayer bottle are described as 1/2 pills.

Those (3) halved pills in room (6) that were located in the black suitcase... Did they state whether or not they are the same as the fentanyl/lidocaine pills in composition?

I am assuming that this is not the "black bag" carried off the plane by Kirk when they were in Moline , correct?

Reply #355 posted 02/23/19 3:20pm

nelcp777

Menes said:

 



leec1 said:


 



Menes said:


 


Well, well, well. One thing left. Any other pill in that house was found to be half of itself? Very very important if you can find that. 



The only other halved pills I saw were 3 halved pills located in Room 6 in the black suitcase.  There were 49 whole pills and 3 halved pills in this black suitcase and they were marked Watson 853.


 


I also just noticed that in the handwritten notes of the detective when they collected evidence that the pills in the Bayer bottle were described as 1/4 pills.  However in the typewritten Investigation Files Reports Nos. 1 and 2 the pills in the Bayer bottle are described as 1/2 pills.



Those (3) halved pills in room (6) that were located in the black suitcase... Did they state whether or not they are the same as the fentanyl/lidocaine pills in composition?

 I am assuming that this is not the "black bag" carried off the plane by Kirk when they were in Moline , correct? 


Percocets were fond in 4 half pills.
Reply #356 posted 02/23/19 3:43pm

Bodhitheblackdog

nelcp777 said:

Menes said:

Those (3) halved pills in room (6) that were located in the black suitcase... Did they state whether or not they are the same as the fentanyl/lidocaine pills in composition?

I am assuming that this is not the "black bag" carried off the plane by Kirk when they were in Moline , correct?

Percocets were fond in 4 half pills.

It sounds like he wasn't so far gone into his addiction that he was barely able to walk around PP when he was alone....not to mention ride his bike for a short while and throw a little party...BECAUSE he was totally aware that the percosets and his custom made Fent/ lidocaine combo were the deadly ones...

He was willing to cut the most powerful pills in half because he totally knew how the OD trip went.(I wonder how many times Kirk carried an unconscious Prince in his arms to get help) and that's why he wasn't afraid about doing what he wanted to do his last day. He knew exactly what he was doing, in control to the end.

Reply #357 posted 02/23/19 3:48pm

leec1

Menes said:

leec1 said:

The only other halved pills I saw were 3 halved pills located in Room 6 in the black suitcase. There were 49 whole pills and 3 halved pills in this black suitcase and they were marked Watson 853.

I also just noticed that in the handwritten notes of the detective when they collected evidence that the pills in the Bayer bottle were described as 1/4 pills. However in the typewritten Investigation Files Reports Nos. 1 and 2 the pills in the Bayer bottle are described as 1/2 pills.

Those (3) halved pills in room (6) that were located in the black suitcase... Did they state whether or not they are the same as the fentanyl/lidocaine pills in composition?

I am assuming that this is not the "black bag" carried off the plane by Kirk when they were in Moline , correct?

I haven't been able to locate any information yet on the testing of the pills in the black suitcase. These pills were in Room 6. This is not the black bag from Moline.

Reply #358 posted 02/23/19 4:23pm

rednblue

Bodhitheblackdog said:

nelcp777 said:

Menes said: Percocets were fond in 4 half pills.

It sounds like he wasn't so far gone into his addiction that he was barely able to walk around PP when he was alone....not to mention ride his bike for a short while and throw a little party...BECAUSE he was totally aware that the percosets and his custom made Fent/ lidocaine combo were the deadly ones...

He was willing to cut the most powerful pills in half because he totally knew how the OD trip went.(I wonder how many times Kirk carried an unconscious Prince in his arms to get help) and that's why he wasn't afraid about doing what he wanted to do his last day. He knew exactly what he was doing, in control to the end.


It's almost universal that when it comes to where people want to be in life, the extent to which they are able to control how close to that targeted place they actually are, varies enormously over a lifetime.

At times, people do make controlled, conscious choices from a set of difficult, highly imperfect options.

I guess what I'm trying (not finding good words) to say is that although "successful control" varies from person to person, most everyone has times when they have some control, times when they have little control, and times when they're quite well in control.

Bodhi, if you don't mind my asking...

Do you think that the substance dose P was at times on, over his last decade, was the path and place he targeted, his choice path out of all the paths he could possibly have taken over that decade?

Reply #359 posted 02/23/19 4:28pm

Menes

nelcp777 said:

Menes said:

Those (3) halved pills in room (6) that were located in the black suitcase... Did they state whether or not they are the same as the fentanyl/lidocaine pills in composition?

I am assuming that this is not the "black bag" carried off the plane by Kirk when they were in Moline , correct?

Percocets were fond in 4 half pills.

Ok, so we really have to nail this down as much as the report will allow because there are some competing information here. In reply #316, I think the numbers you came up with might be slightly off . In reply# 256, ISaidlife, may have a slightly different take on the numbers as it relates to the percocets. Maybe both are saying the same thing? I'm not sure. Can you check that and clarify for accuracy?

The numbes are critical and relevant to how much was taken and when. Thanks.

Reply #360 posted 02/23/19 4:30pm

Menes

leec1 said:

Menes said:

Those (3) halved pills in room (6) that were located in the black suitcase... Did they state whether or not they are the same as the fentanyl/lidocaine pills in composition?

I am assuming that this is not the "black bag" carried off the plane by Kirk when they were in Moline , correct?

I haven't been able to locate any information yet on the testing of the pills in the black suitcase. These pills were in Room 6. This is not the black bag from Moline.

Right. We def. need that information ( suitcase)as well as what was in the "bag" to tie things together.

Reply #361 posted 02/23/19 4:34pm

rednblue

Thanks to everyone for their efforts! I can't begin to imagine the time it would take to go through and organize all these details!

The level of denial and other toxic stuff on the first few threads...shudder.

These days everyone may not (of course) be in agreement, but it works out so much better.

Thanks all, and thanks June7!

Reply #362 posted 02/23/19 4:37pm

Menes

rednblue said:

Thanks to everyone for their efforts! I can't begin to imagine the time it would take to go through and organize all these details!

The level of denial and other toxic stuff on the first few threads...shudder.

These days everyone may not (of course) be in agreement, but it works out so much better.

Thanks all, and thanks June7!

Stay tuned! There's more to come.

Reply #363 posted 02/23/19 4:43pm

rednblue

Menes said:

rednblue said:

Thanks to everyone for their efforts! I can't begin to imagine the time it would take to go through and organize all these details!

The level of denial and other toxic stuff on the first few threads...shudder.

These days everyone may not (of course) be in agreement, but it works out so much better.

Thanks all, and thanks June7!

Stay tuned! There's more to come.


Thanks, Menes!

Reply #364 posted 02/23/19 4:48pm

Bodhitheblackdog

rednblue said:

Bodhitheblackdog said:

It sounds like he wasn't so far gone into his addiction that he was barely able to walk around PP when he was alone....not to mention ride his bike for a short while and throw a little party...BECAUSE he was totally aware that the percosets and his custom made Fent/ lidocaine combo were the deadly ones...

He was willing to cut the most powerful pills in half because he totally knew how the OD trip went.(I wonder how many times Kirk carried an unconscious Prince in his arms to get help) and that's why he wasn't afraid about doing what he wanted to do his last day. He knew exactly what he was doing, in control to the end.


It's almost universal that when it comes to where people want to be in life, the extent to which they are able to control how close to that targeted place they actually are, varies enormously over a lifetime.

At times, people do make controlled, conscious choices from a set of difficult, highly imperfect options.

I guess what I'm trying (not finding good words) to say is that although "successful control" varies from person to person, most everyone has times when they have some control, times when they have little control, and times when they're quite well in control.

Bodhi, if you don't mind my asking...

Do you think that the substance dose P was at times on, over his last decade, was the path and place he targeted, his choice path out of all the paths he could possibly have taken over that decade?

What a deep and thoughtful question. Of course, it was what it was...and everything happens by itself and no one can ever totally know anothers' journey and soul. Having stated the obvious; I don't think people consciously CHOOSE addiction though they may dream of, long for and take risks to alleviate their physical, emotional and/or spiritual pain. And then you wake up one morning (or in Prince's case, a late afternoon) and you gotta have it and your life is forevermore dfferent.

I also believe, in Prince's case (and he was not alone, by any metric): celebrity and wealth replace healthier guardrails that help us on our journey. Add to this mix pride, lack of an intimate family life, hangers-on rather than true friends, ageing out of your most beautiful form, and your career(your lifes' work and total identity) begins evolving in a manner that maybe you didn't see coming. Maybe you had planned to play your guitar until the end.

You lost your wives, your son, your parents, Denise...just like each and every one of us experience loss...but you're PRINCE. I think he was more emotionally delicate, wounded and fragile than any of us knew. It wasn't about his hips.

[Edited 2/23/19 16:55pm]

Reply #365 posted 02/23/19 5:45pm

leec1

Menes said:

leec1 said:

I haven't been able to locate any information yet on the testing of the pills in the black suitcase. These pills were in Room 6. This is not the black bag from Moline.

Right. We def. need that information ( suitcase)as well as what was in the "bag" to tie things together.

I went back and reviewed the 2 investigation files and can advise the following as relates to testing that was done by the DEA.

1.Aleve bottle-correction to what I stated previously, this bottle contained lidocaine- a synthetic version

2. Pills in black suitcase- it states "one of the pills was tested" and it contained fentanyl and lidocaine

3. Black bag- it had 1 pill which wa oxycodone-acetaminophen 10/325

Reply #366 posted 02/23/19 6:06pm

PennyPurple

I think if Prince set himself on this path, he would have been on the hardcore stuff. Oxycontin.

Percocets and Vicodins are childs play compared to Oxycontin.

Reply #367 posted 02/23/19 6:16pm

leec1

PennyPurple said:

I think if Prince set himself on this path, he would have been on the hardcore stuff. Oxycontin.

Percocets and Vicodins are childs play compared to Oxycontin.

Oxycodone is oxycontin. He had 1 pill in the black bag found in his bedroom. Is it possible he was starting to progress to oxycontin?

Reply #368 posted 02/23/19 6:19pm

rednblue

Bodhitheblackdog said:

rednblue said:


It's almost universal that when it comes to where people want to be in life, the extent to which they are able to control how close to that targeted place they actually are, varies enormously over a lifetime.

At times, people do make controlled, conscious choices from a set of difficult, highly imperfect options.

I guess what I'm trying (not finding good words) to say is that although "successful control" varies from person to person, most everyone has times when they have some control, times when they have little control, and times when they're quite well in control.

Bodhi, if you don't mind my asking...

Do you think that the substance dose P was at times on, over his last decade, was the path and place he targeted, his choice path out of all the paths he could possibly have taken over that decade?

What a deep and thoughtful question. Of course, it was what it was...and everything happens by itself and no one can ever totally know anothers' journey and soul. Having stated the obvious; I don't think people consciously CHOOSE addiction though they may dream of, long for and take risks to alleviate their physical, emotional and/or spiritual pain. And then you wake up one morning (or in Prince's case, a late afternoon) and you gotta have it and your life is forevermore dfferent.

I also believe, in Prince's case (and he was not alone, by any metric): celebrity and wealth replace healthier guardrails that help us on our journey. Add to this mix pride, lack of an intimate family life, hangers-on rather than true friends, ageing out of your most beautiful form, and your career(your lifes' work and total identity) begins evolving in a manner that maybe you didn't see coming. Maybe you had planned to play your guitar until the end.

You lost your wives, your son, your parents, Denise...just like each and every one of us experience loss...but you're PRINCE. I think he was more emotionally delicate, wounded and fragile than any of us knew. It wasn't about his hips.

[Edited 2/23/19 16:55pm]


Thank you, Bodhi!

Many illnesses can take a lot of control away from a person. There are reasonable treatments for some illnesses. For others, not so much.

Now that I've stated the obvious : ), I'll add that I sometimes speculate that there was a lot of internal and external pressure on P to be/appear in control. I hope he knew that, should he appear to struggle with control, his fans would not go away. Fan passion would be there in spades! P's fans would send him this message in a heartbeat. We had no idea what he was going through.

Thank you for your beautiful words, here and in the past, on the perils of celebrity.

Beyond that, I want to bold everything you wrote above. Thank you for all of your beautiful words!

Reply #369 posted 02/23/19 6:21pm

rednblue

PennyPurple said:

I think if Prince set himself on this path, he would have been on the hardcore stuff. Oxycontin.

Percocets and Vicodins are childs play compared to Oxycontin.


Thank you!

Reply #370 posted 02/23/19 6:34pm

Menes

leec1 said:

Menes said:

Right. We def. need that information ( suitcase)as well as what was in the "bag" to tie things together.

I went back and reviewed the 2 investigation files and can advise the following as relates to testing that was done by the DEA.

1.Aleve bottle-correction to what I stated previously, this bottle contained lidocaine- a synthetic version

2. Pills in black suitcase- it states "one of the pills was tested" and it contained fentanyl and lidocaine

3. Black bag- it had 1 pill which wa oxycodone-acetaminophen 10/325

Now that looks about right based upon my recollection. I am hoping that all of the information I have read , coupled with the information provided by the many posters such as yourself, is as accurate as can be. We have been flying blind at night for too long (at least I have). It is time to put in some serious work. It's gonna take me a bit of time but I am going to try and figure this out, come hell or high water.



I intend to calculate raw scientific data, time , metabolic rates , excretion times, dosage amounts , drug interactions, and anything else I can think of for that (7) day period to explain this madness that culminated in a sudden death.

I feel that Prince either researched the same data or was provided insight into the world of how to balance opiate usage/addiction in his everyday life for quite some time. (7) days is a very short period of time to , for all intents and purposes, intentionally ingest various substances that should have killed him thrice.

I also intend on remaining open to criticism, correction and dialogue that may support any other findings.

Last time I embarked upon this journey, a certain other half in my house threatened to ration the puss until my obsession had vanquish. Tough luck bitch. I plan on investing in a shopping spree @ Neiman Marcus after its all said and done, lest I am permanently cut off.

"This is a man's world, but it wouldn't be nothing...

Reply #371 posted 02/23/19 8:29pm

PennyPurple

leec1 said:

PennyPurple said:

I think if Prince set himself on this path, he would have been on the hardcore stuff. Oxycontin.

Percocets and Vicodins are childs play compared to Oxycontin.

Oxycodone is oxycontin. He had 1 pill in the black bag found in his bedroom. Is it possible he was starting to progress to oxycontin?

Oxycontin is pure, no tylenol and a lot stronger then what he was on, except for the fentanyl.

Reply #372 posted 02/23/19 10:01pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

BCI Drug Analysis



-Aleve bottle on nightstand. 21.5 marked Watson 853 contained Lidocaine only


-Script in suitcase in P's bedroom with Kirk's name contained 10 Oxycodone

-Bayer bottle found on nightstand contained 64.5 marked Watson 853 was Fentanyl/Lidocaine

-Pills in tissue in jewelry box contained 15 marked Watson 853 was Fentanyl/Lidocaine

-1 Yellow pill found inside black bag on P's bed and seen in hospital surveillance video from Moline was Oxycodone

-Vitamin C in suitcase in P's bedroom ID tag Peter Bravestrong contained 49 and 3 1/2 marked Watson 853 was Fentanyl/Lidocaine

-Script in Kirk's name from Dr. Boo found in dumpster contained 10 Codeine pills.

-Another Vitamin C bottle found in duffle bag in P's bedroom contained a mixture of 54 pills - Lidocaine only, Hydrocodone only.

-CVC Pharmacy bottle found in the bag ID as Peter Bravestrong contained 27 pills that contained Fentanyl/Lidocaine


[Edited 2/23/19 22:33pm]

Reply #373 posted 02/24/19 5:22am

leec1

Menes said:

leec1 said:

I went back and reviewed the 2 investigation files and can advise the following as relates to testing that was done by the DEA.

1.Aleve bottle-correction to what I stated previously, this bottle contained lidocaine- a synthetic version

2. Pills in black suitcase- it states "one of the pills was tested" and it contained fentanyl and lidocaine

3. Black bag- it had 1 pill which wa oxycodone-acetaminophen 10/325

Now that looks about right based upon my recollection. I am hoping that all of the information I have read , coupled with the information provided by the many posters such as yourself, is as accurate as can be. We have been flying blind at night for too long (at least I have). It is time to put in some serious work. It's gonna take me a bit of time but I am going to try and figure this out, come hell or high water.



I intend to calculate raw scientific data, time , metabolic rates , excretion times, dosage amounts , drug interactions, and anything else I can think of for that (7) day period to explain this madness that culminated in a sudden death.

I feel that Prince either researched the same data or was provided insight into the world of how to balance opiate usage/addiction in his everyday life for quite some time. (7) days is a very short period of time to , for all intents and purposes, intentionally ingest various substances that should have killed him thrice.

I also intend on remaining open to criticism, correction and dialogue that may support any other findings.

Last time I embarked upon this journey, a certain other half in my house threatened to ration the puss until my obsession had vanquish. Tough luck bitch. I plan on investing in a shopping spree @ Neiman Marcus after its all said and done, lest I am permanently cut off.

"This is a man's world, but it wouldn't be nothing...



So you feel comfortable that the information is correct that I have listed, you can double check the data as it is located in Folder 5- Investigation Report Number 2, Pages 66 and 67 which shows the DEA lab results.

Reply #374 posted 02/24/19 5:36am

leec1

PennyPurple said:

leec1 said:

Oxycodone is oxycontin. He had 1 pill in the black bag found in his bedroom. Is it possible he was starting to progress to oxycontin?

Oxycontin is pure, no tylenol and a lot stronger then what he was on, except for the fentanyl.

The description of many drugs can become confusing so I checked with the site of the

National Library of Medicine. The link is below. There are various versions of Oxycodone. The following sentences are from the National Library article.

"Oxycodone is also available in combination with acetaminophen (Oxycet, Percocet, Roxicet, Xartemis XR, others); aspirin (Percodan); and ibuprofen."

"Oxycodone comes as a solution (liquid), a concentrated solution, a tablet, a capsule, an extended-release (long-acting) tablet (Oxycontin) and an extended-release capsule (Xtampza ER) to take by mouth."


The link is:

https://medlineplus.gov/druginfo/meds/a682132.html

Reply #375 posted 02/24/19 7:10am

PennyPurple

leec1 said:

PennyPurple said:

Oxycontin is pure, no tylenol and a lot stronger then what he was on, except for the fentanyl.

The description of many drugs can become confusing so I checked with the site of the

National Library of Medicine. The link is below. There are various versions of Oxycodone. The following sentences are from the National Library article.

"Oxycodone is also available in combination with acetaminophen (Oxycet, Percocet, Roxicet, Xartemis XR, others); aspirin (Percodan); and ibuprofen."

"Oxycodone comes as a solution (liquid), a concentrated solution, a tablet, a capsule, an extended-release (long-acting) tablet (Oxycontin) and an extended-release capsule (Xtampza ER) to take by mouth."


The link is:

https://medlineplus.gov/druginfo/meds/a682132.html

Thanks Lee, I was going to do some research last night but got sidetracked.

Reply #376 posted 02/25/19 11:42am

1Sasha

Thank you so much to the people who are examining the evidence in Prince's case. There are so many of us who still care deeply about him.

Reply #377 posted 02/25/19 5:54pm

XxAxX

1Sasha said:

Thank you so much to the people who are examining the evidence in Prince's case. There are so many of us who still care deeply about him.

ditto that. something feels off. just those pictures of pills stuck and scattered everywhere seems off. disorganized and not in character

Reply #378 posted 02/26/19 12:48am

June7

Moderator

moderator

ladygirl99 said:

 



leec1 said:


 



ladygirl99 said:


The question is why this thread, not a sticky but other threads that get fewer views and fewer posts are.


 


This thread should be a permanent sticky imo as it still gotten over 20000 even at Part 13. 


 


But if this question is answered before I do apologize.



 


I don't recall ever seeing a response to the question why isn't this thread a sticky as I do remember this question being asked previously.



I orgnote June7 about this question. I hope he replies on here or I would received a reply from him. 



[I responded via .orgnote - feel free to repost if you wish. - June7]
[PRINCE 4EVER!]

[June7, "ModGod"]
Reply #379 posted 02/27/19 7:58pm

nelcp777

So if Kirk did clean PP with good intentions, he may have inadvertently caused P to take the fentanyl pills. It may also explain why dialude was not found.
Reply #380 posted 02/27/19 9:21pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

nelcp777 said:

So if Kirk did clean PP with good intentions, he may have inadvertently caused P to take the fentanyl pills. It may also explain why dialude was not found.



We don't know whether Kirk was permitted into P's private quarters, and Kirk may have just cleaned the common areas.

Reply #381 posted 02/28/19 8:08am

peggyon

I wanted to touch on the topic of opiate tolerance. It was mentioned several posts ago that Prince had taken an unusually large amount of Hydrocodone (Vicodin) and Hydromorphone (Dilaudid) in the days following Moline as evidenced by his high blood levels. For most of us, this blood level would have been fatal. Prince, though,clearly had a high tolerance to opiates. (This was shown, also, by the significant amount of Narcan it required to reverse the opiates in his system.)

Though his blood level (after Moline), showed significantly high levels of opiates, it was not enough as he was showing signs of withdrawal on 4/20, ie., feeling 'antsy', having fine tremors, Kirl's comments about showing signs of WD etc.

This tells me he was used to much higher levels of opiates to feel comfortable. I think he may have been taking Fentanyl pre-Moline, or certainly higher doses of Oxycodone (Perc) and Dilaudid.

Though I am only surmising, I do not think he would have wanted Fentanyl to show in his blood work on 4/20 as it would have indicated a very extreme addiction. He may not have taken it after Moline as he had promised blood tests and may have known it would clear his system by then.

Reply #382 posted 02/28/19 8:41am

rednblue

peggyon said:

I wanted to touch on the topic of opiate tolerance. It was mentioned several posts ago that Prince had taken an unusually large amount of Hydrocodone (Vicodin) and Hydromorphone (Dilaudid) in the days following Moline as evidenced by his high blood levels. For most of us, this blood level would have been fatal. Prince, though,clearly had a high tolerance to opiates. (This was shown, also, by the significant amount of Narcan it required to reverse the opiates in his system.)


 


 Though his blood level (after Moline), showed significantly high levels of opiates, it was not enough as he was showing signs of withdrawal on 4/20, ie., feeling 'antsy', having fine tremors, Kirl's comments about showing signs of WD etc.


 


This tells me he was used to much higher levels of opiates to feel comfortable. I think he may have been taking Fentanyl pre-Moline, or certainly higher doses of Oxycodone (Perc) and Dilaudid. 


 


Though I am only surmising, I do not think he would have wanted Fentanyl to show in his blood work on 4/20 as it would have indicated a very extreme addiction. He may not have taken it after Moline as he had promised blood tests and may have known it would clear his system by then.


 



Thank you, peggyon! Questions about people’s current tolerance, and effect on fatal dose, have been rattling around in my head, so really appreciate you posting. Missed you!
Reply #383 posted 02/28/19 9:17am

peggyon

biggrin

rednblue said:

peggyon said:

I wanted to touch on the topic of opiate tolerance. It was mentioned several posts ago that Prince had taken an unusually large amount of Hydrocodone (Vicodin) and Hydromorphone (Dilaudid) in the days following Moline as evidenced by his high blood levels. For most of us, this blood level would have been fatal. Prince, though,clearly had a high tolerance to opiates. (This was shown, also, by the significant amount of Narcan it required to reverse the opiates in his system.)

Though his blood level (after Moline), showed significantly high levels of opiates, it was not enough as he was showing signs of withdrawal on 4/20, ie., feeling 'antsy', having fine tremors, Kirl's comments about showing signs of WD etc.

This tells me he was used to much higher levels of opiates to feel comfortable. I think he may have been taking Fentanyl pre-Moline, or certainly higher doses of Oxycodone (Perc) and Dilaudid.

Though I am only surmising, I do not think he would have wanted Fentanyl to show in his blood work on 4/20 as it would have indicated a very extreme addiction. He may not have taken it after Moline as he had promised blood tests and may have known it would clear his system by then.

Thank you, peggyon! Questions about people’s current tolerance, and effect on fatal dose, have been rattling around in my head, so really appreciate you posting. Missed you!

Reply #384 posted 02/28/19 9:28am

peggyon

A story about tolerance. The other day, while rounding with one of the MD's, we met with a patient who was in withdrawal from alcohol though his blood alcohol level was 4 x the legal limit!

His body was used to such large amounts of alcohol that he would withdraw while at a really high blood alcohol level. Withdrawal is relative to what the body is used to.

I sense Prince was really limping along taking way less than his usual doses until his blood test 4/20, though we are aghast at the levels. He was likely doing 'damage control' here as well. Did the best he could; really needed medical assistance.

The recent interview with Gayle Chapman (towards the end of the second interview) is enlightening.

She seemed very down- to- earth and somewhat detached from the 'whole Prince thing', so I tended to believe her. She talks about his decision to do it 'his way' without the usual controls that most of us mere mortals have.

Reply #385 posted 02/28/19 9:38am

PennyPurple

eek Peggy!! I've missed you!! Welcome back.

Reply #386 posted 02/28/19 9:47am

peggyon

PennyPurple said:

eek Peggy!! I've missed you!! Welcome back.

Thanks, Penny.

Reply #387 posted 02/28/19 10:53am

Bodhitheblackdog

PennyPurple said:

eek Peggy!! I've missed you!! Welcome back.

DITTO! biggrin

Reply #388 posted 02/28/19 11:01am

peggyon

Bodhitheblackdog said:

PennyPurple said:

eek Peggy!! I've missed you!! Welcome back.

DITTO! biggrin

Thanks, Bodhi

Reply #389 posted 02/28/19 11:57am

nelcp777

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

nelcp777 said:

So if Kirk did clean PP with good intentions, he may have inadvertently caused P to take the fentanyl pills. It may also explain why dialude was not found.



We don't know whether Kirk was permitted into P's private quarters, and Kirk may have just cleaned the common areas.

True. I may be reading more into Manuela's statement to law enforcement. But Her saying Kirk looked in the bag and did not find the bottles made me think Kirk was in the private quarters.

Kirk would have had to access it when Prince was not around and the day of the 20th. I say the 20th, cos we know that dialud was in his system.

Reply #390 posted 02/28/19 12:42pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

nelcp777 said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



We don't know whether Kirk was permitted into P's private quarters, and Kirk may have just cleaned the common areas.

True. I may be reading more into Manuela's statement to law enforcement. But Her saying Kirk looked in the bag and did not find the bottles made me think Kirk was in the private quarters.

Kirk would have had to access it when Prince was not around and the day of the 20th. I say the 20th, cos we know that dialud was in his system.



Well, M2 also said she had the name of P's drug dealer and that didnt pan out.

I have found several articles that discusses hydrocodone metabolizing to hydromorphone in urine. So it may vey well be P didnt take dilaudid.

Here are links to two articles:



https://academic.oup.com/jat/article/36/4/257/806349

https://www.practicalpainmanagement.com/treatments/pharmacological/opioids/why-there-hydromorphone-patient-urine

Reply #391 posted 02/28/19 1:45pm

rednblue

peggyon said:

A story about tolerance. The other day, while rounding with one of the MD's, we met with a patient who was in withdrawal from alcohol though his blood alcohol level was 4 x the legal limit!

His body was used to such large amounts of alcohol that he would withdraw while at a really high blood alcohol level. Withdrawal is relative to what the body is used to.

I sense Prince was really limping along taking way less than his usual doses until his blood test 4/20, though we are aghast at the levels. He was likely doing 'damage control' here as well. Did the best he could; really needed medical assistance.

The recent interview with Gayle Chapman (towards the end of the second interview) is enlightening.

She seemed very down- to- earth and somewhat detached from the 'whole Prince thing', so I tended to believe her. She talks about his decision to do it 'his way' without the usual controls that most of us mere mortals have.


In withdrawal at 4x the legal limit. What a story! Hope that person's story gets easier, and thank you for noting this: "Withdrawal is relative to what the body is used to."

Enjoy hearing from Gayle Chapman. Agree that she seems down to earth, and like her sense of humor. She can be so funny!

Hope to get time soon to listen to her "Truth in Rhythm" interviews from Funknstuff.net. Peggy -- Are those the ones that you describe above?

Reply #392 posted 02/28/19 1:49pm

peggyon

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

nelcp777 said:

True. I may be reading more into Manuela's statement to law enforcement. But Her saying Kirk looked in the bag and did not find the bottles made me think Kirk was in the private quarters.

Kirk would have had to access it when Prince was not around and the day of the 20th. I say the 20th, cos we know that dialud was in his system.



Well, M2 also said she had the name of P's drug dealer and that didnt pan out.

I have found several articles that discusses hydrocodone metabolizing to hydromorphone in urine. So it may vey well be P didnt take dilaudid.

Here are links to two articles:



https://academic.oup.com/jat/article/36/4/257/806349

https://www.practicalpainmanagement.com/treatments/pharmacological/opioids/why-there-hydromorphone-patient-urine

I forget, did he undergo a urine or blood test on 4/20?

A blood test should delineate which type of opiate was present.

My concern about Vicodin alone is that it is fairly weak and I think Prince needed stronger opiates at that time, especially if he required that much Narcan for reversal.

Also, Vicodin has acetomeniphen which addicts shy away from as it is toxic to the liver

[Edited 2/28/19 13:57pm]

Reply #393 posted 02/28/19 1:51pm

peggyon

rednblue said:

peggyon said:

A story about tolerance. The other day, while rounding with one of the MD's, we met with a patient who was in withdrawal from alcohol though his blood alcohol level was 4 x the legal limit!

His body was used to such large amounts of alcohol that he would withdraw while at a really high blood alcohol level. Withdrawal is relative to what the body is used to.

I sense Prince was really limping along taking way less than his usual doses until his blood test 4/20, though we are aghast at the levels. He was likely doing 'damage control' here as well. Did the best he could; really needed medical assistance.

The recent interview with Gayle Chapman (towards the end of the second interview) is enlightening.

She seemed very down- to- earth and somewhat detached from the 'whole Prince thing', so I tended to believe her. She talks about his decision to do it 'his way' without the usual controls that most of us mere mortals have.


In withdrawal at 4x the legal limit. What a story! Hope that person's story gets easier, and thank you for noting this: "Withdrawal is relative to what the body is used to."

Enjoy hearing from Gayle Chapman. Agree that she seems down to earth, and like her sense of humor. She can be so funny!

Hope to get time soon to listen to her "Truth in Rhythm" interviews from Funknstuff.net. Peggy -- Are those the ones that you describe above?

The interview is present in the Associated Artists forum. It seems to be fairly recent.

Reply #394 posted 02/28/19 2:03pm

rednblue

peggyon said:

rednblue said:


In withdrawal at 4x the legal limit. What a story! Hope that person's story gets easier, and thank you for noting this: "Withdrawal is relative to what the body is used to."

Enjoy hearing from Gayle Chapman. Agree that she seems down to earth, and like her sense of humor. She can be so funny!

Hope to get time soon to listen to her "Truth in Rhythm" interviews from Funknstuff.net. Peggy -- Are those the ones that you describe above?

The interview is present in the Associated Artists forum. It seems to be fairly recent.


Hope to listen in next day or two. Thanks!

Reply #395 posted 02/28/19 4:10pm

PennyPurple

He had both tests done on the 20th. The UA Dr S had the results for the next morning that he was taking to PP, the bloodwork hadn't came back yet, at the time Dr. S was at PP.

peggyon said:

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:



Well, M2 also said she had the name of P's drug dealer and that didnt pan out.

I have found several articles that discusses hydrocodone metabolizing to hydromorphone in urine. So it may vey well be P didnt take dilaudid.

Here are links to two articles:



https://academic.oup.com/jat/article/36/4/257/806349

https://www.practicalpainmanagement.com/treatments/pharmacological/opioids/why-there-hydromorphone-patient-urine

I forget, did he undergo a urine or blood test on 4/20?

A blood test should delineate which type of opiate was present.

My concern about Vicodin alone is that it is fairly weak and I think Prince needed stronger opiates at that time, especially if he required that much Narcan for reversal.

Also, Vicodin has acetomeniphen which addicts shy away from as it is toxic to the liver

[Edited 2/28/19 13:57pm]

Reply #396 posted 02/28/19 4:36pm

peggyon

PennyPurple said:

He had both tests done on the 20th. The UA Dr S had the results for the next morning that he was taking to PP, the bloodwork hadn't came back yet, at the time Dr. S was at PP.

peggyon said:

I forget, did he undergo a urine or blood test on 4/20?

A blood test should delineate which type of opiate was present.

My concern about Vicodin alone is that it is fairly weak and I think Prince needed stronger opiates at that time, especially if he required that much Narcan for reversal.

Also, Vicodin has acetomeniphen which addicts shy away from as it is toxic to the liver

[Edited 2/28/19 13:57pm]

But the blood test results eventually did come back showing both Hydrocodone/Hydromophone?

Or was it the UA? And was it confirmed by the bloodwork? I am asking because blood tests are much more accurate.

Sorry, Penny, I did not save the files.

Reply #397 posted 02/28/19 5:32pm

PennyPurple

peggyon said:

PennyPurple said:

He had both tests done on the 20th. The UA Dr S had the results for the next morning that he was taking to PP, the bloodwork hadn't came back yet, at the time Dr. S was at PP.

But the blood test results eventually did come back showing both Hydrocodone/Hydromophone?

Or was it the UA? And was it confirmed by the bloodwork? I am asking because blood tests are much more accurate.

Sorry, Penny, I did not save the files.

I think the UA showed both. I don't know about the bloodwork if it is in the files or not. When I have some time I'll have to check.

Reply #398 posted 02/28/19 6:28pm

peggyon

PennyPurple said:

peggyon said:

But the blood test results eventually did come back showing both Hydrocodone/Hydromophone?

Or was it the UA? And was it confirmed by the bloodwork? I am asking because blood tests are much more accurate.

Sorry, Penny, I did not save the files.

I think the UA showed both. I don't know about the bloodwork if it is in the files or not. When I have some time I'll have to check.

I just read most of the files in the NY Times version. Hopefully, it is complete. (eyes are blurry)

UA does mention being + for hydromorphone/hydrocodone (levels verified on 4/25)

-4/20 bloodwork returned. ME only stated there was no Fentanyl. Did not mention other opiates.

- ME stated that her bloodwork showed no Vicodin on 4/21. UA was positive though.

-Had 1-2 IV's with Dr S. May have flushed things.

Reply #399 posted 02/28/19 6:36pm

PennyPurple

peggyon said:

PennyPurple said:

I think the UA showed both. I don't know about the bloodwork if it is in the files or not. When I have some time I'll have to check.

I just read most of the files in the NY Times version. Hopefully, it is complete. (eyes are blurry)

UA does mention being + for hydromorphone/hydrocodone (levels verified on 4/25)

-4/20 bloodwork returned. ME only stated there was no Fentanyl. Did not mention other opiates.

- ME stated that her bloodwork showed no Vicodin on 4/21. UA was positive though.

-Had 1-2 IV's with Dr S. May have flushed things.

So would that mean that the pill was all fentanyl then no codene?

Reply #400 posted 02/28/19 6:53pm

peggyon

PennyPurple said:

peggyon said:

I just read most of the files in the NY Times version. Hopefully, it is complete. (eyes are blurry)

UA does mention being + for hydromorphone/hydrocodone (levels verified on 4/25)

-4/20 bloodwork returned. ME only stated there was no Fentanyl. Did not mention other opiates.

- ME stated that her bloodwork showed no Vicodin on 4/21. UA was positive though.

-Had 1-2 IV's with Dr S. May have flushed things.

So would that mean that the pill was all fentanyl then no codene?

Not sure.

I am thinking now about what LIJAG said about hydrocodone metabolizing into hydromorphone?

I only skimmed it but it does seem feasible. Maybe he did not take Dilaudid (post-Moline)

I just can't get my head around him only taking Vicodin (post-Moline) which is a wimpy drug.

If it was only Vicodin, the blood levels were high, so he seems to have taken alot. And, how did his bloodwork show no Vicodin for the ME on 4/21?? + UA though.

Also, maybe this was his way of proving to us that he could have taken a "Vicodin" by mistake. (The one that killed him) . I have to be honest, I feel he was in complete control of all of it.

Reply #401 posted 02/28/19 7:37pm

peggyon

i'm going to call it a night. I will look for the ME notes re: No Hydrocodone (vicodin) in his blood.

May take a day or two.

Reply #402 posted 02/28/19 7:45pm

rednblue

peggyon said:

PennyPurple said:

So would that mean that the pill was all fentanyl then no codene?

Not sure.

I am thinking now about what LIJAG said about hydrocodone metabolizing into hydromorphone?

I only skimmed it but it does seem feasible. Maybe he did not take Dilaudid (post-Moline)

I just can't get my head around him only taking Vicodin (post-Moline) which is a wimpy drug.

If it was only Vicodin, the blood levels were high, so he seems to have taken alot. And, how did his bloodwork show no Vicodin for the ME on 4/21?? + UA though.

Also, maybe this was his way of proving to us that he could have taken a "Vicodin" by mistake. (The one that killed him) . I have to be honest, I feel he was in complete control of all of it.

dupe

[Edited 2/28/19 20:00pm]

Reply #403 posted 02/28/19 7:59pm

rednblue

rednblue said:

peggyon said:

Not sure.

I am thinking now about what LIJAG said about hydrocodone metabolizing into hydromorphone?

I only skimmed it but it does seem feasible. Maybe he did not take Dilaudid (post-Moline)

I just can't get my head around him only taking Vicodin (post-Moline) which is a wimpy drug.

If it was only Vicodin, the blood levels were high, so he seems to have taken alot. And, how did his bloodwork show no Vicodin for the ME on 4/21?? + UA though.

Also, maybe this was his way of proving to us that he could have taken a "Vicodin" by mistake. (The one that killed him) . I have to be honest, I feel he was in complete control of all of it.

Interesting. Others have mentioned great control over all of it, or everything. My response is to ask if people mean he seemed to have precise control over the way opiate use played out over the whole of the last decade or so? That he may have considered his pattern of use over years to be his best option, and that he executed that option as a controlled regime of targeted doses over that time? So that he controlled things to happen so that he was always where he "targeted " to be in life?

Or by "complete control" of all of it, were you thinking of a much shorter period of time?

[Edited 2/28/19 20:01pm]

[Edited 2/28/19 20:11pm]

Reply #404 posted 02/28/19 8:09pm

peggyon

rednblue said:

peggyon said:

Not sure.

I am thinking now about what LIJAG said about hydrocodone metabolizing into hydromorphone?

I only skimmed it but it does seem feasible. Maybe he did not take Dilaudid (post-Moline)

I just can't get my head around him only taking Vicodin (post-Moline) which is a wimpy drug.

If it was only Vicodin, the blood levels were high, so he seems to have taken alot. And, how did his bloodwork show no Vicodin for the ME on 4/21?? + UA though.

Also, maybe this was his way of proving to us that he could have taken a "Vicodin" by mistake. (The one that killed him) . I have to be honest, I feel he was in complete control of all of it.

Interesting. Others have mentioned great control over all of it, or everything. My response is to ask if people mean he seemed to have precise control over the way opiate use played out over the whole of the last decade? That he may have considered his pattern of use over years to be his best option, and that he executed that option as a controlled regime of targeted doses over that time?

Or by "complete control" of all of it, were you thinking of a much shorter period of time?

Gosh, not sure. I just don't think Prince left things to chance.

I am only speaking of his last year. He did not want us to know about his drug use and perhaps he felt ashamed and also did not want his legacy tarnished after all he had put into it. Personally, I also thought he was ill.

Reply #405 posted 02/28/19 8:18pm

PennyPurple

I'm still undecided on the, he meant to do it thing.

Of course, as I'm finding out, I'm not a very good judge on character anymore. sad

Reply #406 posted 02/28/19 8:25pm

peggyon

PennyPurple said:

I'm still undecided on the, he meant to do it thing.

Of course, as I'm finding out, I'm not a very good judge on character anymore. sad

Who's character? Oh, I think I know

Reply #407 posted 02/28/19 8:33pm

rednblue

peggyon said:

 



rednblue said:


 



peggyon said:


 


 


Not sure.


 


I am thinking now about what LIJAG said about hydrocodone metabolizing into hydromorphone?


I only skimmed it but it does seem feasible. Maybe he did not take Dilaudid (post-Moline)


 


I just can't get my head around him only taking Vicodin (post-Moline) which is a wimpy drug. 


If it was only Vicodin, the blood levels were high, so he seems to have taken alot. And, how did his bloodwork show no Vicodin for the ME on 4/21?? + UA though.


 


Also, maybe this was his way of proving to us that he could have taken a "Vicodin" by mistake. (The one that killed him) .   I have to be honest, I feel he was in complete control of all of it.


 


 


 


 



 


Interesting.  Others have mentioned great control over all of it, or everything.  My response is to ask if people mean he seemed to have precise control over the way opiate use played out over the whole of the last decade?  That he may have considered his pattern of use over years to be his best option, and that he executed that option as a controlled regime of targeted doses over that time?

Or by "complete control" of all of it, were you thinking of a much shorter period of time?



 


 


 


Gosh, not sure. I just don't think Prince left things to chance. 


I am only speaking of his last year. He did not want us to know about his drug use and perhaps he felt ashamed and also did not want his legacy tarnished after all he had put into it. Personally, I also thought he was ill.


 



I’m not sure either. I don’t get the sense that people here would be thrown by the idea of P not always able to control things in life well, but some fans seem to love marveling at, and adoring the idea of, P as an absolute control master. I hope people like P know it’s OK and human to struggle a lot to control things at times, and that it’s not the end of the world if others detect a lack of control.

It's complicated though, as some seem to really crave control over every aspect of their lives.

Also, for people in situations like this...hope they can let go of shame that isn’t making anything better.

As you noted above, wish he and his circumstances had allowed for continuing guidance of skilled medical people.
[Edited 3/1/19 6:26am]
Reply #408 posted 02/28/19 8:46pm

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

peggyon said:

PennyPurple said:

I think the UA showed both. I don't know about the bloodwork if it is in the files or not. When I have some time I'll have to check.

I just read most of the files in the NY Times version. Hopefully, it is complete. (eyes are blurry)

UA does mention being + for hydromorphone/hydrocodone (levels verified on 4/25)

-4/20 bloodwork returned. ME only stated there was no Fentanyl. Did not mention other opiates.

- ME stated that her bloodwork showed no Vicodin on 4/21. UA was positive though.

-Had 1-2 IV's with Dr S. May have flushed things.





-We saw his actual medical records from Moline but the investigative file didnt include the actual blood test printout from Dr. S. Hmmm.......



[Edited 3/1/19 11:45am]

Reply #409 posted 02/28/19 9:14pm

peggyon

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

peggyon said:

I just read most of the files in the NY Times version. Hopefully, it is complete. (eyes are blurry)

UA does mention being + for hydromorphone/hydrocodone (levels verified on 4/25)

-4/20 bloodwork returned. ME only stated there was no Fentanyl. Did not mention other opiates.

- ME stated that her bloodwork showed no Vicodin on 4/21. UA was positive though.

-Had 1-2 IV's with Dr S. May have flushed things.



-The records show the autopsy urine contained both Oxycodone (Percocet) and Hydrocodone (Vicodin.) P's Blood tested positive for Fentanyl only.

-We saw his actual medical records from Moline but the investigative file didnt include the actual blood test printout from Dr. S. Hmmm.......

Hmmm, as well.

Reply #410 posted 02/28/19 11:22pm

peggyon

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

peggyon said:

I just read most of the files in the NY Times version. Hopefully, it is complete. (eyes are blurry)

UA does mention being + for hydromorphone/hydrocodone (levels verified on 4/25)

-4/20 bloodwork returned. ME only stated there was no Fentanyl. Did not mention other opiates.

- ME stated that her bloodwork showed no Vicodin on 4/21. UA was positive though.

-Had 1-2 IV's with Dr S. May have flushed things.



-The records show the autopsy urine contained both Oxycodone (Percocet) and Hydrocodone (Vicodin.) P's Blood tested positive for Fentanyl only.

-We saw his actual medical records from Moline but the investigative file didnt include the actual blood test printout from Dr. S. Hmmm.......

As I was perusing the NYTimes Death Investigation files again tonight, on page 31,it stated per Dr Strobel, urine autopsy results showed Hydrocodone. No mention of Oxycodone. Also, interestingly, no Hydrocodone in the blood.

Did I miss something?

Reply #411 posted 03/01/19 10:05am

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame

peggyon said:

As I was perusing the NYTimes Death Investigation files again tonight, on page 31,it stated per Dr Strobel, urine autopsy results showed Hydrocodone. No mention of Oxycodone. Also, interestingly, no Hydrocodone in the blood.

Did I miss something?



You are right, I was looking at the wrong section. It was Dr. S who said the blood results came back as positive for Percs and Vicodin. I should edit my post. I dont want to mislead.




[Edited 3/1/19 10:12am]

Reply #412 posted 03/01/19 4:56pm

peggyon

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

peggyon said:

As I was perusing the NYTimes Death Investigation files again tonight, on page 31,it stated per Dr Strobel, urine autopsy results showed Hydrocodone. No mention of Oxycodone. Also, interestingly, no Hydrocodone in the blood.

Did I miss something?



You are right, I was looking at the wrong section. It was Dr. S who said the blood results came back as positive for Percs and Vicodin. I should edit my post. I dont want to mislead.




[Edited 3/1/19 10:12am]

No worries, there is so much to keep track of.

Reply #413 posted 03/01/19 6:07pm

peggyon

Is someone paying us for this? JK...

[Edited 3/1/19 18:09pm]

Reply #414 posted 03/01/19 8:04pm

PennyPurple

peggyon said:

Is someone paying us for this? JK...

[Edited 3/1/19 18:09pm]

lol

Reply #415 posted 03/02/19 9:19am

peggyon

As LIJAG mentioned, we don't have complete results from Dr. S's labwork 4/20.

(blood); just no Fentanyl. Does not mention presence/no presence of other opiates.

-4/21, ME states no sign of Vicodin in blood, though pos for urine. High dose of Fentanyl

-ME stated that P took Fent orally but I don't get the sense it was many pills. Wouldn't they have shown in gastric fluid as they would not have had time to digest?? (Please fee free to jump in here, anyone, as this is only surmising on my part)

- ME said, no Vicodin in blood (4/21) so likely he only took Fentanyl on 4/21

(once again no mention of other opiates in blood, which was either another incomplete report or there was only Vicodin present)

-I would imagine that ME blood tests would be top-of-the-line.

-In summary, I am wondering if he did only take Vicodin post-Moline (no Dilaudid)?

-He seems to have taken alot re: urine test 4/20., No discussion of blood-work findings 4/20 (just no Fent)

Perhaps, he stopped taking anything for 1-3 days pre-4/20 blood test? (just don't have Dr S blood result, but no Vic in blood 4/21)

Only wanted Vicodin to show in blood, not anything stronger like Oxy/Fent?

Could he then, after setting stage with the above, felt that, he could now take Fent (big dose) and make it seem accidental? ("He only reached for a Vicodin")

I also find it interesting that much stronger drugs are made to look like the much weaker Vicodin.

I think his addiction had surpassed the Vicodin stage.

PennyPurple said:

peggyon said:

I just read most of the files in the NY Times version. Hopefully, it is complete. (eyes are blurry)

UA does mention being + for hydromorphone/hydrocodone (levels verified on 4/25)

-4/20 bloodwork returned. ME only stated there was no Fentanyl. Did not mention other opiates.

- ME stated that her bloodwork showed no Vicodin on 4/21. UA was positive though.

-Had 1-2 IV's with Dr S. May have flushed things.

So would that mean that the pill was all fentanyl then no codene?

Reply #416 posted 03/02/19 9:38am

peggyon

On the other hand, if he did this intentionally, why leave so many pills (+ for Fentanyl ) in plain view?

Also, after being in mod withdrawal that day (4/20) would he have reached for 1 Vicodin? I think he would have gone for something stronger like Oxy or ?

Reply #417 posted 03/02/19 10:03am

luvsexy4all

with all the cover ups ..how can u believe even this info? what they want u to know is being furnished

Reply #418 posted 03/02/19 1:13pm

peggyon

luvsexy4all said:

with all the cover ups ..how can u believe even this info? what they want u to know is being furnished

Could be very true...I do feel quasi- confident about the urine test on 4/20, though. Don't think Fentanyl OD is untrue; that and the amount he took could have been covered-up with something less alarming.

Reply #419 posted 03/03/19 10:59am

simm0061

PennyPurple said:

I think if Prince set himself on this path, he would have been on the hardcore stuff. Oxycontin.

Percocets and Vicodins are childs play compared to Oxycontin.

Percocet is stronger than oxy. Percocet is basically oxy plus tylenol. If you are allegic to tylenol then a pain dr. will usually perscribe Oxycontin and extra strength ibuprofen instead of percocet.

Reply #420 posted 03/03/19 1:44pm

PennyPurple

Image may contain: text

Reply #421 posted 03/03/19 1:45pm

PennyPurple

Image may contain: text

Reply #422 posted 03/03/19 1:52pm

PennyPurple

Oxycodone may be thought of as the lesser of the two evils because it is often combined with other medications. It is still an opiate but may be combined with ibuprofen or Tylenol in some formulations. A number of prescription pain relievers including Percocet, Percodan, Tylox and OxyContin all contain oxycodone. However, oxycodone is the only ingredient in the stronger version of the drug: OxyContin.

https://www.narconon.org/...oxycontin/

Reply #423 posted 03/03/19 4:05pm

Bodhitheblackdog

Doc, a Prince fan, said his death made her draw a line and cut back on writing scripts for opioids.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/unwise-and-unnecessary-opioids-for-wisdom-teeth-extractions/2019/03/01/f3600a3c-2e33-11e9-86ab-5d02109aeb01_story.html?utm_term=.e9f684132b33

Reply #424 posted 03/03/19 4:32pm

peggyon

Bodhitheblackdog said:

Doc, a Prince fan, said his death made her draw a line and cut back on writing scripts for opioids.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/unwise-and-unnecessary-opioids-for-wisdom-teeth-extractions/2019/03/01/f3600a3c-2e33-11e9-86ab-5d02109aeb01_story.html?utm_term=.e9f684132b33

The hospital I work in (ED), offers Tylenol 1 Gm IV as a first line of defense for pain, followed by Toradol IV which is essentially Ibuprofen. Opioids are only considered as a last resort.

Reply #425 posted 03/03/19 4:37pm

peggyon

This might be something others have talked about and I apologize if so, but I would consider the drugs he had on his bedside stand to be his current drugs of choice. Also, cutting them in quarters and halves implies (to me) he is aware of their strength but wishes something stronger.

[Edited 3/3/19 16:42pm]

Reply #426 posted 03/03/19 8:29pm

ladygirl99

June7 said:

ladygirl99 said:

I orgnote June7 about this question. I hope he replies on here or I would received a reply from him.

[I responded via .orgnote - feel free to repost if you wish. - June7]

I just now noticed your response on this thread to me, June 7. So since you gave me permission I will copy your reply so everyone can see this. I also suggest you update this on your first post too on this thread so people can see to avoid more of the same questions as to why there is no sticky.

It's never been a sticky, now or past versions. It's a regular thread that is already controversial, and I've also featured it on the front page as a quote - so ... ???

Thank you for the sympathies - I appreciate it.

We 'stickify' threads that we want featured on the front page that will give the casual observer an insight into what we feel best represents The Org. Sadly, though I am allowing the discussion to take place, it's not something we want to advertise. I hope you understand.

June7/Tomás

I repost this response from June7 over orgnote only because he gave me permission to so other mods please make this exceptional as there are rules not posting orgnotes on the threads. I hope this will answer the question to people who wonder why there are no sticky for the death threads.

[Edited 3/3/19 20:32pm]

URL: https://new.prince.org/msg/7/457835

Date printed: Mon 19th Aug 2019 4:44pm PDT