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Reply #270 posted 07/26/17 3:43am

Yewdale

avatar

RODSERLING said:

CAL3 said:

.

Crazy talk. You think WB wants to flood the market with a bunch of reissues all piggybacked on top of each other? .

.

I feel that Laura is talking sense here. You on the other hand are talking about "low sales" (compared to what? tons of reissues by high profile artist don't even make the charts at all - yet continue to have future reissues).

No, good sense talk.

.

Flooding the market with SOTT and 1999 ? That's crazy talk ! Wake up, they were released 30 and 35 years ago respectively.

They won't press more copies than what was pressed after his death, so it won't change anything for the casual consumers.

.

And I don't think that releasing 2 reeditions in 2018 is what you can call "market flooding".

.

A little lesson in music industry : the reeditions usually come out by grappes : like the 2001 MJ reeditions, or the 8 Phil Collins reeditions, or the 14 Beatles Remastered in 1987 and 2009. It creates a hype.

I don't recall anyone saying the Beatles flooded the market in 2009 eek :. Last year they released 2 music videos collections, one documentary movie in theaters, and Sgt Peppers 50th.

.

Last but not least, if you release only one reedition by year, hmmm...In 5 year there probably won't be no physical market to flood. So it's now or never. Personnally, I don't care about digital and streaming deluxe reeditions.

.

If you had the decency to read this thread, including this page 9, you would see that I always make numbers and sales comparisons with other reeditions. So i can't understand your complaints here ?

[Edited 7/26/17 2:08am]



You make several excellent points here. I'm old enough to have been a 13 year old Beatles fan back in 1982 when 'Love Me Do' was given a 20th anniversary re-issue, complete with promo video and lots of promotion. It flew up to number 4 on the U.K charts. They then decided to continue this on the 20th anniversary of subsequent singles.... but all of the momentum had been lost by the time Please Please Me was released in early 1983. I think a valuable lesson was learned there and then by all those at Apple, and to be fair they have barely missed a beat since.

It has become commonplace for multiple Beatles products to be released in the same year.... even on the same day, and it works. Momentum, and a choice of sparkly new products to buy when that momentum and the promotion behind it all is at its height, should never be under-estimated when it comes to commercial selling.

Most people buy physical C.D's now on Amazon, and I think I'm a fairly typical customer in that I usually put a small bundle of C.D's together when I am making a purchase. When I bought the PR Deluxe Edition I bundled it with two Gladys Knight & The Pips Deluxe Editions.... because there were no other Prince ones to buy. Had SOTT and Parade been released in remastered deluxe editions on the same day as PR I would have bought all three in a heartbeat.

And I too don't think you can over-flood the market when it comes to re-issues, as you yourself point out by giving examples across the board of artists who release multiple remasters at the same time, or at least within the same year. Re-issues are generally bought by die hard fans, and so to be able to get 1999, Parade, SOTT, Lovesexy and ATWIAD all in the same 12 month period would be amazing for me, and I'm sure for thousands of others on this site. Re-issues rarely target the casual music fan... that's what Greatest Hits collections are for.

I also think a little bit of a reality check is called for when people are suggesting 'poor sales' of the PR Deluxe Edition will mean no more releases. Poor sales my arse.... I wonder how many sales those Phil Collins re-issues managed, or those of Belinda Carlisle, Alexander O'Neal.... or even the aforementioned Gladys Knight & The Pips. Paul McCartney himself has remastered his catalogue once before without those re-releases selling by the million, and yet he's doing them over again with Deluxe Editions, and they still don't light up the charts, but they continue to be released, and I imagine turn a small profit, because they meet demand with supply. That's much easier to gauge with re-releases than with newly released, untested material, so less money is wasted.

There are thousands of remastered albums 'flooding' the market to almost no acclaim, no chart action and small sales..... but the re-marketing, re-mastering and re-packaging of already released material is a relatively cheap endeavor and if Wendy & Lisa can continue to have their back catalogue re-mastered and re-released without ever denting the Top 100 with those re-releases, I'm sure the people at WB, Prince's estate and whoever else is involved can manage to do the same with Prince's catalogue if they get their heads together.

Given that thousands of remastered and deluxe editions of albums have now been released, and that 99% of them will have sold considerably less than 20,000 units worldwide, Purple Rain must already be one of the biggest selling remastered albums of all time, and that's WITHOUT a lot of promotion. It doesn't have to sell alongside SGT pepper or Thriller to be a successful re-issue. It has outsold 99% of the remastered market within just weeks of release, and I call that a huge success.... not the abject failure some are calling it. It isn't 1984 anymore people.



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Reply #271 posted 07/26/17 4:11am

feeluupp

RODSERLING said:

feeluupp said:

53 for what charts?

Billboard this week it's at #85 last week it was at 71.

So where are you getting your chart numbers from?

You really understand nothing about charts and sales...By the way I already posted this 6 days ago, you really have hard time to understand simple things.

Rod, go away. Please, go visit the eiffel tower or something.

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Reply #272 posted 07/26/17 4:19am

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:

RODSERLING said:

You really understand nothing about charts and sales...By the way I already posted this 6 days ago, you really have hard time to understand simple things.

Rod, go away. Please, go visit the eiffel tower or something.

What a troll you are, quoting numbers and sales you don't know about.

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Reply #273 posted 07/26/17 4:23am

feeluupp

RODSERLING said:

feeluupp said:

Rod, go away. Please, go visit the eiffel tower or something.

What a troll you are, quoting numbers and sales you don't know about.

Every post about sales I have a source, you estimate all the fucking time. Are you the one who didn't create the thread that Prince will never crack the Billboard 200 ever again?

Oh wait 4 albums made the Top 200 since that troll thread of yours. I guess you're estimate is wrong once again... No wait lets go back last month when you estimated PR deluxe would sell no more than 60k worldwide... How many did it sell world wide in its first week? Over 90K right.

Yea so Rod you can estimate how long it will take you to walk to the eiffel tower if you start putting your foot out the door right now. Go on.

[Edited 7/26/17 4:23am]

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Reply #274 posted 07/26/17 4:27am

feeluupp

RODSERLING:

I predict 55/60.000 sales woldwide for the first week, below U2's Joshua Tree

Please ROD do not PREDICT anything on this site anymore, unless you can predict next week's lottery numbers accurately.

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Reply #275 posted 07/26/17 5:14am

RODSERLING

Yewdale said:

RODSERLING said:

No, good sense talk.

.

Flooding the market with SOTT and 1999 ? That's crazy talk ! Wake up, they were released 30 and 35 years ago respectively.

They won't press more copies than what was pressed after his death, so it won't change anything for the casual consumers.

.

And I don't think that releasing 2 reeditions in 2018 is what you can call "market flooding".

.

A little lesson in music industry : the reeditions usually come out by grappes : like the 2001 MJ reeditions, or the 8 Phil Collins reeditions, or the 14 Beatles Remastered in 1987 and 2009. It creates a hype.

I don't recall anyone saying the Beatles flooded the market in 2009 eek :. Last year they released 2 music videos collections, one documentary movie in theaters, and Sgt Peppers 50th.

.

Last but not least, if you release only one reedition by year, hmmm...In 5 year there probably won't be no physical market to flood. So it's now or never. Personnally, I don't care about digital and streaming deluxe reeditions.

.

If you had the decency to read this thread, including this page 9, you would see that I always make numbers and sales comparisons with other reeditions. So i can't understand your complaints here ?

[Edited 7/26/17 2:08am]



You make several excellent points here. I'm old enough to have been a 13 year old Beatles fan back in 1982 when 'Love Me Do' was given a 20th anniversary re-issue, complete with promo video and lots of promotion. It flew up to number 4 on the U.K charts. They then decided to continue this on the 20th anniversary of subsequent singles.... but all of the momentum had been lost by the time Please Please Me was released in early 1983. I think a valuable lesson was learned there and then by all those at Apple, and to be fair they have barely missed a beat since.

It has become commonplace for multiple Beatles products to be released in the same year.... even on the same day, and it works. Momentum, and a choice of sparkly new products to buy when that momentum and the promotion behind it all is at its height, should never be under-estimated when it comes to commercial selling.

Most people buy physical C.D's now on Amazon, and I think I'm a fairly typical customer in that I usually put a small bundle of C.D's together when I am making a purchase. When I bought the PR Deluxe Edition I bundled it with two Gladys Knight & The Pips Deluxe Editions.... because there were no other Prince ones to buy. Had SOTT and Parade been released in remastered deluxe editions on the same day as PR I would have bought all three in a heartbeat.

And I too don't think you can over-flood the market when it comes to re-issues, as you yourself point out by giving examples across the board of artists who release multiple remasters at the same time, or at least within the same year. Re-issues are generally bought by die hard fans, and so to be able to get 1999, Parade, SOTT, Lovesexy and ATWIAD all in the same 12 month period would be amazing for me, and I'm sure for thousands of others on this site. Re-issues rarely target the casual music fan... that's what Greatest Hits collections are for.

I also think a little bit of a reality check is called for when people are suggesting 'poor sales' of the PR Deluxe Edition will mean no more releases. Poor sales my arse.... I wonder how many sales those Phil Collins re-issues managed, or those of Belinda Carlisle, Alexander O'Neal.... or even the aforementioned Gladys Knight & The Pips. Paul McCartney himself has remastered his catalogue once before without those re-releases selling by the million, and yet he's doing them over again with Deluxe Editions, and they still don't light up the charts, but they continue to be released, and I imagine turn a small profit, because they meet demand with supply. That's much easier to gauge with re-releases than with newly released, untested material, so less money is wasted.

There are thousands of remastered albums 'flooding' the market to almost no acclaim, no chart action and small sales..... but the re-marketing, re-mastering and re-packaging of already released material is a relatively cheap endeavor and if Wendy & Lisa can continue to have their back catalogue re-mastered and re-released without ever denting the Top 100 with those re-releases, I'm sure the people at WB, Prince's estate and whoever else is involved can manage to do the same with Prince's catalogue if they get their heads together.

Given that thousands of remastered and deluxe editions of albums have now been released, and that 99% of them will have sold considerably less than 20,000 units worldwide, Purple Rain must already be one of the biggest selling remastered albums of all time, and that's WITHOUT a lot of promotion. It doesn't have to sell alongside SGT pepper or Thriller to be a successful re-issue. It has outsold 99% of the remastered market within just weeks of release, and I call that a huge success.... not the abject failure some are calling it. It isn't 1984 anymore people.



Apparently Mccartney is releasing his reeditions on his own money...

.

BAD 25 flopped so terribly that Sony gave up releasing DANGEROUS 25. Legal complications were so terrible that they gave up releasing OFF THE WALL 35.

.

The reeditions you are talking about (Wendy and Lisa, for instance) don't require the same treatment, as, let's say, a 1999 reedition on the Purple Rain deluxe format. You have 3 CD, 1 dvd and...a lot of legal complications. Moreover, they signed with Prince a contract back in 2014, so that means they paid Prince for PR deluxe in some form, and I doubt they have their money back on PR deluxe.

.

If it was so cheap and so simple for WB to release Prince's reeditions, they wouldn't wait that long.

We saw that with the 1st avenue dvd/blu ray, that was ultimately scrapped because of the estate.

.

Moreover, PR deluxe is the first reedition for Prince in the market, whereas most of the artists already re-released their albums many times.

[Edited 7/26/17 5:39am]

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Reply #276 posted 07/26/17 5:21am

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:

RODSERLING:

I predict 55/60.000 sales woldwide for the first week, below U2's Joshua Tree

Please ROD do not PREDICT anything on this site anymore, unless you can predict next week's lottery numbers accurately.

Lol I have the right to predict whatever I want to. I was only short of 34.000 copies by the way.

.

When you were wrong about 6 MILLIONS COPIES FOR batman and 2 millions for Purple Rain total sales. No to say that last year you claimed that Prince sold 5 millions albums in the USA in a few weeks, because you couldn't read and understand a Billboard report.

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Reply #277 posted 07/26/17 5:32am

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:

RODSERLING said:

What a troll you are, quoting numbers and sales you don't know about.

Every post about sales I have a source, you estimate all the fucking time. Are you the one who didn't create the thread that Prince will never crack the Billboard 200 ever again?

Oh wait 4 albums made the Top 200 since that troll thread of yours. I guess you're estimate is wrong once again... No wait lets go back last month when you estimated PR deluxe would sell no more than 60k worldwide... How many did it sell world wide in its first week? Over 90K right.

Yea so Rod you can estimate how long it will take you to walk to the eiffel tower if you start putting your foot out the door right now. Go on.

[Edited 7/26/17 4:23am]

I claimed that he couldn't crack the Billboard 200 with a new album, and I couldn't predict he will be dead two years after.He didn't re-enter the top 200 alive, sadly.

.

It was a provocative thread pointing out that Prince turned his back to every major companies, releasing his material on Tidal only, without benefiting from wide streaming sales, which are the future.

.

When you look today at the sales of PR deluxe (that would have never been released when he was alive), it's #30 in sales but only #85 with streaming (and again, alive, he would have never made it to Spotify).

.

If Prince was alive today, he would have hard time to crack the top 200 without some kind of trick.

There would be no new material on his hypothetical reeditions, no streaming apart from tidal.

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Reply #278 posted 07/26/17 6:12am

feeluupp

ROD can you name 10 Prince songs cause since you've been here you haven't posted anything on this forum besides Prince can't sell records anymore.

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Reply #279 posted 07/26/17 6:34am

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:

ROD can you name 10 Prince songs cause since you've been here you haven't posted anything on this forum besides Prince can't sell records anymore.

lol I have been demasked by a troll. Of course not I can't even name one Prince song. On the Eiffel Tower, we don't know Prince.

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Reply #280 posted 07/26/17 9:00am

TKO

avatar

feeluupp said:

TKO said:

US sales

53 - 108,000 - PURPLE RAIN - Prince & the Revolution ( 3,677,000 )
87 - 79,000 - 4EVER - Prince ( 146,000 )

53 for what charts?

Billboard this week it's at #85 last week it was at 71.

So where are you getting your chart numbers from?

Sorry, these numbers are from the 2017 sales chart.

Purple Rain is #53 best-selling album this year. 4ever is #87.

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Reply #281 posted 07/27/17 12:36am

RODSERLING

Best selling albums in the USA in 2017 (for the 4th week in release of PR deluxe) :

.

01 - 781,000 - ÷ - Ed Sheeran ( 781,000 )
24 - 208,000 - SGT PEPPER'S LONELY HEARTS CLUB BAND - Beatles ( 5,011,000 )
49 - 114,000 - PURPLE RAIN - Prince & the Revolution ( 3,683,000 )
76 - 87,000 - THE JOSHUA TREE - U2 ( 3,736,000 )
87 - 80,000 - 4EVER - Prince ( 147,000 )

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Reply #282 posted 07/27/17 6:16am

feeluupp

TKO said:

US sales

53 - 108,000 - PURPLE RAIN - Prince & the Revolution ( 3,677,000 )
87 - 79,000 - 4EVER - Prince ( 146,000 )

It's a shame WB won't recertify Purple Rain... They just presented The Revolution with 13x Platinum RIAA plaques last month... Obviously they are not keeping track of the sales, last time Purple Rain was certified by RIAA was in 1996 by 13 million, and according to the sales that's an additional 3.6 million more sold which would make it stand at 16.6 million and counting for USA sales alone.

If it was recertified including those numbers it would now be in the TOP 10 BIGGEST SELLING ALBUMS OF ALL TIME IN USA.

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Reply #283 posted 07/27/17 7:21am

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:

TKO said:

US sales

53 - 108,000 - PURPLE RAIN - Prince & the Revolution ( 3,677,000 )
87 - 79,000 - 4EVER - Prince ( 146,000 )

It's a shame WB won't recertify Purple Rain... They just presented The Revolution with 13x Platinum RIAA plaques last month... Obviously they are not keeping track of the sales, last time Purple Rain was certified by RIAA was in 1996 by 13 million, and according to the sales that's an additional 3.6 million more sold which would make it stand at 16.6 million and counting for USA sales alone.

If it was recertified including those numbers it would now be in the TOP 10 BIGGEST SELLING ALBUMS OF ALL TIME IN USA.

The 3.6 millions sales you are referring to are the soundscan sales, and it began tracking in january 1991. Since PR was recertified in august 1996, there is at least 600.000 copies already counted on the 13*P certification.

.

But anyway, in term of shipment, PR deserves a 16*PLATINUM award indeed. Maybe because of a disagreement between WB and the Estate, the recertification was scrapped. Clearly, WB didn't want to spend one penny in the promotion...But why?

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Reply #284 posted 08/01/17 8:11am

kewlschool

avatar

feeluupp said:

TKO said:

US sales

53 - 108,000 - PURPLE RAIN - Prince & the Revolution ( 3,677,000 )
87 - 79,000 - 4EVER - Prince ( 146,000 )

It's a shame WB won't recertify Purple Rain... They just presented The Revolution with 13x Platinum RIAA plaques last month... Obviously they are not keeping track of the sales, last time Purple Rain was certified by RIAA was in 1996 by 13 million, and according to the sales that's an additional 3.6 million more sold which would make it stand at 16.6 million and counting for USA sales alone.

If it was recertified including those numbers it would now be in the TOP 10 BIGGEST SELLING ALBUMS OF ALL TIME IN USA.

It probably sold a 100,000 copies annually too. (1996-2004)

99.9% of everything I say is strictly for my own entertainment
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Reply #285 posted 08/01/17 8:21am

kewlschool

avatar

RODSERLING said:

TKO said:

You have no clue about how industry works. Big artists like Katy Perry are selling 200k and the label has to pay a lot for promotion, radio payola, ads, album recording, famous producers, etc.

Purple Rain sold 100k in one week and it's basically old material with little to no promo at all. The label is making a lot of money without spending money on it. It's a win for them.

I know very well how music industry works, and I certainly know what a flop is.

Katy Perry is making more money for the music industry than Prince, she tours, she has big hits that still sells millions worldwide.

.

Don't act as if PR Deluxe cost no money, with the legal and rights issues, you know it's not true. The simple fact they delayed the release for so long was because they had hard time to release it, and it's not free.

That delay in release was probably more of the estate side (the decision of releasing since dispute of the estate.).

As for people who think it's only greed that motivates the releases, how about legacy and funds to support Prince and Paisley Park. Since the main money maker was Prince touring, they have to establish money streams to keep themselves out of the red.

99.9% of everything I say is strictly for my own entertainment
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Reply #286 posted 08/02/17 1:15pm

rusty1

#150
Album is a flop
BOB4theFUNK
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Reply #287 posted 08/03/17 10:43am

TKO

avatar

ALBUM SALES WEEK 30

49 - 117,000 - PURPLE RAIN - Prince & the Revolution ( 3,686,000 )
89 - 81,000 - 4EVER - Prince ( 149,000 )

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Reply #288 posted 08/03/17 1:47pm

AnnaSantana

"Wonderful Ass" should've been a hit single, for real.

I don't argue with people about my opinions. Scram. I said what I said.
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Reply #289 posted 08/03/17 1:49pm

paisleypark4

avatar

TKO said:

ALBUM SALES WEEK 30

49 - 117,000 - PURPLE RAIN - Prince & the Revolution ( 3,686,000 )
89 - 81,000 - 4EVER - Prince ( 149,000 )

Sold another 3 million copies. Good for it.

Download all the shit hop that you can for your kids, neices, nephews, and their friends also. That will prevent them from going out and buying it and will prevent some shit hop sales. Every little bit helps - Andy
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemus
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Reply #290 posted 08/03/17 6:16pm

luvgirl

AnnaSantana said:

"Wonderful Ass" should've been a hit single, for real.

yeahthat

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Reply #291 posted 08/04/17 8:07pm

feeluupp

TKO said:

ALBUM SALES WEEK 30

49 - 117,000 - PURPLE RAIN - Prince & the Revolution ( 3,686,000 )
89 - 81,000 - 4EVER - Prince ( 149,000 )

Can you provide a link please. Thank you.

The #49 position is what? Billboard? U.S. sales? World Wide sales?

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Reply #292 posted 08/05/17 11:14am

TKO

avatar

feeluupp said:

TKO said:

ALBUM SALES WEEK 30

49 - 117,000 - PURPLE RAIN - Prince & the Revolution ( 3,686,000 )
89 - 81,000 - 4EVER - Prince ( 149,000 )

Can you provide a link please. Thank you.

The #49 position is what? Billboard? U.S. sales? World Wide sales?

Ukmix.

Purple Rain is the #49 best-selling album of this year. It sold 117,000 copies and the total is 3.6m.

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Reply #293 posted 08/05/17 11:52am

feeluupp

TKO said:

feeluupp said:

Can you provide a link please. Thank you.

The #49 position is what? Billboard? U.S. sales? World Wide sales?

Ukmix.

Purple Rain is the #49 best-selling album of this year. It sold 117,000 copies and the total is 3.6m.

UK sales only?

Or world wide?

I'm inquiring about the 117,000 number

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Reply #294 posted 08/05/17 7:00pm

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:



TKO said:




feeluupp said:





Can you provide a link please. Thank you.




The #49 position is what? Billboard? U.S. sales? World Wide sales?






Ukmix.



Purple Rain is the #49 best-selling album of this year. It sold 117,000 copies and the total is 3.6m.




UK sales only?



Or world wide?



I'm inquiring about the 117,000 number



You really have serious understanding problems...DIdn't you read thé last 2 pages?
eek
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Reply #295 posted 08/05/17 7:25pm

feeluupp

RODSERLING said:

feeluupp said:

UK sales only?

Or world wide?

I'm inquiring about the 117,000 number

You really have serious understanding problems...DIdn't you read thé last 2 pages? eek

Rody it's too early to be grumpy, go relax, go get a croissant and take a walk, the weather is nice where you are I hear.

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Reply #296 posted 08/05/17 7:29pm

feeluupp

BILLBOARD U.S. CHARTS

This Week: #150



Last Week: #85

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Reply #297 posted 08/06/17 2:31am

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:



RODSERLING said:


feeluupp said:



UK sales only?



Or world wide?



I'm inquiring about the 117,000 number



You really have serious understanding problems...DIdn't you read thé last 2 pages? eek


Rody it's too early to be grumpy, go relax, go get a croissant and take a walk, the weather is nice where you are I hear.



Funny to sée how, in each one of your post you are 1) completely innacurate 2) don t know what you are talking about, or at best 3) confusing charts and sales with another.
.

Seriously, read correctly thé post of thé other orgers in this topic
[Edited 8/6/17 2:32am]
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Reply #298 posted 08/06/17 2:37am

RODSERLING

feeluupp said:

BILLBOARD U.S. CHARTS






This Week: #150













Last Week: #85


Another instance proving you don t read this thread ans that you don t know whqt toute talking about:
.
1) this has already been posted on this page lol
.
2 ) this is last week charts...
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Reply #299 posted 08/06/17 11:01am

feeluupp

RODSERLING said:

feeluupp said:

BILLBOARD U.S. CHARTS

This Week: #150



Last Week: #85

Another instance proving you don t read this thread ans that you don t know whqt toute talking about: . 1) this has already been posted on this page lol . 2 ) this is last week charts...

No ROD, you're wrong as usual.

I created this thread don't forget...

I absolutely understand the sales figures, what confuses me is when various people just post numbers with no links and no information.

Every post it's just random numbers people are posting and I ask numbers for what week? What charts? Overall year end charts? U.S. charts? World Charts?

It's simple someone posted #150. Another person posts #47...

Just be specific so I can keep this thread updated, instead of just one posts with a number and no information at all. So if you have anything to provide please do, but stop hijacking the thread just to argue useless stuff.

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