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Thread started 04/27/19 6:19pm

SquirrelMeat

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Avengers End Game - Plot discussion (Major spoilers)


I don't want to spoil Emma's thread and risk ruining the film for those that haven't seen it.

So.....

Look away now if you don't want spoilers.

Have you left? Good.

For those of us still here.....

WTF??????????????

How many plot holes?

I'll start with one.

If 2014 Thanos is snapped out in 2023, he never lives beyond 2014. So does that mean the later films never happened?

.
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Reply #1 posted 04/28/19 12:45am

EmmaMcG

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SquirrelMeat said:


I don't want to spoil Emma's thread and risk ruining the film for those that haven't seen it.



So.....



Look away now if you don't want spoilers.



Have you left? Good.

For those of us still here.....



WTF?????

How many plot holes?

I'll start with one.

If 2014 Thanos is snapped out in 2023, he never lives beyond 2014. So does that mean the later films never happened?



That's not a plot hole. They actually explain it twice that you can't change the past. If they could, they would have just destroyed the stones when they got them. The entire plot of the movie revolves around them not being able to change the past. The first time they explain it is before they go back, when Banner/Hulk tells Scott Lang their plan and he says "So Back to the Future was bullshit?". Then, the bald one from Dr Strange explains how the timelines work to Bruce Banner. She doesn't want to give him the Time Stone because her reality and Banner's reality are different. And because Banner's reality can't be changed in any way by what he does in the past, giving him the stone would only affect her reality or timeline.

So, because they can't change the past, they can only change the future, the only way of bringing back everyone who died is to get the stones and use them to reverse the snap.
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Reply #2 posted 04/28/19 1:50am

EmmaMcG

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https://www.google.com/am...merica-old

This article clears up several "plot holes".
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Reply #3 posted 04/28/19 4:21am

Dauphin

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Article does a great job. Have to remember sci-fi movies with time travel require a sandbox to play in with custom rules.

IMO, the rules do have one plothole that the article mentions but glosses over. The rule is that the stones must be in the reality to control the flow of time. Thanos destroys the stones. That literally means there is no regulator of the time stream as of the Garden.
[Edited 4/28/19 7:01am]
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Still it's nice to know, when our bodies wear out, we can get another

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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Reply #4 posted 04/28/19 5:06am

damosuzuki

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Dauphin said:

Article does a great job. Have to remember sci-fi movies with time travel require a sandbox to play in with customer rules. I'm, the rules do have one plothole that the article mentions but glosses over. The rule is that the stones must be in the reality to control the flow of time. Thanos destroys the stones. That literally means there is no regulator of the time stream as of the Garden.

i agree that the movie plays within the rules that it sets up for itself.

that's a good point on the destruction of the stones, though - one that i hadn't thought of at all, myself.


doesn't make me like it less, though. i'd love to see it again today, but every bloody screening seems to be sold out.

"Nobody made a greater mistake than he who did nothing because he could do only a little."

http://www.thelifeyoucansave.com/
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Reply #5 posted 04/28/19 6:39am

EmmaMcG

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Probably my biggest complaint about the movie was how they twice said that Back to the Future was bullshit. And, as we all know, Back to the Future is a MASTERPIECE
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Reply #6 posted 04/28/19 6:50am

OnlyNDaUsa

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Time travle is always weird. And they knew it and the made several, near 4th wall breaking, jokes about it... But it is still a mess. But Such a pretty mess... (now that is a song I want to hear His version of LOL)

As to keeping the 5 year gap... that was presented as something Tony wanted as to not lose his daughter.... so it came off as him being self centered--even if it was necessary.

And they did not seem to address the aftermath of the adding billions to the population and the social issues of what happens to relationships as well as infrastructure. One can say Prof Hulk thought about all that and "snapped" all of it right.

And this was an issue in millions of worlds...

And where do they come back to? Seems that was not thought out... I guess Hulk could have sent them back to where they would be needed?

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #7 posted 04/28/19 6:56am

Dauphin

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

Time travle is always weird. And they knew it and the made several, near 4th wall breaking, jokes about it... But it is still a mess. But Such a pretty mess... (now that is a song I want to hear His version of LOL)

As to keeping the 5 year gap... that was presented as something Tony wanted as to not lose his daughter.... so it came off as him being self centered--even if it was necessary.

And they did not seem to address the aftermath of the adding billions to the population and the social issues of what happens to relationships as well as infrastructure. One can say Prof Hulk thought about all that and "snapped" all of it right.

And this was an issue in millions of worlds...

And where do they come back to? Seems that was not thought out... I guess Hulk could have sent them back to where they would be needed?



The MCU is an ongoing universe, like a serial series. With that in mind, anything that seems like a problem is actually literary opportunity. Especially when there are shortsighted and dramatic changes. Let's say there is a galactic empire that is now in major stress from the two snappenings, they're pissed and looking to take it out on Earth. Lots of potential
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Still it's nice to know, when our bodies wear out, we can get another

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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Reply #8 posted 04/28/19 7:15am

OnlyNDaUsa

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wait... how do ages work? A 15 year old is sanaped comes back is he 15 or 20?

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #9 posted 04/28/19 8:10am

EmmaMcG

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

Time travle is always weird. And they knew it and the made several, near 4th wall breaking, jokes about it... But it is still a mess. But Such a pretty mess... (now that is a song I want to hear His version of LOL)

As to keeping the 5 year gap... that was presented as something Tony wanted as to not lose his daughter.... so it came off as him being self centered--even if it was necessary.

And they did not seem to address the aftermath of the adding billions to the population and the social issues of what happens to relationships as well as infrastructure. One can say Prof Hulk thought about all that and "snapped" all of it right.

And this was an issue in millions of worlds...

And where do they come back to? Seems that was not thought out... I guess Hulk could have sent them back to where they would be needed?



Read the article I posted a link to. That will clear up most questions you might have.

In answer to your question of where the snapped return to, they reappear where they turned to dust. Peter Parker even explains it in the movie. Which will probably be a problem for anyone who was in an airplane at the time but at least the vast majority will be OK.
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Reply #10 posted 04/28/19 8:11am

EmmaMcG

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

wait... how do ages work? A 15 year old is sanaped comes back is he 15 or 20?



He is still 15. Again, this is explained and shown in the movie. I think you need to see it again. And this time, pay attention biggrin
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Reply #11 posted 04/28/19 8:53am

onlyforaminute

It just seemed to me Hawkeye's daughter was a bit older.
Year of Return 2019
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Reply #12 posted 04/28/19 9:18am

OnlyNDaUsa

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EmmaMcG said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

wait... how do ages work? A 15 year old is sanaped comes back is he 15 or 20?

He is still 15. Again, this is explained and shown in the movie. I think you need to see it again. And this time, pay attention biggrin

i was speaking legally

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #13 posted 04/28/19 9:45am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

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Dauphin said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

Time travle is always weird. And they knew it and the made several, near 4th wall breaking, jokes about it... But it is still a mess. But Such a pretty mess... (now that is a song I want to hear His version of LOL)

As to keeping the 5 year gap... that was presented as something Tony wanted as to not lose his daughter.... so it came off as him being self centered--even if it was necessary.

And they did not seem to address the aftermath of the adding billions to the population and the social issues of what happens to relationships as well as infrastructure. One can say Prof Hulk thought about all that and "snapped" all of it right.

And this was an issue in millions of worlds...

And where do they come back to? Seems that was not thought out... I guess Hulk could have sent them back to where they would be needed?



The MCU is an ongoing universe, like a serial series. With that in mind, anything that seems like a problem is actually literary opportunity. Especially when there are shortsighted and dramatic changes. Let's say there is a galactic empire that is now in major stress from the two snappenings, they're pissed and looking to take it out on Earth. Lots of potential


They were the original soap operas for boys and anyone with arrested development. But sure are fun. When you dive in, you go in kowing exact what they are and just go with the flow.
Persistent Turd is the shit.
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Reply #14 posted 04/28/19 10:32am

EmmaMcG

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OnlyNDaUsa said:



EmmaMcG said:


OnlyNDaUsa said:

wait... how do ages work? A 15 year old is sanaped comes back is he 15 or 20?



He is still 15. Again, this is explained and shown in the movie. I think you need to see it again. And this time, pay attention biggrin


i was speaking legally



Yeah, he's still 15. Legally, illegally and whatever else.
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Reply #15 posted 04/28/19 10:54am

OnlyNDaUsa

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EmmaMcG said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

i was speaking legally

Yeah, he's still 15. Legally, illegally and whatever else.

my point is more of a social implication... how do they determine who is who?

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #16 posted 04/28/19 10:59am

onlyforaminute

I'm still trying to find our if hawkeye's children aged. His daughter seemed preteen when she disappeared but looked like a teenager when she came back. Seems she's being setup to be a part of the new younger Avengers
Year of Return 2019
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Reply #17 posted 04/28/19 11:18am

EmmaMcG

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OnlyNDaUsa said:



EmmaMcG said:


OnlyNDaUsa said:



i was speaking legally



Yeah, he's still 15. Legally, illegally and whatever else.


my point is more of a social implication... how do they determine who is who?




Do you even know what you mean by that? Who is who? Everyone is the same people they've always been.
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Reply #18 posted 04/28/19 11:20am

EmmaMcG

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onlyforaminute said:

I'm still trying to find our if hawkeye's children aged. His daughter seemed preteen when she disappeared but looked like a teenager when she came back. Seems she's being setup to be a part of the new younger Avengers


Watch the movie again. She's the same age. No time has passed for the people who died in the snap. The movie explains all of this. I don't know what is so hard to understand about that.
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Reply #19 posted 04/28/19 11:37am

onlyforaminute

EmmaMcG said:

onlyforaminute said:

I'm still trying to find our if hawkeye's children aged. His daughter seemed preteen when she disappeared but looked like a teenager when she came back. Seems she's being setup to be a part of the new younger Avengers


Watch the movie again. She's the same age. No time has passed for the people who died in the snap. The movie explains all of this. I don't know what is so hard to understand about that.

Ok, I figured I'd have to see it again to see things i didn't pay attention to the 1st time around, that's what through me off i saw her as younger in the beginning of the movie. How could spidey not age but she did, since that's not the case then the explanation holds.
Year of Return 2019
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Reply #20 posted 04/28/19 11:49am

OnlyNDaUsa

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it seems to be a flop! It only made $350 in the US with $859 outside the US...

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #21 posted 04/28/19 12:42pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

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This was a very bad year for box office so far, but Marvel/Disney/Lucasfilm alone will make up for, and make it one of the biggest ever. One company will make all the profits this year.
Persistent Turd is the shit.
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Reply #22 posted 04/28/19 1:25pm

2freaky4church
1

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Sick capitalist dreck made a billion dollars.

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #23 posted 04/28/19 2:27pm

onlyforaminute

I just gotta say it. RDJ looked skinnier than usual and i don't see he's worked many projects outside of Avengers.
Year of Return 2019
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Reply #24 posted 04/28/19 3:39pm

EmmaMcG

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onlyforaminute said:

EmmaMcG said:



Watch the movie again. She's the same age. No time has passed for the people who died in the snap. The movie explains all of this. I don't know what is so hard to understand about that.

Ok, I figured I'd have to see it again to see things i didn't pay attention to the 1st time around, that's what through me off i saw her as younger in the beginning of the movie. How could spidey not age but she did, since that's not the case then the explanation holds.


I've seen it twice already myself and in fairness, there was a few things I noticed the second time that I didn't notice the first time.
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Reply #25 posted 04/28/19 3:45pm

EmmaMcG

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Ugot2shakesumthin said:

This was a very bad year for box office so far, but Marvel/Disney/Lucasfilm alone will make up for, and make it one of the biggest ever. One company will make all the profits this year.


Captain Marvel made over a billion. Endgame has already made over a billion and will likely make over 2 when all is said and done. And Disney still have Frozen 2, Toy Story 4, The Lion King and Star Wars Episode 9 to come this year. And all of those movies are likely to make over a billion. Then you've also got Aladdin, which will make a lot. If not a billion, it won't be far off. Great year for Mickey and Co.
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Reply #26 posted 04/28/19 5:24pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

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EmmaMcG said:

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

This was a very bad year for box office so far, but Marvel/Disney/Lucasfilm alone will make up for, and make it one of the biggest ever. One company will make all the profits this year.


Captain Marvel made over a billion. Endgame has already made over a billion and will likely make over 2 when all is said and done. And Disney still have Frozen 2, Toy Story 4, The Lion King and Star Wars Episode 9 to come this year. And all of those movies are likely to make over a billion. Then you've also got Aladdin, which will make a lot. If not a billion, it won't be far off. Great year for Mickey and Co.


Buying Marvel, Pixar, Lucasfilm and now Fox is paying off big time. Whatever Disney is paying Bob Iger has been money well spent. Heck, Disney owes its current state of affairs to Iger.
Persistent Turd is the shit.
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Reply #27 posted 04/28/19 5:40pm

OnlyNDaUsa

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EmmaMcG said:

Ugot2shakesumthin said:
This was a very bad year for box office so far, but Marvel/Disney/Lucasfilm alone will make up for, and make it one of the biggest ever. One company will make all the profits this year.
Captain Marvel made over a billion. Endgame has already made over a billion and will likely make over 2 when all is said and done. And Disney still have Frozen 2, Toy Story 4, The Lion King and Star Wars Episode 9 to come this year. And all of those movies are likely to make over a billion. Then you've also got Aladdin, which will make a lot. If not a billion, it won't be far off. Great year for Mickey and Co.

Endgame could make 2 billon outside the US and be the first to break a Billion domestic.

It has a real shot at beating all records.


However, I will guess this weekend is about 40% of its final... it 3 hour run time may reduce repeat views.

maybe 800 Million US and another 1,600 Million World Wide for a total of 2.4 Billion or #2 domestice and World Wide...

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #28 posted 04/28/19 7:51pm

728huey

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EmmaMcG said:

onlyforaminute said:
I'm still trying to find our if hawkeye's children aged. His daughter seemed preteen when she disappeared but looked like a teenager when she came back. Seems she's being setup to be a part of the new younger Avengers
Watch the movie again. She's the same age. No time has passed for the people who died in the snap. The movie explains all of this. I don't know what is so hard to understand about that.


All of the people who were dusted off when Thanos made the snap returned to their past selves just before the snap when Hulk snapped them back to life. The reason 2018 Loki, Heimdall, Vision, 2018 Gamora, and Black Widow did not return when Hulk made the snap back was because they were killed physically and not cosmically by Thanos. And when Peter Quill went to kiss 2014 Gamora, remember that the 2014 version of Gamora hated Quill and wanted to kick the crap out of him.

typing

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Reply #29 posted 04/28/19 8:39pm

onlyforaminute

OnlyNDaUsa said:



EmmaMcG said:


Ugot2shakesumthin said:
This was a very bad year for box office so far, but Marvel/Disney/Lucasfilm alone will make up for, and make it one of the biggest ever. One company will make all the profits this year.

Captain Marvel made over a billion. Endgame has already made over a billion and will likely make over 2 when all is said and done. And Disney still have Frozen 2, Toy Story 4, The Lion King and Star Wars Episode 9 to come this year. And all of those movies are likely to make over a billion. Then you've also got Aladdin, which will make a lot. If not a billion, it won't be far off. Great year for Mickey and Co.



Endgame could make 2 billon outside the US and be the first to break a Billion domestic.

It has a real shot at beating all records.


However, I will guess this weekend is about 40% of its final... it 3 hour run time may reduce repeat views.

maybe 800 Million US and another 1,600 Million World Wide for a total of 2.4 Billion or #2 domestice and World Wide...




All i know is I've never been to the theater where dolby, imax, real 3d, and all digital screens were all soldout at once, until now.
Year of Return 2019
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