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Thread started 02/07/18 8:59am

rogifan

Quincy Jones says Michael Jackson stole a lot of music

This interview eek

http://www.vulture.com/20...ation.html

You worked with Michael Jackson more than anyone he wasn’t related to. What’s something people don’t understand about him?
I hate to get into this publicly, but Michael stole a lot of stuff. He stole a lot of songs. [Donna Summer’s] “State of IndependenceOriginally written by Vangelis and longtime Yes front man Jon Anderson, “State of Independence” was recorded by Donna Summer in 1982. Jones produced Summer’s version, Michael Jackson helped out on backing vocals, and the song’s central riff does sound awfully similar (albeit faster) to the iconic bass riff on Jackson’s hit single “Billie Jean.” It should also be noted that, last year, Jones won a lawsuit over a royalties dispute against Jackson’s estate. ” and “Billie Jean.” The notes don’t lie, man. He was as Machiavellian as they come.

How so?
Greedy, man. Greedy. “Don’t Stop ’Til You Get Enough” — Greg Phillinganes wrote the c sectionPhillinganes, an in-demand studio keyboardist, played on a handful of Jackson-Jones collaborations, including the 1979 album Off the Wall, from which “Don’t Stop ‘Til You Get Enough” comes. . Michael should’ve given him 10 percent of the song. Wouldn’t do it.
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Reply #1 posted 02/07/18 9:03am

rogifan

eek

What’d you think when you first heard rock music?
Rock ain’t nothing but a white version of rhythm and blues, motherfucker. You know, I met Paul McCartney when he was 21.

What were your first impressions of the Beatles?
That they were the worst musicians in the world. They were no-playing motherfuckers. Paul was the worst bass player I ever heard. And Ringo? Don’t even talk about it. I remember once we were in the studio with George Martin, and Ringo had taken three hours for a four-bar thing he was trying to fix on a song. He couldn’t get it. We said, “Mate, why don’t you get some lager and lime, some shepherd’s pie, and take an hour-and-a-half and relax a little bit.” So he did, and we called Ronnie Verrell, a jazz drummer. Ronnie came in for 15 minutes and tore it up. Ringo comes back and says, “George, can you play it back for me one more time?” So George did, and Ringo says, “That didn’t sound so bad.” And I said, “Yeah, motherfucker because it ain’t you.” Great guy, though.
Paisley Park is in your heart
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Reply #2 posted 02/07/18 9:05am

2freaky4church
1

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Prince did as well.

"My motherfucker's so cool sheep count him."
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Reply #3 posted 02/07/18 9:12am

RJOrion

alot of people mad at Q for telling these stories, and some calling him liar... but the man has seen and done it all...with anybody who's ever been anybody in the entertainment industry, in the last 50 years...at 84 years old, why would he be anything but honest?...he probably should be keeping this stuff to his self (for his own personal safety), but the shit he is saying is some compelling, and sometimes fascinating stuff...and its really nothing new with him, he's always been a diva...keep goin, Q
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Reply #4 posted 02/07/18 9:14am

RJOrion

2freaky4church1 said:

Prince did as well.




they ALL did/do...Thats The Way Of The World...ask Maurice...
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Reply #5 posted 02/07/18 9:22am

SoulAlive

rogifan said:

[/b]I hate to get into this publicly, but Michael stole a lot of stuff. He stole a lot of songs. [Donna Summer’s] “State of IndependenceOriginally written by Vangelis and longtime Yes front man Jon Anderson, “State of Independence” was recorded by Donna Summer in 1982. Jones produced Summer’s version, Michael Jackson helped out on backing vocals, and the song’s central riff does sound awfully similar (albeit faster) to the iconic bass riff on Jackson’s hit single “Billie Jean.”

hmmm I really don't hear much of a similarity between "State Of Independence" and "Billie Jean".In any case,Quincy produced both songs so wouldn't that make him guilty of stealing the music? lol

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Reply #6 posted 02/07/18 10:14am

TrivialPursuit

2freaky4church1 said:

Prince did as well.


That was my first thought. Prince stole so much from Sly, Santana, Graham Central Station, Earth Wind & Fire, and James Brown. So much of that start n' stop call outs (evident a lot on the Hit n' Run Tour during the "Raspberry Beret" - "Automatic" section), the fills, etc., are all from other sources. The more you dig back into older soul & R&B and funk music, you start to hear things and think "Wait, that's on a Prince song!" Yeah, well it was somewhere else first. (Let's not forget that had it not been for those older artists, Prince wouldn't have had shit to play in the 90s when he disavowed his WB catalog until his contract was up and he only played those artists songs; the aftershow in Belgium is a good example of that.)

Picasso said, "a good artist borrows, a great artist steals", meaning they can copy something and it seems familiar. Or they can take something and totally recreate it. Frankly, MJ & Prince did both. The question here is how forgiving are fans when they say "he took it to another level" vs "he's just a copy cat!". We hear naysayers saying Timberlake copied Prince or is an MJ wannabe, but yet Prince owes at least 1/3 of his music to his mentors like Sly, James, Santana, Graham, and the like and we hear "wow, but he really took their music to a new level!". It's perspective.

Quincy would probably be hard-pressed to say other artists he's produced had not stolen ideas as well. He's only stating what is true about many, whether it's MJ or someone else.

This experience will cover courtship, sex, commitment, fetishes, loneliness, vindication, love, and hate.
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Reply #7 posted 02/07/18 10:32am

novabrkr

Funny, Michael himself thought that he had stolen the bassline of "Billie Jean" from Hall & Oates. He even apologized Hall personally, but Hall didn't think the basslines were even nearly the same.

Well, someone stole the bassline from Rick James' "Give It To Me Baby" for the title track on Thriller. Wasn't Michael, was it Quincy? Rod Temperton?

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Reply #8 posted 02/07/18 10:33am

purple05

Quincy is stretching the truth.
I could’ve sworn hall & oats said MJ said he borrowed from them in BJ and they said fine, because borrowed from somewhere else.

Greg P discussed the issue with DSTYGE. He added a small section, hence the 10% Quincy mentioned. Greg was compensated but just not with publishing as a writer. He didn’t seem bitter about it.

He is always so negative when it comes to MJ. I’m sure there were some nice stories he could e shared
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Reply #9 posted 02/07/18 10:41am

Goddess4Real

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Overall it was a pretty vicious interview (trashing alot of people except his good buddy Cosby )...Also have you noticed that most of the people he has trashed are dead and can't defend themselves? I wonder if it's aged related? Quincy reminds me of my grandfather who is 86, by the way he has been behaving lately....Very sad indeed.
[Edited 2/7/18 10:54am]
[Edited 2/7/18 11:42am]
[Edited 2/7/18 11:47am]
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Reply #10 posted 02/07/18 11:57am

bashraka

Goddess4Real said:

Overall it was a pretty vicious interview (trashing alot of people except his good buddy Cosby )...Also have you noticed that most of the people he has trashed are dead and can't defend themselves? I wonder if it's aged related? Quincy reminds me of my grandfather who is 86, by the way he has been behaving lately....Very sad indeed. [Edited 2/7/18 10:54am] [Edited 2/7/18 11:42am] [Edited 2/7/18 11:47am]

I also have noticed that most of the people he has been so candid about in these two interviews are no longer alive to confirm or deny his verison of events concerning circumstances that were mentioned. It's cowardly. Quincy Jones is beyond legendary as a composer, arranger, producer and overall music impresario and many of his takes on music-particularly the roots of rock 'n roll I agree with. But I take many of his recollections involving his interpersonal relationships from Marvin Gaye, Richard Pryor, Prince etc. I take with a grain of salt. I don't know if he's lying as much as exaggerating.

3121 #1 THIS YEAR
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Reply #11 posted 02/07/18 12:02pm

Goddess4Real

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Mike Smallcombe
‏@mikesmallcombe1
3h3 hours ago

There’s a very telling interview here, in which Jon Anderson says Michael and Quincy Jones listened to his album together, and took inspiration. Yet Q is blaming Michael solely.

Jon Anderson on how Vangelis album inspired Thriller http://teamrock.com/news/...d-thriller

Exclusive: Jon Anderson recalls Michael Jackson producer copying Friends Of Mr Cairo riffs
Jon Anderson has recalled how the 1981 album The Friends Of Mr Cairo which he produced with composer Vangelis inspired Michael Jackson's smash hit album Thriller.

The former Yes man claims that producer Quincy Jones told him that he and Jackson took a guitar riff from the record and "made it funky" for the 1982 hit Billie Jean.

Anderson tells the new issue of Prog magazine: "The luck of the draw, I met Vangelis – a very different kind of musician, who started the trend of electronic music. Over the 80s we were evolving musically, not thinking about what was hip or what was good business.

"There's my classic story of how we inspired Michael Jackson's Thriller. Quincy Jones told me that he and Michael had been listening to our album, The Friends Of Mr Cairo.

"They took the riff and made it funky for Billie Jean. Quincy said he'd been recording our song State Of Independence with Donna Summer, and I said he had an incredible guy singing backing vocals.

"He said, 'That guy was Michael – we were both digging your album.' So that's kinda cool, that cross-pollination in music."

Jon Anderson will be presented with the Prog God prize the 2016 Progressive Music Awards, held at London's Underglobe venue on September 1.
[Edited 2/7/18 15:21pm]
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Reply #12 posted 02/07/18 12:13pm

OperatingTheta
n

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I have no issue with honesty, but he's sounding increasingly bitter and insulting in recent interviews.

Dare I say, cantankerous?
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Reply #13 posted 02/07/18 12:20pm

QueenofPurpleP
alace

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I can't stand Quincy and messy self. As far the music, that much isn't of a secret considering MJ has made many statements on where he gets his beats and stuff from.

Examples such as: Billie Jean, Can't let her get away, Butterflies, She's got it, etc.

Nothing is really original, the creativity kicks in to show where can you take it or make out of it. Like I adored JT when he first made his solo career and yeah I saw the similarties in the dance moves, falsettos, and the hard hitting Timberland beats but they were forgivable because he seemed to be genuine. My only problem steems from the fact that he loves to play victim instead of facing the very same heat the artist he is inspired from instead of defending them.

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Reply #14 posted 02/07/18 12:24pm

Goddess4Real

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OperatingThetan said:

I have no issue with honesty, but he's sounding increasingly bitter and insulting in recent interviews.

Dare I say, cantankerous?


And vile with a selective memory. Someone needs to tell Quincy that Vitiligo was listed in MJ''s Autopsy Report!
[Edited 2/7/18 12:37pm]
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Reply #15 posted 02/07/18 2:12pm

purple05

QueenofPurplePalace said:

I can't stand Quincy and messy self. As far the music, that much isn't of a secret considering MJ has made many statements on where he gets his beats and stuff from.



Examples such as: Billie Jean, Can't let her get away, Butterflies, She's got it, etc.




Nothing is really original, the creativity kicks in to show where can you take it or make out of it. Like I adored JT when he first made his solo career and yeah I saw the similarties in the dance moves, falsettos, and the hard hitting Timberland beats but they were forgivable because he seemed to be genuine. My only problem steems from the fact that he loves to play victim instead of facing the very same heat the artist he is inspired from instead of defending them.




What are you talking about?
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Reply #16 posted 02/07/18 2:13pm

Phishanga

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Grumpy old man.

Hey loudmouth, shut the fuck up, right?
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Reply #17 posted 02/07/18 2:21pm

thesoulbrother

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About ten years ago I was talking to a radio veteran who worked closely with Michael. He told me then that Michael had stolen several of his hit songs and basically received credit for other people's work. I didn't want to believe it. Hmmm...

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Reply #18 posted 02/07/18 2:33pm

purple05

thesoulbrother said:

About ten years ago I was talking to a radio veteran who worked closely with Michael. He told me then that Michael had stolen several of his hit songs and basically received credit for other people's work. I didn't want to believe it. Hmmm...


Who is this person?
Where are they getting it from?
He probably heard it from Quincy.
The only songs where the credits are funny are
DSTYGE- Greg wrote a C section which is why Quincy says 10%. But outside of that the demo can be heard online
Stranger in Moscow- No proper demo has been released but brad forget his last name, comes up with more he help contribute to that song each time he tells the story
Speed Demon- It was a horn section that apparently Jerry Hay didn’t get credited for but he was compensated.

Outside of that where were people left off credits?
There are some cases where on Invincible and Dangerous(teddy stuff) where he probably received writing credit as an exchange for him recording the songs. Moreso on Invincible than Dangerous. But where are these hits that he ‘stole’?

I’m reading in another board that he helped write off the mask with Greg G but wasn’t credited. He should’ve gotten credit for you are not alone but didn’t.
It works both ways. They posted this as well.




Some who worked with Michael felt that having musicians execute his ideas was a form of cheating. One musician, who worked with Michael for over 15 years and will remain unnamed, said: “The problem with Michael is that he would often have musical secretaries. He would sit down with a musician and have them play parts he had in his head. If a musician played a certain part, Michael would then say, ‘No not like that’, and then when the musician played it differently, he would say, ‘Yeah like that, like that!’ On the musician’s part, this would sometimes be classed as writing.”
Another musician, who also worked with Michael for over 15 years, shares a similar view. “Sometimes what musicians would do for Michael would border on writing. Michael would sing a note to a musician, and he would play a chord, sometimes making writing decisions without getting credited for it.”

Matt Forger totally disagrees with this viewpoint. “These were situations where Michael worked with different people to help him realise his ideas; sometimes the people working with him contributed ideas as well,” he said. “It would have to be a case-by-case evaluation. I worked on many songs that Michael created from scratch. Others may have opinions of their own, but other people were not responsible for writing his hit songs. They may have played a part, but it was usually in support of him.”

Bill Bottrell is also in Michael’s corner. “Michael was better than most at knowing the difference between writing and everything else that goes on,” he said. “We split our compositions clearly and fairly.” After the creation of a demo Michael would then take it to the main studio, such as Westlake, where the session musicians would record a final musical track. Michael would then add his vocals. After this, it was a case of sweetening the track before the engineers (usually Bruce Swedien) mixed it.
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Reply #19 posted 02/07/18 3:09pm

Goddess4Real

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thesoulbrother said:

About ten years ago I was talking to a radio veteran who worked closely with Michael. He told me then that Michael had stolen several of his hit songs and basically received credit for other people's work. I didn't want to believe it. Hmmm...

hmmm What were the songs? Details pretty please headlp

[Edited 2/7/18 15:18pm]

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Reply #20 posted 02/07/18 3:16pm

Goddess4Real

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Quincy Jones got called out on being a thief on Soul Train around 23:34

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Reply #21 posted 02/07/18 3:23pm

TrivialPursuit

thesoulbrother said:

About ten years ago I was talking to a radio veteran who worked closely with Michael. He told me then that Michael had stolen several of his hit songs and basically received credit for other people's work. I didn't want to believe it. Hmmm...


Prince did the same shit. Maybe not as often as MJ, but more often, but he did. Don Batts has plenty of stories about that. I think all musicians do it to some extent. It's a slippery slope to make claims about that sort of thing.

As far as Q overall, I just read the interview. He's messy as fuck. It's a bit like his own version of Fire and Fury. LOL

This experience will cover courtship, sex, commitment, fetishes, loneliness, vindication, love, and hate.
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Reply #22 posted 02/07/18 3:33pm

214

What's wrong with Quincy, He sound so bitter, so full of anger.

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Reply #23 posted 02/07/18 3:42pm

paisleypark4

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214 said:

What's wrong with Quincy, He sound so bitter, so full of anger.

got no time for little kid games is all

Download all the shit hop that you can for your kids, neices, nephews, and their friends also. That will prevent them from going out and buying it and will prevent some shit hop sales. Every little bit helps - Andy
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Reply #24 posted 02/07/18 4:01pm

QueenofPurpleP
alace

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TrivialPursuit said:

thesoulbrother said:

About ten years ago I was talking to a radio veteran who worked closely with Michael. He told me then that Michael had stolen several of his hit songs and basically received credit for other people's work. I didn't want to believe it. Hmmm...


Prince did the same shit. Maybe not as often as MJ, but more often, but he did. Don Batts has plenty of stories about that. I think all musicians do it to some extent. It's a slippery slope to make claims about that sort of thing.

As far as Q overall, I just read the interview. He's messy as fuck. It's a bit like his own version of Fire and Fury. LOL

LOL Messy boots for no reason!

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Reply #25 posted 02/07/18 4:32pm

RJOrion

214 said:

What's wrong with Quincy, He sound so bitter, so full of anger.

at his age, people have no filter and can be brutally honest and tactless...add to that, his notorious ego, and lifetime of successes... and the fact that he's most likely sensing his mortality...

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Reply #26 posted 02/07/18 5:00pm

Goddess4Real

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Retweeted

<- Greg explains how he was given arrangement credit and not the 10% composing initially agreed upon, in detail but keep listening he says "I maintained a relationship with him ..."so I lost out on one end but what I gained I don't think anyone can replace"

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Reply #27 posted 02/07/18 5:05pm

cloveringold85

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rogifan said:

eek What’d you think when you first heard rock music? Rock ain’t nothing but a white version of rhythm and blues, motherfucker. You know, I met Paul McCartney when he was 21. What were your first impressions of the Beatles? That they were the worst musicians in the world. They were no-playing motherfuckers. Paul was the worst bass player I ever heard. And Ringo? Don’t even talk about it. I remember once we were in the studio with George Martin, and Ringo had taken three hours for a four-bar thing he was trying to fix on a song. He couldn’t get it. We said, “Mate, why don’t you get some lager and lime, some shepherd’s pie, and take an hour-and-a-half and relax a little bit.” So he did, and we called Ronnie Verrell, a jazz drummer. Ronnie came in for 15 minutes and tore it up. Ringo comes back and says, “George, can you play it back for me one more time?” So George did, and Ringo says, “That didn’t sound so bad.” And I said, “Yeah, motherfucker because it ain’t you.” Great guy, though.

.

This is some cray-cray mofo!! lol lol

Related image

"With love, honor, and respect for every living thing in the universe, separation ceases, and we all become one being, singing one song." - Prince Roger Nelson (1958-2016)
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Reply #28 posted 02/07/18 5:30pm

TrivialPursuit

Q claims Marlon Brando slept with a few folks, including Richard Pryor, Marvin Gaye, and James Baldwin.

Pryor's widow confirmed it earlier.

This experience will cover courtship, sex, commitment, fetishes, loneliness, vindication, love, and hate.
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Reply #29 posted 02/07/18 5:31pm

Goddess4Real

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1h1 hour ago

No disrespect to Quincy or Donna Summer - but MJ's Billie Jean might have a similar baseline to 'State of Independence' - but what MJ brought in terms of melody, lyrics and PERFORMANCE speaks for itself. A song is more than a bass line. There's a reason why Billie Jean is a hit.

53m53 minutes ago

Quincy Jones is an extraordinary talent, but one should never dismiss the sum of all parts of a collaboration. There is a reason the most commercially successful and historically significant album he produced is Thriller. Michael Jackson was a genius. They worked well together.

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