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Reply #90 posted 03/10/18 2:40pm

herb4

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pdiddy2011 said:

I haven't read all the replies...

However, what is most to "blame" for MJs massive popularity (vs Prince) was the Jackson 5. People saw the Jacksons, especially Michael, grow up before their eyes and saw his talent just continue to rise from a 5-year old boy. The Jackson Five was an international sensation and had mega-watt crossover appeal because Michael was so charming and charismatic as a child and the Jackson Five had such an inspirational story. Michael was like a part of everyone's story from everyone that was around from the late 60's through Thriller (a LONG time!).

Having said all that, Prince didn't even arrive at the party where MJ was already Mr. Popularity until about 12 - 15 years later. Purple Rain thrust Prince into superstardom for sure, but MJ had already started his fanatical following (which only increased) a dozen years before. Having said all that, Prince was hugely popular in the states from Purple Rain alone. A lot of fans of Purple Rain didn't follow him so much once he went independent. Casual fans weren't going to put in work to keep up with Prince.

[Edited 3/10/18 7:50am]

Another way of putting it, is that our PARENTS grew up with Jackson Five and MJ, but with Prince their KIDS were able to grab on to thier OWN thing, even though were close to the same age. I remember my step mother seeing Prince for the first time and asking "who's this guy think he is, Michael Jackson?"

Then you had Bruce, who seemed to stake out the white audience, especially the males. White GIRLS dug Prince and, while a lot of people liked Micheal Jackson, nobody wanted to fuck him. Oddly, at the time we're talking about, MJ was seen as the non threatening, less weird one. I wrote a freshman paper on it, "Compare 2 things that are simllar but different" and chose MJ vs. Prince, which I felt was apt, and argued that the main difference came down to not only musicianship but sexuality. I argued that MJ was "asexual" and then found out the hard way that my professor didn't know what that meant.

He wrote in his comments "don't you mean 'homosexual'"? I don't think he was trying to be funny. I honestly don't think he knew what I meant. Prince and Madonna OOZED raw sexuality. Springsteen was the blue collar working man. MJ was like a little kid that your parents watched grow up.

Prince was just this whole enitrely different animal. James Brown, Hendrix, Sly/Disco, funk and punk woven into some never before seen super creature with insane mystique and charisma. PLus, he was considered "dangerous".

[Edited 3/10/18 14:44pm]

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Reply #91 posted 03/10/18 3:33pm

Krystalkisses

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I can't really speak for the 80s as I was a child then but his music was on the radio frequently. But I remember he was considered X rated, if that makes sense like he was pornography or something. And I became a huge fan in 1993...and I got so much shit from classmates for liking him saying He's gay blah blah...he wears heels. I can't say he was revered for his musical ability sadly...at least among immature kids.
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Reply #92 posted 03/10/18 3:36pm

PeteSilas

how's a teacher get through college without understanding asexual? Mj wasn't but he wanted everyone to think he was, sad that that's what he had to do in america to make it that big. I always thought Prince was more artistic in his work but that MJ was no slouch with the art himself, thriller is artistic as fuck and so is off the wall, he's probably wierder than Prince with some of his music. I still say, when they make comparisons, or they say Prince stole MJ fans, which is somewhat true, Prince always kept us on our toes, putting out stuff, even b-sides were worth a listen and often better than most of his albums. Prince didn't steal me, Michael pretty much gave everyone up to him. The dynamics of america being what they are, Bruce had to be to counterbalance the two black superstars and then we had the groundbreaking sluttishness of madonna.

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Reply #93 posted 03/10/18 10:43pm

khill95

herb4 said:

pdiddy2011 said:

I haven't read all the replies...

However, what is most to "blame" for MJs massive popularity (vs Prince) was the Jackson 5. People saw the Jacksons, especially Michael, grow up before their eyes and saw his talent just continue to rise from a 5-year old boy. The Jackson Five was an international sensation and had mega-watt crossover appeal because Michael was so charming and charismatic as a child and the Jackson Five had such an inspirational story. Michael was like a part of everyone's story from everyone that was around from the late 60's through Thriller (a LONG time!).

Having said all that, Prince didn't even arrive at the party where MJ was already Mr. Popularity until about 12 - 15 years later. Purple Rain thrust Prince into superstardom for sure, but MJ had already started his fanatical following (which only increased) a dozen years before. Having said all that, Prince was hugely popular in the states from Purple Rain alone. A lot of fans of Purple Rain didn't follow him so much once he went independent. Casual fans weren't going to put in work to keep up with Prince.

[Edited 3/10/18 7:50am]

Another way of putting it, is that our PARENTS grew up with Jackson Five and MJ, but with Prince their KIDS were able to grab on to thier OWN thing, even though were close to the same age. I remember my step mother seeing Prince for the first time and asking "who's this guy think he is, Michael Jackson?"

Then you had Bruce, who seemed to stake out the white audience, especially the males. White GIRLS dug Prince and, while a lot of people liked Micheal Jackson, nobody wanted to fuck him. Oddly, at the time we're talking about, MJ was seen as the non threatening, less weird one. I wrote a freshman paper on it, "Compare 2 things that are simllar but different" and chose MJ vs. Prince, which I felt was apt, and argued that the main difference came down to not only musicianship but sexuality. I argued that MJ was "asexual" and then found out the hard way that my professor didn't know what that meant.

He wrote in his comments "don't you mean 'homosexual'"? I don't think he was trying to be funny. I honestly don't think he knew what I meant. Prince and Madonna OOZED raw sexuality. Springsteen was the blue collar working man. MJ was like a little kid that your parents watched grow up.

Prince was just this whole enitrely different animal. James Brown, Hendrix, Sly/Disco, funk and punk woven into some never before seen super creature with insane mystique and charisma. PLus, he was considered "dangerous".

[Edited 3/10/18 14:44pm]

Interesting perspective.

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Reply #94 posted 03/11/18 11:38am

coldasice

After 88 not at all
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Reply #95 posted 03/11/18 2:20pm

herb4

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coldasice said:

After 88 not at all

Batman, D&P, Musicology...? You're confusing "not AS popular" with "not popular at all". Everyone knew he was. Shit, he could have quit after SoTT and still been a legend.

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Reply #96 posted 03/11/18 3:45pm

pdiddy2011

To answer the question in another way, once Purple Rain dropped, the big question in the music industry was seriously asking is Prince "the king" or is Michael "the king". And this was around the time of the Thriller juggernaut. Purple Rain sales didn't come close, unless you count give or take 70 million albums close. But the overwhelming talent that everyone recognized with Purple Rain, made without a super producer (Quincy Jones), along with very solid previous albums that were "self-produced", made everyone take notice if they hadn't already. For a few solid years, in the US, it was Prince, MJ, Madonna, and the Boss. So Prince was, for a long while, one of at least the 4 most popular artists out there, if not number 1, depending on who you asked. I love Prince, but to say he was ever MORE popular than MJ might be taking my fandom to delirium.

On a side note, he and Madonna might have been back to the top two most popular by the time Musicology turned the industry upside down in 2004. And to be honest, the way EVERYONE has a private or secret or unheard Prince story, he might have climbed back near the top again by 2016. It seems like anyone who is anyone has a Prince story or private Prince teaching moment he gave them.

[Edited 3/11/18 15:51pm]

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Reply #97 posted 03/11/18 6:57pm

PeteSilas

herb4 said:

coldasice said:

After 88 not at all

Batman, D&P, Musicology...? You're confusing "not AS popular" with "not popular at all". Everyone knew he was. Shit, he could have quit after SoTT and still been a legend.

ya, that's why i made a distinction between album sales and who knew who he was. My old aunt and uncle asked me in 89 "what happened to him?" I explained that nothing happened, that he was as busy as ever, as artistic as ever but he just wasn't aiming for the pop audience like he was.

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Reply #98 posted 03/13/18 2:59am

james

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PeteSilas said:

herb4 said:

Batman, D&P, Musicology...? You're confusing "not AS popular" with "not popular at all". Everyone knew he was. Shit, he could have quit after SoTT and still been a legend.

ya, that's why i made a distinction between album sales and who knew who he was. My old aunt and uncle asked me in 89 "what happened to him?" I explained that nothing happened, that he was as busy as ever, as artistic as ever but he just wasn't aiming for the pop audience like he was.

I can understand asking in '99 "What happened to Prince?", but '89? ! ! Did they not hear Alphabet St all over the radio? And then Batdance/Partyman absolutely everywhere ?

.

He did something like 21 nights at Wembley Arena in '90.. So still pretty huge.

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Reply #99 posted 03/13/18 3:37am

JorisE73

james said:

PeteSilas said:

ya, that's why i made a distinction between album sales and who knew who he was. My old aunt and uncle asked me in 89 "what happened to him?" I explained that nothing happened, that he was as busy as ever, as artistic as ever but he just wasn't aiming for the pop audience like he was.

I can understand asking in '99 "What happened to Prince?", but '89? ! ! Did they not hear Alphabet St all over the radio? And then Batdance/Partyman absolutely everywhere ?

.

He did something like 21 nights at Wembley Arena in '90.. So still pretty huge.


Wow, Batman was HUGE in 1989, he was all over the place just like the movie. That summer was all Batman and Prince's soundtrack. 1990 was a pretty popular tour in Europe and 1991-1993 was all Prince again, he was all over the place during that time, had a couple of hits too and two pretty biug and awesome tours. From 1994 with the name chang thing everything started to fall even tho he had a hit with TMBGITW.

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Reply #100 posted 03/13/18 1:23pm

PeteSilas

james said:

PeteSilas said:

ya, that's why i made a distinction between album sales and who knew who he was. My old aunt and uncle asked me in 89 "what happened to him?" I explained that nothing happened, that he was as busy as ever, as artistic as ever but he just wasn't aiming for the pop audience like he was.

I can understand asking in '99 "What happened to Prince?", but '89? ! ! Did they not hear Alphabet St all over the radio? And then Batdance/Partyman absolutely everywhere ?

.

He did something like 21 nights at Wembley Arena in '90.. So still pretty huge.

you're misunderstanding dude, the kind of fame that he, michael and bruce had was the kind that would reach people like my aunt and uncle, people who did not listen to those kinds of stations or that kind of music, they would see prince on the enquirer in the PR years, they would hear their grandkids and nephews and nieces debate about how good or bad Prince was in comparison to so and so. that was over by 88. the kids moved on too, they weren't buying the followups for the most part, he was alienating so many of them with the music and the image, just getting further and further away from the pop darling he was. Like I quoted a couple times before, a guy who did his hair like PR Prince in 85 was saying he was "looking wierd" in 87.

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Reply #101 posted 03/13/18 1:28pm

PeteSilas

JorisE73 said:

james said:

I can understand asking in '99 "What happened to Prince?", but '89? ! ! Did they not hear Alphabet St all over the radio? And then Batdance/Partyman absolutely everywhere ?

.

He did something like 21 nights at Wembley Arena in '90.. So still pretty huge.


Wow, Batman was HUGE in 1989, he was all over the place just like the movie. That summer was all Batman and Prince's soundtrack. 1990 was a pretty popular tour in Europe and 1991-1993 was all Prince again, he was all over the place during that time, had a couple of hits too and two pretty biug and awesome tours. From 1994 with the name chang thing everything started to fall even tho he had a hit with TMBGITW.

Prince would do that when he'd hit a low point, he did it again after Graffiti Bridge flopped the following year and released Diamonds and Pearls which sold over 5 mill. Then it was pretty low sales up to the musicology comeback i think.

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Reply #102 posted 03/13/18 3:01pm

herb4

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Nobody sustains Prince level of "popularity" for very long but most sustain the fame. I think people are conflating the two terms, including myself, but Prince's "popularity" was extended and very impressive. Especially considering how often he released music, the mysterious games he played and two really bad movies he made.

Prince may have sold the most total albums in the entire 80's decade. I can't find hard numbers on it, but i suspect he must have. If anyone can list "Most Albulms Sold By Artists/Decade" I'd lvoe to see it. I can't think of anyone who might have sold more, even if based on just the quantity of his output alone. Controversy, 1999, PR, SoTT, Parade, Lovesexy, Batman...That's a shit ton of records sold. Even his "bombs" sold a lot by any rational standard.


https://tsort.info/music/...rtists.htm

I wouldn't be at all surprised if he did rule that decade overall sales wise and, even after that, D&P and Love Symbol did rather well too before the name change freaked everybody out and a new generation carved out grunge, alternative and hip hop for themselves.

Put it another way, in 1995, Stevie Wonder was FAMOUS. The Stones, Stevie Wonder, Beatles, Jimi, The Dead, Bowie, Prince, Madonna, Zappelin, Bruce, U2...even MJ...were FAMOUS. POPULAR is another matter and almost always centers around the 18-30 demographic who rabidly buy music and movies and attend shows. But Prince remained popular for a really fucking long time despite his best efforts to go underground.

In the 90's, he was FAMOUS, but he was approaching "old people famous".


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Reply #103 posted 03/13/18 3:16pm

PeteSilas

i doubt he was the bestselling of that 80's decade, one of the best sure but his first albums did not sell well although they were re-bought after the Purple Rain success, initially I think only 1999 had broken platinum. the Prince album came close, dirty mind sold gold and WB tried to give him his contract back (I wonder if he later wished he would have done that). the second half of the 80's albums were mixed results Atwiad sold like 3 or 4 mill, parade sold about a mill, maybe 2, sott sold about a mill, lovesexy went gold, batman went double platinum i think, but even all that put together wouldn't equal thriller's sales.

herb4 said:

Nobody sustains Prince level of "popularity" for very long but most sustain the fame. I think people are conflating the two terms, including myself, but Prince's "popularity" was extended and very impressive. Especially considering how often he released music, the mysterious games he played and two really bad movies he made.

Prince may have sold the most total albums in the entire 80's decade. I can't find hard numbers on it, but i suspect he must have. If anyone can list "Most Albulms Sold By Artists/Decade" I'd lvoe to see it. I can't think of anyone who might have sold more, even if based on just the quantity of his output alone. Controversy, 1999, PR, SoTT, Parade, Lovesexy, Batman...That's a shit ton of records sold. Even his "bombs" sold a lot by any rational standard.


https://tsort.info/music/...rtists.htm

I wouldn't be at all surprised if he did rule that decade overall sales wise and, even after that, D&P and Love Symbol did rather well too before the name change freaked everybody out and a new generation carved out grunge, alternative and hip hop for themselves.

Put it another way, in 1995, Stevie Wonder was FAMOUS. The Stones, Stevie Wonder, Beatles, Jimi, The Dead, Bowie, Prince, Madonna, Zappelin, Bruce, U2...even MJ...were FAMOUS. POPULAR is another matter and almost always centers around the 18-30 demographic who rabidly buy music and movies and attend shows. But Prince remained popular for a really fucking long time despite his best efforts to go underground.

In the 90's, he was FAMOUS, but he was approaching "old people famous".


Prince.org: With fans like these he didn't need haters.
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Reply #104 posted 03/13/18 3:58pm

herb4

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PeteSilas said:

i doubt he was the bestselling of that 80's decade, one of the best sure but his first albums did not sell well although they were re-bought after the Purple Rain success, initially I think only 1999 had broken platinum.



Prince may have sold the most total albums in the entire 80's decade.
https://tsort.info/music/...rtists.htm




It wouldn't surprise me at all if his TOTAL sales were #1.

He had an album every year and none of this is even counting Sheila E, the Family or the Time either.

I'd be curious to find out.

Bruce, Madonna, MJ and U2 sold a lot but put out fewer records, probably by half. Bon Jovi, The Police and some metal bands moved some records. But I'm sitting here thinking about it and having a really rough time coming up with someone who could have beat him over the entire decade.

I'll poke around but my Google Fu is failing me. Finding a lot of "best selling albums" lists for that decade but none that break it down for the 80's only by artist. 1999 and Purple Rain are in the top 100 and MANY SINGLE albums sold more but adding them all up I can't see anyone topping him. Regardless, he was in the mix.

Also note I'm referring to albums sold, released or bought, ONLY IN THAT DECADE. Not over time or tabulated as of now. So I'm suggesting that it's entirely possible that from 1980 - 1990, amongst albums released and sold during that time, that Prince might very well be #1.


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Reply #105 posted 03/13/18 4:55pm

nonesuch

I was very much around in the 80's and witnessed the rise of Prince with suspicion for two reasons: a) everyone in school went to the movies to watch PR, even though most of them had absolutely no musical understanding whatsoever and b) I found myself bombarded constantly with THAT video and THAT song - you know what I'm talking about. It was to become Prince's I Just Called To Say I Love You and it still sounds pretty dull to me. What made him interesting to almost everybody not being into mainstream pop per se, was his total shift in style with Around The World In A Day. With that he became an instant favorite of those not having felt catered by mainstream pop. At least over here in Europe. People who were into Prince were also into Joe Jackson, Frank Zappa, Talking Heads, Pat Metheny and so forth. My pals and I never even dared to compare Prince to Jackson or Madonna or Springsteen or George Michael or whoever the next top seller was going to be. To me Prince singlehandedly re-defined Funk from 1985 til 1988 just like Stevie Wonder had re-defined Soul from 1971 til 1975. In those four years he was the hottest ticket in Europe. He made a lot of outcasts feel welcome and he proudly declared with a lot of moves he made, musically and artistically, that it was okay to be an individualist. Like Zappa had donme before him. Unfortunately Prince later turned into something dull again when he felt the need to include that stupid rapping into his music. Much later, I wish he would have released more guitar-solo-oriented music. He was near his peak as a guitarist when he passed away...

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Reply #106 posted 03/13/18 5:37pm

PeteSilas

i really doubt it but he was unquestionably the greatest pop artist of that decade.

herb4 said:

PeteSilas said:

i doubt he was the bestselling of that 80's decade, one of the best sure but his first albums did not sell well although they were re-bought after the Purple Rain success, initially I think only 1999 had broken platinum.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if his TOTAL sales were #1.

He had an album every year and none of this is even counting Sheila E, the Family or the Time either.

I'd be curious to find out.

Bruce, Madonna, MJ and U2 sold a lot but put out fewer records, probably by half. Bon Jovi, The Police and some metal bands moved some records. But I'm sitting here thinking about it and having a really rough time coming up with someone who could have beat him over the entire decade.

I'll poke around but my Google Fu is failing me. Finding a lot of "best selling albums" lists for that decade but none that break it down for the 80's only by artist. 1999 and Purple Rain are in the top 100 and MANY SINGLE albums sold more but adding them all up I can't see anyone topping him. Regardless, he was in the mix.

Also note I'm referring to albums sold, released or bought, ONLY IN THAT DECADE. Not over time or tabulated as of now. So I'm suggesting that it's entirely possible that from 1980 - 1990, amongst albums released and sold during that time, that Prince might very well be #1.


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Reply #107 posted 03/13/18 5:40pm

PeteSilas

nonesuch said:

I was very much around in the 80's and witnessed the rise of Prince with suspicion for two reasons: a) everyone in school went to the movies to watch PR, even though most of them had absolutely no musical understanding whatsoever and b) I found myself bombarded constantly with THAT video and THAT song - you know what I'm talking about. It was to become Prince's I Just Called To Say I Love You and it still sounds pretty dull to me. What made him interesting to almost everybody not being into mainstream pop per se, was his total shift in style with Around The World In A Day. With that he became an instant favorite of those not having felt catered by mainstream pop. At least over here in Europe. People who were into Prince were also into Joe Jackson, Frank Zappa, Talking Heads, Pat Metheny and so forth. My pals and I never even dared to compare Prince to Jackson or Madonna or Springsteen or George Michael or whoever the next top seller was going to be. To me Prince singlehandedly re-defined Funk from 1985 til 1988 just like Stevie Wonder had re-defined Soul from 1971 til 1975. In those four years he was the hottest ticket in Europe. He made a lot of outcasts feel welcome and he proudly declared with a lot of moves he made, musically and artistically, that it was okay to be an individualist. Like Zappa had donme before him. Unfortunately Prince later turned into something dull again when he felt the need to include that stupid rapping into his music. Much later, I wish he would have released more guitar-solo-oriented music. He was near his peak as a guitarist when he passed away...

he wasn't playing guitar for the period before his death, or that's what he said.

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Reply #108 posted 03/14/18 8:52am

Astasheiks

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nonesuch said:

I was very much around in the 80's and witnessed the rise of Prince with suspicion for two reasons: a) everyone in school went to the movies to watch PR, even though most of them had absolutely no musical understanding whatsoever and b) I found myself bombarded constantly with THAT video and THAT song - you know what I'm talking about. It was to become Prince's I Just Called To Say I Love You and it still sounds pretty dull to me. What made him interesting to almost everybody not being into mainstream pop per se, was his total shift in style with Around The World In A Day. With that he became an instant favorite of those not having felt catered by mainstream pop. At least over here in Europe. People who were into Prince were also into Joe Jackson, Frank Zappa, Talking Heads, Pat Metheny and so forth. My pals and I never even dared to compare Prince to Jackson or Madonna or Springsteen or George Michael or whoever the next top seller was going to be. To me Prince singlehandedly re-defined Funk from 1985 til 1988 just like Stevie Wonder had re-defined Soul from 1971 til 1975. In those four years he was the hottest ticket in Europe. He made a lot of outcasts feel welcome and he proudly declared with a lot of moves he made, musically and artistically, that it was okay to be an individualist. Like Zappa had donme before him. Unfortunately Prince later turned into something dull again when he felt the need to include that stupid rapping into his music. Much later, I wish he would have released more guitar-solo-oriented music. He was near his peak as a guitarist when he passed away...

"Stupid Rapping" hhhhmmm Its not stupid to Black Folks! razz lol

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Reply #109 posted 03/14/18 10:44am

rapper

He was huge where I lived in New England up until Raspberry Beret was released. Hair bands were big (and probably still are) in NE and the album Purple Rain faired very well. I remember his popularity declining and I used to get teased about his music once ATWIAD came out. I was in 7th grade and the only fan I knew.

[Edited 3/14/18 10:45am]

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Reply #110 posted 03/14/18 11:55am

NorthC

When we talk about popularity and sales figures in the 1980s, a band we shouldn't forget is Dire Straits. They didn't make the tabloids, they didn't get rave reviews, they didn't cause controversy, they're not going to go down in history as an influential or ground-breaking band, but they sold like hotcakes. They were the kind of band that was popular with the common, ordinary people.
I may disagree with everything you say, but I will defend your right to say it.
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Reply #111 posted 03/14/18 12:47pm

PeteSilas

NorthC said:

When we talk about popularity and sales figures in the 1980s, a band we shouldn't forget is Dire Straits. They didn't make the tabloids, they didn't get rave reviews, they didn't cause controversy, they're not going to go down in history as an influential or ground-breaking band, but they sold like hotcakes. They were the kind of band that was popular with the common, ordinary people.

ya they did, easy to overlook how big they were.

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Reply #112 posted 03/14/18 2:45pm

nonesuch

Astasheiks said:

nonesuch said:

I was very much around in the 80's and witnessed the rise of Prince with suspicion for two reasons: a) everyone in school went to the movies to watch PR, even though most of them had absolutely no musical understanding whatsoever and b) I found myself bombarded constantly with THAT video and THAT song - you know what I'm talking about. It was to become Prince's I Just Called To Say I Love You and it still sounds pretty dull to me. What made him interesting to almost everybody not being into mainstream pop per se, was his total shift in style with Around The World In A Day. With that he became an instant favorite of those not having felt catered by mainstream pop. At least over here in Europe. People who were into Prince were also into Joe Jackson, Frank Zappa, Talking Heads, Pat Metheny and so forth. My pals and I never even dared to compare Prince to Jackson or Madonna or Springsteen or George Michael or whoever the next top seller was going to be. To me Prince singlehandedly re-defined Funk from 1985 til 1988 just like Stevie Wonder had re-defined Soul from 1971 til 1975. In those four years he was the hottest ticket in Europe. He made a lot of outcasts feel welcome and he proudly declared with a lot of moves he made, musically and artistically, that it was okay to be an individualist. Like Zappa had donme before him. Unfortunately Prince later turned into something dull again when he felt the need to include that stupid rapping into his music. Much later, I wish he would have released more guitar-solo-oriented music. He was near his peak as a guitarist when he passed away...

"Stupid Rapping" hhhhmmm Its not stupid to Black Folks! razz lol

Alright, Prince really mattered when he started rapping or had the evenly talented other "rappers" rap on his records. But the best ist yet to come: His backwards rapping on an unreleased battle rap-triple-album that had been produced by Tony M.

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Reply #113 posted 03/14/18 3:33pm

Prianna

HE PUT MPLS ON THE MAP

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Reply #114 posted 03/14/18 4:02pm

herb4

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Astasheiks said:

nonesuch said:

I was very much around in the 80's and witnessed the rise of Prince with suspicion for two reasons: a) everyone in school went to the movies to watch PR, even though most of them had absolutely no musical understanding whatsoever and b) I found myself bombarded constantly with THAT video and THAT song - you know what I'm talking about. It was to become Prince's I Just Called To Say I Love You and it still sounds pretty dull to me. What made him interesting to almost everybody not being into mainstream pop per se, was his total shift in style with Around The World In A Day. With that he became an instant favorite of those not having felt catered by mainstream pop. At least over here in Europe. People who were into Prince were also into Joe Jackson, Frank Zappa, Talking Heads, Pat Metheny and so forth. My pals and I never even dared to compare Prince to Jackson or Madonna or Springsteen or George Michael or whoever the next top seller was going to be. To me Prince singlehandedly re-defined Funk from 1985 til 1988 just like Stevie Wonder had re-defined Soul from 1971 til 1975. In those four years he was the hottest ticket in Europe. He made a lot of outcasts feel welcome and he proudly declared with a lot of moves he made, musically and artistically, that it was okay to be an individualist. Like Zappa had donme before him. Unfortunately Prince later turned into something dull again when he felt the need to include that stupid rapping into his music. Much later, I wish he would have released more guitar-solo-oriented music. He was near his peak as a guitarist when he passed away...

"Stupid Rapping" hhhhmmm Its not stupid to Black Folks! razz lol

There's a disturbingly large segment of his fan base that absolutely HATES that element of his music. Not saying his rap stuff was the best, but there seem to be a lot of folks that dislike it to a disproportionate degree. That even exends into his funkier and dancable stuff.

It's not everyone but it's there.

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Reply #115 posted 03/14/18 4:17pm

PeteSilas

i was listening to way back home, no one criticized his rapping in their the song was great.

Prince.org: With fans like these he didn't need haters.
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Reply #116 posted 03/14/18 4:25pm

fortuneandsere
ndipity

nonesuch said:

I was very much around in the 80's and witnessed the rise of Prince with suspicion for two reasons: a) everyone in school went to the movies to watch PR, even though most of them had absolutely no musical understanding whatsoever and b) I found myself bombarded constantly with THAT video and THAT song - you know what I'm talking about. It was to become Prince's I Just Called To Say I Love You and it still sounds pretty dull to me. What made him interesting to almost everybody not being into mainstream pop per se, was his total shift in style with Around The World In A Day. With that he became an instant favorite of those not having felt catered by mainstream pop. At least over here in Europe. People who were into Prince were also into Joe Jackson, Frank Zappa, Talking Heads, Pat Metheny and so forth. My pals and I never even dared to compare Prince to Jackson or Madonna or Springsteen or George Michael or whoever the next top seller was going to be. To me Prince singlehandedly re-defined Funk from 1985 til 1988 just like Stevie Wonder had re-defined Soul from 1971 til 1975. In those four years he was the hottest ticket in Europe. He made a lot of outcasts feel welcome and he proudly declared with a lot of moves he made, musically and artistically, that it was okay to be an individualist. Like Zappa had donme before him. Unfortunately Prince later turned into something dull again when he felt the need to include that stupid rapping into his music. Much later, I wish he would have released more guitar-solo-oriented music. He was near his peak as a guitarist when he passed away...


I knew this P fan who said back in the 80s every P album release was a big event. Big as in the World Cup, or Michael Jackson big, but the difference being it was an annual event in P's case. Are there any 'oldies' who can back this up I wonder hmmm


Interesting your comparison with Zappa. I think late period Prince is superior to late Zappa (though I've not yet heard Zappa's MANY 80s guitar albums), and for that matter late period Bowie, Dylan. Later music careers I think are a big challenge for these guys. Zappa and Bowie took too many risks, and it could sound chaotic, whereas Dylan played it too safe. Stevie Wonder was another for me who was just treading water, but he almost shouldn't stand comparison because 25/26 is a crazy young age for someone to make their last really decent album, with that much talent.


Madonna, Springsteen, George Michael are all third rate but I like some of their songs. I guess I need to work on being less opinionated neutral

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Reply #117 posted 03/14/18 4:46pm

nonesuch

fortuneandserendipity said:

nonesuch said:

I was very much around in the 80's and witnessed the rise of Prince with suspicion for two reasons: a) everyone in school went to the movies to watch PR, even though most of them had absolutely no musical understanding whatsoever and b) I found myself bombarded constantly with THAT video and THAT song - you know what I'm talking about. It was to become Prince's I Just Called To Say I Love You and it still sounds pretty dull to me. What made him interesting to almost everybody not being into mainstream pop per se, was his total shift in style with Around The World In A Day. With that he became an instant favorite of those not having felt catered by mainstream pop. At least over here in Europe. People who were into Prince were also into Joe Jackson, Frank Zappa, Talking Heads, Pat Metheny and so forth. My pals and I never even dared to compare Prince to Jackson or Madonna or Springsteen or George Michael or whoever the next top seller was going to be. To me Prince singlehandedly re-defined Funk from 1985 til 1988 just like Stevie Wonder had re-defined Soul from 1971 til 1975. In those four years he was the hottest ticket in Europe. He made a lot of outcasts feel welcome and he proudly declared with a lot of moves he made, musically and artistically, that it was okay to be an individualist. Like Zappa had donme before him. Unfortunately Prince later turned into something dull again when he felt the need to include that stupid rapping into his music. Much later, I wish he would have released more guitar-solo-oriented music. He was near his peak as a guitarist when he passed away...


I knew this P fan who said back in the 80s every P album release was a big event. Big as in the World Cup, or Michael Jackson big, but the difference being it was an annual event in P's case. Are there any 'oldies' who can back this up I wonder hmmm


Interesting your comparison with Zappa. I think late period Prince is superior to late Zappa (though I've not yet heard Zappa's MANY 80s guitar albums), and for that matter late period Bowie, Dylan. Later music careers I think are a big challenge for these guys. Zappa and Bowie took too many risks, and it could sound chaotic, whereas Dylan played it too safe. Stevie Wonder was another for me who was just treading water, but he almost shouldn't stand comparison because 25/26 is a crazy young age for someone to make their last really decent album, with that much talent.


Madonna, Springsteen, George Michael are all third rate but I like some of their songs. I guess I need to work on being less opinionated neutral

I did not intend to compare Frank with Prince. Therefore I would never dare to state that either of them were "superior". Matter of fact is that Frank had his contemporary classical compositions perfomerd in packed concert houses in Europe, which somehow sadly seemed like a final confirmation for a man who considered himself to be a composer first and foremost.

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Reply #118 posted 03/16/18 4:00am

SPzzz

I was in my 20's and 30's when Prince was coming up and rose to greatness. However, he struck me wrong in the 1980's because I saw the movie "Purple Rain" and didnot like the domestic violence scenes that were in the movie. It reminded me of my own domestic violence I was going thru back then and he actually kinda scared me off from him......

It's crazy man, I now wish I would have delved deeper into him and tried to find out truths instead of all the stuff in "Purple Rain" how "that was his real story" ...alot of people referred to "Purple Rain" as his life story. You know, that movie "Purple Rain" messed up alot of peoples minds about him in his early days.

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Reply #119 posted 03/16/18 10:46am

mediumdry

james said:

I can understand asking in '99 "What happened to Prince?", but '89? ! ! Did they not hear Alphabet St all over the radio? And then Batdance/Partyman absolutely everywhere ?

.

He did something like 21 nights at Wembley Arena in '90.. So still pretty huge.

well...in 88 I heard Lovesexy and after throwing the cd (it was the first time the cd was released before the lp) across the room, I wondered what the hell happened to Prince. He never fully recovered from that unfortunate episode.

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Forums > Prince: Music and More > People who were around in the 80's; How popular was Prince?